2 pleco + 2 koi + 2 goldfish = 2 dead kois? What to do next?

[CountryEscape]

Thanks very much, Dave. I sure understand better now. I guess when I saw in our local pet shop a huge pleco and huge koi that were given to the shop when the owner had decided to tear down her pond, I figured they were ok together. Of course, they told me they would be fine, just needed to only have the pleco out there in warm waters. I won't make the mistake again!
And, I've seen tv shows about that toad and the way it is spreading. Same thing about water snakes in FL and killer bees that have migrated into the US. People have been killed lately in AZ climbing on the mountains there, bees attacking, running to get away from the hundreds of stings, falling over the edge and dying. Very sad. Heard the guy that died had over 100 stings on him.

 

[Dave 54]

Another example is the Koi Herpes virus and also the Goldfish Herpes virus nobody knows how they originated but the spead of both viruses are simply staggering to say the least .
The Goldfish Herpes Virus is the lessor of the two evils , did you know it is rife in the US ?
The koi Herpes Virus shows no sign of stopping and has a foothold in many countries as you ptobably know it is leathol killing 80% of all koi with the survivor who are now carrying the virus having to be Euthanised to stop it spreading further.
Was it a case of the Lessor Goldfish Herpes Virus skipping to its Cousin or the other way around there are no answers to that question.
Strangly the only Country that has stock that are clear of the virus in two of its states is Australia surely it doesnt take a rocket scientist to say hang about here we have the only KHV free koi in the world we could make a killing here but no its a case of lets introdues it to the wild Carp we have in our water ways and kill them all off .
Did you know there is even an Oyster Herpes Virus ( wonder where that came from )!!!....
You are right about all the wild boaconstrictors free in the Florida everglades here in the UK we have a problem with your turtles set free after the ninja Turltle craze ,
Your grey Squirels have decimated our native Red Squirel population.
Our British Cray fish are being wiped out by American Cray fish at a rapid rate.
We have focks of green Parrots in and around London and Chinese mitten crabs destroying our river banks we are even seeing corals growing here where they shouldn't be.
We get reports of large cats killing sheep set free in the 1960's when they changed the law on the import of these big cats and the cost of a licence was extortionate so they simply opened the cage doors and let them all out .
Thankfully the only thing we havent got in the UK is Rabies but there is always the chance it will make a foothold .

rgrds

Dave

 

[CountryEscape]

That's awful all the native species being killed by non-natives that are introduced. I had to laugh about the grey squirrel decimating the red squirrels, though! Around here, the gray is maybe half the size of the red squirrels, so I can't imagine that happening. Maybe in your area, the size difference is the opposite, or maybe the grays are smarter and more dominant.

 

[Dave 54]

The red squirel in the UK is a very small animal this is why the greys took over , they are seen as pest in the forestry world damaging trees where the reds dont .
As such many greys are shot on sight as pest , the ones you find in the UK's parks are nearly tame in the fact they will eat from your hand they will come within inches of you .with or without food

rgrds

Dave

 

[CountryEscape]

Squirrels, birds, any type of "wild" animal living in city limit parks are usually pretty tame. They are so used to humans being in their "yard" all the time, they have adapted. People start feeding them, and they become even tamer, whether that's a good thing or not, usually NOT! I, however, have a couple of gray squirrels at the local park that when I go daily for over a week or two, they will come to the tree I park close to, and wait for me to toss them a cracker or piece of my bread. I know I shouldn't do it, but it's still neat! They are not so tame to come get something out of a person's hand, although I've seen that at other parks.

 

[Fishylove]

When I bought my first house, we had a Boxer named Dutchass. She hated squirrels! Lol. Our house was surrounded by oak trees, so you can imagine how many squirrels we had. They got to where every morning I would let Dutchass out to potty and they would be out there waiting for her, lol, fussing at her from the trunks of the trees. It was so funny
We don't se many gray squirrels around here, unless you are way out in the country. We do have flying squirrels though, I see them at dusk/ dawn every once and a while. Hey CE, maybe you know of this town, there is a town in Illinois, about 2-3 hours from here, that only has white squirrels :huh: it was the strangest thing I've ever seen! Thinking the town is Olney, Illinois or near there anyway.

 

[CountryEscape]

Yep, you hit it on the nose, Fishy. Olney is known for the white squirrels. I've never seen one in person, but people there say there are quite a few now. Effingham also had a picture some years back (maybe 10 or more) of an albino deer out by Lake Sara. There was an albino turkey killed in the neighborhood where I used to live, my nephew killed it. Big tom. At first we thought it was a tame turkey that mingled with the wild, but he was told it was wild turkey. Now that's cool, as there are a couple more of them, to see pure white turkeys in the group during breeding season!

 

[CometKeith]

I have heard of those albino squirrels too. Supposedly you need to go out early in the morning to see them. Maybe their eyes are too sensitive to the sun for them to be out during the day. We have chocolate brown squirrels here that are really pretty. There are a bunch of gray ones too. I have heard the dark brown ones are more aggressive and push the gray ones out, but I haven't seen that happen.

 

[CountryEscape]

If there is plenty of food, they will all come and coexist. If they are in the wild, and have to fight for their food supply, that's why some types of squirrels will get aggressive and push others out of the area. It's that way with all types of animals, it seems. Most protect their home ground, be it deer, squirrels, birds. Speaking of which, I saw a really cool falcon or hawk yesterday swooping over the fields by my house. It had white at the base of it's tail, then brown on the end. Smaller than a red tail hawk, but much larger than the typical "chicken hawk" (I think it's called a Coopers Hawk, maybe) that I usually see more often. Anyone know what it might be? I don't have time to search for it at the moment.

 

[Dave 54]

The reds would never coexist in the UK they are smaller and the greys carry a virus the red cannot cope with so there range has shrunk to just a few pockets around the UK.
Greys also destroy the trees where as reds coexist with the trees so its a no no

rgrds

Dave

 

[CountryEscape]

Well, Dave, I know that there are tons of squirrels in the wild here, but for the most part, they seem to be in neighborhoods as well. That's what I meant about feeding them. People feed their birds tons of food, and then buy fancy feeders that the squirrels are not supposed to be able to get into. Well, if they would just go ahead and feed the squirrels, they would leave the bird feeders alone. LOL That's what I meant about feed them and they will co-exist! I know what you mean about some animals are wasteful and can cause destruction in woods. I've never heard of squirrels killing off trees, though, so I think the oaks, hickory and walnuts in my area are very tolerant to the squirrels, no way they could kill one of them.

 

[Dave 54]

The greys tend to strip the bark of trees thus what we call wringing the tree with some trees when this happens the die

rgrds

Dave

 

[CountryEscape]

Sounds like you have very different grey squirrels than we have here in the US, or at least in my area of the US, Midwest. My horses will chew on the bark of trees, killing them, so I have to wrap all trees in their pasture that I don't want them to kill. Right now, though, no trees there I wouldn't mind them killing. LOL Only a few scrap willows next to the pond, which will come out when the farm pond is renovated someday, but they have not touched them. Go figure!

 

[Dave 54]

Dr Johnson's videos are aimed at new Koi keepers. Dave, whether you judge these videos to be a good source of info or not is your decision. If other people get useful info from these videos that's their business. I can understand commenting on specific bits of info in the videos, I don't agree with every single nugget. But I can't say I see the point of just completely discounting all of Dr Johnson's videos. Comes across as rather small minded. In the big scheme of things I'm more inclined to give more credence to a person trained in Koi care, who does this for a living, has taken the time to make and post videos on the subject and therefore allowing for review, than I do to any "hey, I just signed up in a pond forum...listen to me...I'm an expert, trust me" dude. Now I might be completely wrong. I've come to this conclusion based on reading many forums, on many subjects, over many years. Just kind of seems to me that the untrained, inexperienced people who think they know a lot really turns out to not know much of anything.

Hey dont go knocking me Waterbug I've just come on this site true but I do have the years behind me , all I said was that Doc Johnsons videos are all well and good but novices need to read books to get half an idea what he was talking about .
Go over to koi keeperunleashed and take a look at what weve been running for two years now check out our inclusion to the koi magazines koi hall of fame , the koi/fish/koihealth library that the AKCA's former Health Forum head spike Cover asked us to reveiw basically though my friend I'm not knocking you so why not quit knocking me my friend.
I orignally only came on this site to ask the good Dr Novak to come back to us but I quite liked the mix of people on here including yourself

rgrds

Dave

 

[Dave 54]

Both Books written by the good Doctor Waterbug , why bcause he wants people to have a really good grounding in the hobby by reading about it.
This way the lessons learned have a chance of staying with the novice fishkeeper throughout their hopefully long and enjoyable time in the hobby.
I have a friend here in Plymouth who lectures to the Marine Biology students at the Plymouth University.
Unlike Dr Johnson who has studied long and hard to become a vet, Martin ({his name is Martin Simpson).
Martin has a natural bent to the hobby yet no qualifications but he can tell you everything there is to know both in Tropical and Marine world.
He has a better seahorse breeding program than the national Marine Aquarium here in Plymouth, "in his own kitchen" breeds corrals and runs an exclusive Marine shop selling Marine fish to those that know their stuff, he can even give you the latin name of any fish at a glance
His Business goes by the name of Plymouth Marines he will not sell to novices to the hobby and has basically read everything there is to know on his chosen subject .
I first came across him aged 15 years old at a fish show that was for Marine,Tropical and Coldwater he left most people standing even then.
The amount of Trophies won by him over the years, could if he wished set him up as a trophy shop.
What he didn't know he was most keen to learn, it just goes to show what by reading you can learn .
You speak highly of the good Doctor as do I yet slate Dr Novak who has a doctorate in Ichtheology when he is putting a simple yet effective method of filtration across I truely dont understand where your coming from at least we let him speak.
rgrds

Dave