excavating a pond

[MatthewF]

Hi, I posted in the introductions forum and am now posting my first thread.

I bought a home and found that in the corner of the yard there was a set of 3 small ponds that had been filled with rocks and plants had overgrown. My kids and I pulled back the plants and pulled all the rocks out and cleaned the ponds out a little. We love the idea of having a set of ponds / water feature and want to make it all work without really knowing where to get started. I don't know if fish would work in these small ponds. If they would that would be cool too.

The material of the ponds seems to be concrete around rocks. I think the look is very nice.

I've attached some pics of each pond though they are really hard to get a good picture of. Because of the trees the pictures are a little too close.

Here are the dimensions:
The bottom pond at its widest is 6'x5'. This pond is the biggest of the three in terms of how much water it holds. At its deepest it is just less than 2.5'. If you measure from the top of the white pipe which is visible in the pic then it is 16" deep. The deeper part of the bottom pond is an oval that is 2'x2.5' . The middle pool is about 16-18" deep at deepest and is 3'4"x3'6" at its widest. I think it holds the second most water. The top pool also is 16" deep at its deepest but is overall shallower and I think holds the least water. It is 3'10" by 4' at its widest areas. All three ponds slope down toward the center of the pond.

The first question I have is around a pump.

I am confused about is what the purpose of the hose in the bottom pool connected to the pvc pipe and can't tell where a pump used to be connected. As you can see in the pic the pvc pipe goes right into the rock/concrete in the bottom pool. Something similar comes out in the top pool. That is in the bottom right of the top pool pic. I don't think there is a box in between it is odd that on the bottom pool it goes in pointing off to the left and at the top pool it comes out on the right side.

I haven't tried taking the hose off of the bottom pvc pipe. How do you suggest I go about hooking up a pump? Once I do that and fill it with water, what suggestions do you have for my next project?

Thanks in advance for advice!

Pics:
Top pond:

Middle pond:

bottom pond

 

[Meyer Jordan]

Are these three (3) ponds interconnected?
More photos from various angles would surely help.

 

[MatthewF]

Yes they are connected in the sense that the top pond flows into the middle which flows into the bottom. Sorry for the poor quality photos. Here is another try.

This photo shows how they are surrounded by trees.

This photo uses the panorama feature. It worked out well for showing how they are connected. Also you can see some of the rocks we pulled out of the ponds off to the right side of the photo.

 

[RobAmy]

Looks like they just put a submerged pump in the bottom pool hooked directly to that tube which pushed the water out that top PVC tube. This will a create a water feature simple loop design.

 

[MatthewF]

Thanks RobAmy. Sounds like my next step is to buy a submerged pump and figure out how to attach it to the pvc pipe in the bottom pond. If anyone else has any tips on that or anything else I should be doing to make it nice, I appreciate the advice. Thanks!

 

[sissy]

make sure it is solid and does not leak because you don't want to burn out a new pump .Hopefully the pvc is not crack any place under the concrete .

 

[MatthewF]

Hi Sissy, Thanks for your reply. i want to make sure I understand. On this:
>make sure it is solid and does not leak
do you mean make sure the concrete is solid and doesn't leak?

 

[sissy]

Yes as concrete can crack any any hairline cracks will leak .Your best thing is to fill watch with water and see if it runs out and after you get your pump watch it closely for the first couple of hours to make sure the connections between the ponds is not leaking or over flowing the sides and also to see if the pvc pipe under the cement is not cracked .I have even seen cement erode away pvc after awhile especially the thin wall pvc

 

[MatthewF]

Will do. Thank you

 

[pecan]

If your PVC is cracked you can easily run a new line (PVC or flex) super simple and you don't really even need to dig much, you can run the line along the edge of the water features and cover it with mulch.

 

[morewater]

Thanks RobAmy. Sounds like my next step is to buy a submerged pump and figure out how to attach it to the pvc pipe in the bottom pond. If anyone else has any tips on that or anything else I should be doing to make it nice, I appreciate the advice. Thanks!

I don't hold much faith in concrete-buried PVC piping. Not having physically seen your set-up, I would recommend sealing off these "concrete-buried" pipes by means of simply filling the ends of the pipes with waterfall foam and running above-ground tubing. As stated earlier, these can easily be disguised using plants or mulch.

You first need to determine whether or not the system leaks. Fill each pool individually and mark the concrete with a Sharpie at its ultimate fill height (you can tell where that is by the concrete discoloration). Let it sit for a couple of days and check the levels to determine if there is any water loss. If there is.............

The concrete can be covered with Pond Shield or a similar product to ensure that any cracks are waterproofed with a layer of rubber. You can determine from the photos what was once each pools ultimate fill level by the discoloration of the concrete. Only these areas should be sealed with the Pond Shield or similar product. Once sealed, prior to selecting a pump you will need to determine total volume in the system. This is easily accomplished (and quite accurately) using your outdoor hose and a 5-gallon bucket.

Time how long it takes to fill the 5-gallon bucket from your hose. Next, start to fill your water system from the top pool with the hose. Note the time that you started and the time that it took to completely fill the water system. Simple math will allow you to determine the total volume.

Next, make a simple measurement of how far up your upper pool is from the bottom pool. This is your "Feet of Head". A 2500gph pump doesn't pump 2500 gallons per hour if it's pumping it up ten feet. You'll want to turn over the entire volume of the pond at the very least one time per hour, preferably more. If you've got 10 feet of head and want to pump 2500gph through the system, you're probably going to need at least a 3500gph pump for a once-hourly turnover. Keep in mind also that any filtration that you add that interrupts the water flow is also going to result in a drop in gallons-per-hour flow.

GLTU.

 

[MatthewF]

Thank you for the welcome and the advice. Here is a quick update on where I am at.

I spent a bunch of time Saturday at the new house (we haven't moved in yet) cleaning and filling the pools. Intending to test the PVC pipe at one point I filled them by attaching the hose from the bottom pool. Dirty water came out of the top pipe at first then all seemed to work well. We measured the pools using the 5 gallon bucket method. This was before getting @morewater's advice and we didn't think of using a timer. We just filled the 5 gallon bucket again and again and dumped it in. The pools aren't that large so this was doable. The top pool is 25 gallons, the middle pool 33 and the bottom 105 gallons. I've left the ponds full of water and will check on them again in a couple of days. I also will go back and measure the height to figure out "feet of head." My guess it is about 2.5 feet.

One question, should I be measuring from the water level of the bottom pool to the water level of the top pool? or should I be measuring from the bottom of the pool where I intend to attach the submerged pump? Since the bottom pool is the deepest that actually makes a difference in the height.

Also, I've attached two new pics showing us filling up the pools. I'm getting excited!

Again, I really appreciate the advice I am getting.

 

[pecan]

I beleive you measure from the water level of the pool where the pump is located (I assume bottom pool) to the height of the outlet. You don't measure from the actual pump location because it doesn't have to work to pump water up to the surface only above the surface. That would be the feet of head you want to consider when selecting a pump.

I have one of these in my small pond and it works great, mag drive so its low power usage. Depending on how much flow you want would depend on the size. Also use 1 1/2" to 2" pvc for your pipe to optimize flow. Smaller pipes will reduce flow (I learned the hard way when I tried 1/2" pipe and 750 GPH pump). http://www.pondliner.com/c-187-little-giant-mag-drive-pond-pumps.aspx

 

[Meyer Jordan]

One question, should I be measuring from the water level of the bottom pool to the water level of the top pool?

Yes, from water level of bottom pool to height of outlet.

 

[mgmine]

The easier way to figure the head is to put a tall stake at the bottom and run a level line to the top. Then simply measure how height the bottom stake is. To remove the line going to the pvc try pulling and twisting. It can't be glued but it might have a compression fitting. another picture of it would be helpful.