25 replies to this topic

[action21]

Newbie here with a 15 x 25 foot 3 ft deep hole. Just received liner, found used carpet for backing(all from this forums suggestions).

Calculated gallons as 5925 gallons

Looking to keep this simple with a single waterfall apx 2-3 ft high.

Can someone enlighten me as to decent pumps, filters, designs - I've been reading DYI but still fuzzy on size of pumps and filters needed - kidney shaped pond straight down walls - Kentucky.

Thanks

[koikeepr]

Do yourself a favor and don't go a step further or put in that liner until you have the filtration fully sorted out. I just went through a similar build, and you can see it here in photos: http://www.gardenpon...otos-t5112.html

With a pond of that size, you should be using bottom drains. It will be very difficult to keep the pond floor clean on a pond that size without BD's.

Are you using block to line your walls? You really should be, but if not, you should not do straight down walls, as you risk collapse. In the case of dirt walls, you need to be tapering your walls to create strength as you will be walking around the pond surface and likely have some more stone ringing the pond.

[action21]

koikeepr said:

Do yourself a favor and don't go a step further or put in that liner until you have the filtration fully sorted out. I just went through a similar build, and you can see it here in photos: http://www.gardenpon...otos-t5112.html

With a pond of that size, you should be using bottom drains. It will be very difficult to keep the pond floor clean on a pond that size without BD's.

Are you using block to line your walls? You really should be, but if not, you should not do straight down walls, as you risk collapse. In the case of dirt walls, you need to be tapering your walls to create strength as you will be walking around the pond surface and likely have some more stone ringing the pond.

Thanks - that is why I chose this site. Makes sense - I guess I'll get some blocks. I'm a little confused on the need for the BD because I've had larger swimming pools and never had a bottom drain but I will take your advice and put the brakes on.

Thank you very much and have a Happy 4th!

[DrDave]

Many of us don't have or need one. I have had ponds 42 years without one. With a submersible pump, you can move your drain anywhere you want to and no leaks to worry about.

[action21]

DrDave said:

Many of us don't have or need one. I have had ponds 42 years without one. With a submersible pump, you can move your drain anywhere you want to and no leaks to worry about.

I live in Elizabethtown KY and most people here keep telling me that the ground is so hard that the weight of the water should suffice. Do you think I need to put in the blocks? I only went straight down due to many posts here about racoons, cats etc,.. eating all the fish.

I do believe I will have to agree and not put in the BD due to leakage fears and the ability to be able to use submersibles like you said. I was figuring if I am able to keep the water moving with some jets I should be able to get by with a surface skimmer and vacuuming occasionally like I did with my pools.

[DrDave]

You are on the right track. Circulation is the key to getting stuff into any drain including submersibles.

[koikeepr]

You need to gently grade the walls in, and trust me no predator will make it in there. It's just a slight grade, nothing exaggerated.

"Fear" of leaks is not a reason to not put in a BD. Many of us on the site have BD's and no leaks. With the proper sealant, you will be fine.

Trust me that in a 15x20 pond, you will need lots of submersibles to to keep your pond floor clean. And you will need to be getting into the water continually to move them around to get your pond clean.

My pond has zero detrius on the floor, and in the all the months it's been up and running, I have not gotten a finger wet.

Of course, there are many ways to build a pond. In a set up that large, what you want to think about is limiting maintenance. You will do what you feel comfortable with.

[DrDave]

I have never had to go into any of my ponds to move my submersible pump. And 1 submersible 3200 GPH pump moves just as much water as a BD with an external 3200 GPH pump.
Lets keep the facts accurate, please.

Edited by DrDave, 05 July 2010 - 06:07 PM.

[koikeepr]

How will you position and move a submersible in a 20x15 foot pond so that it reaches all parts of the pond without getting in or rigging up something to push the pump around and bring it in to clean it? Also, you do know that it very specifically says in submersible manuals that you should not be pulling the thing in by the cord, etc.

Also, in a 20 foot pond (which is basically what I have). i have two BD's that sit in the center of each 10 foot mark. That would mean TWO submersibles in place at the same time to do the same thing. So, now you have twice the wattage being consumed where I have two gravity fed BD's to a single pump which sits out of the water and a leaf trap to catch anything that might be headed toward the pump.

Let's not assume that plumbing a 1500g pond and a 6000g one are the same. The mechanics of a sedan and a Mack truck are not the same and you wouldn't treat them as such. One is not better than the other, they are just different and one needs to consider the maintenance issues for a wide and long pond with a huge floor surface in a reasonable way so that maintenance is easier and you have a spotless floor. I sure as heck wouldn't want to be getting into a pond that large to vacuum it twice a season.

I would just like for action21 to slow down, take a breath and think about his plan before buying a bunch of expensive equipment. He can go about it several ways, and an informed decision should be made based on having all the info at hand. Whichever he chooses at the end will be based on his personal preference for sure.

[action21]

My measurements were off it is actually 9 wide x 19 long - see attached pic.

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[DrCase]

Looks good there
The thing to do is put your pump opposite your water fall
If you can slope your floor toward the pump even better
Let the flow of the water fall sweep the pond floor to the pump
I dont own a pond vac and i never have to move my pump...My filters do all the work
Keep it simple

[koiguy1969]

using 1 submersable, and never having to move it or have it clog...you can do as i do and put your pump by the falls...tee off the pumps inlet to multiple prefilters located around the pond. you draw water from different areas so no dead spots. i have black nylon string tied to mine so i can pull them up near the surface to remove them for the occassional cleaning.....like movable B.D.s....no problems, my liners pretty clean and black minus the gravel that i havent cleaned up from the spawn.

[action21]

Thanks to you both - I've ordered a 3200GPH Harbor Freight pump already but I'm in no hurry to build this - I really want to do this right.

DrCase I like the video on youtube of your 55 gal setup.

[addy1]

Nice digging! That will be nice when it is done

[action21]

I've decided to put 2 pacific Hydrostar 3200gph in for circulation - 1 at each end and then a Beckett W1150 going into DrDaves DYI filtering system and then down my waterfall back into the pond

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