4,000 Gallon Pond Build

[Jason]

Ok, It's time to go ahead and start laying my pond out! I got to work on this for the last 2 hours of how I will be building my near future 4,000 Gallon Modern style Koi pond. I am using Both 27 gallon filters that i made and 2 DIY In-Pond Skimmers that I am in the process of making as well. I am using all existing pumps that I have (6) to start off with. Here is an early build, but not complete, I will work on a side view and depth view (2-1/2') tomorrow. Here is the link to the build, let me know what you think or what can be improved. Thanks as always

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=1FC3A60C4A3A53C8!190&authkey=!ACscS58G6-7g5qo&v=3&ithint=photo%2c.jpg

 

[Catfishnut]

Ok, It's time to go ahead and start laying my pond out! I got to work on this for the last 2 hours of how I will be building my near future 4,000 Gallon Modern style Koi pond. I am using Both 27 gallon filters that i made and 2 DIY In-Pond Skimmers that I am in the process of making as well. I am using all existing pumps that I have (6) to start off with. Here is an early build, but not complete, I will work on a side view and depth view (2-1/2') tomorrow. Here is the link to the build, let me know what you think or what can be improved. Thanks as always

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=1FC3A60C4A3A53C8!190&authkey=!ACscS58G6-7g5qo&v=3&ithint=photo%2c.jpg

Good Morning Jason,

I was looking over your design and had a few questions and comments.

1] Your layout is rectangular, so you are going to have an issue with sediments collecting in certain corners or even in areas in the middle of the pond basin where the water currents have slowed down or have created eddie currents. There will be these areas of eddies in such a rectangular design. So, are you going to have bottom drains or suction drains to simulate a bottom drain in those areas to help pick up the sedimentation and carry it out of the pond to the filter system? Or are you planning to direct the water flow from the inlet ports (feeding water into the pond) to keep these areas stirred up so that sediment does not collect in these areas too much?

2] Looking at your current location for the aerator and all the pump locations, I think this may not be the most beneficial layout for your pond shape. I think that it would be better to place the areator directly in front of one of the more higher capacity water inlets to the pond, or use two areators, one in front of each of the two 400 gph pumps shown on the bottom of the diagram. Otherwise, it looks to me that the water currents from all the pumps are going to try to push the aerated water right back into one small area, right at the aerator. The areated water should be directed outward into the pond by the influent water and dispersed as evenly as possible so that all areas of the pond are served with the most equalalized distribution of the oxygenated water. It might be just as simple as moving the aerator to the opposite side of the pond, directly in-between the two 400 gph pumps. The direction you have the pumps shown to direct the water would pull the aerated water right along with the current that the pumps are going to create, thus taking the aerated water to both ends of the pond and then circling around again. I definitely think you should consider the relocation of the aerator to the opposite side of the pond, directly in-between the two pumps.

3] I see where filter #2 gets its inlet water, (from the 500 gph pump and the 1,200 gph skimmer pump), but I am not clear on the location of the inlet water for filter #1. Is it just the other skimmer pump with the 950 gph pump? No issue there, just questioning where the water source was coming from.

My pond (bait tank) is going to be rectangular in shape, too. So I have been muddling over a lot of these concerns regarding the direction of water flow in the tank and where to pull off (draw out) the water by the pumps or whether to use bottom drains and where to place them and how to inject the water back into the pond to create the proper current flow for the fish and the aeration. I still have not made a final decision on all my designs yet. I am still thinking them over.

Since you requested some crtitique for your design, I thought I would point out some of the items that I myself have been debating with for my project. I hope that I have given you some positive ideas here that will help you make your pond better.

Definitely looking forward to seeing more of your designs and what you finally decide upon for the whole show!

Gordy

 

[sissy]

I have a rectangular one and in 11 years the stuff only settles in the middle because it is slightly lower and since he has all those pumps .I really can't see a problem.I have 2 pumps and 2 filters .I don't even use an aerator in my pond or a uv .I really think it is how you approach it .If you use 2 filters and a pool net then I really can't see any problems with rectangular ponds .No matter the shape things are going to collect around the edges .I have 2 koi and so far no problems .I think mainly it is up to what you can take care of .Jason really has no winter and as long as he does not over feed it should be no problem.I would really go with 2 filters though one at each end and a pump to each 1 .This way it can pick up more .Easy for him to change to 2 pumps if he see one does not work .I went to 2 because of the koi .

 

[Jason]

Thanks Catfishnut, Im not sure if this is the final layout yet as I laid it out real quick, but I see your concern with the aerator being there, I placed it there mainly to keep flow going toward the skimmer for surface debris instead of getting trapped between the 2 falls. Both Filters are fed by 2 pumps each, 1 Larger (in skimmer) and 1 smaller (on bottom), Both Spitters will be bottom pumps too all with prefilters except skimmer pumps which will be screened only. As far as sediment goes, I planned on Once a month getting in the pond and using a spray nozzle to stir up the sediment like I do now with my small ponds. I also was considering using the 2 - 400gph pumps to make 2 Venturi setups with them like Koi Guy did and point them on the bottom as well.

Im not sure about a bottom drain though or how they work and I don't have a Inline pump strong enough for that as well. I am thinking about putting a small bog in between the falls on the outside of the pond but not sure yet?

I want the pond to be flat bottom and the island in the middle will be a "Chill Spot" for the fish lol under it or even a breeding spot?

I found a White 35mil 16x30' stadium roof liner that I will use, so a white liner would be pretty cool I guess and should be easy for me to see details on the pond bottom.

Sissy, Im trying to decide on having a bridge like yours going to the island or a stepping stone like I have now? I also will have a UV clarifier, not sure what size yet, probably 55 watt.

 

[dieselplower]

Wow that will be an awesomely big pond. Cool. I do want to caution you on the size of the pond vs liner... You have 15 feet worth of width including the vertical sides and 16' of tarp. This does not leave much room for overhang. Just saying... Measure carefully.
I also think I would look at this pond as two smaller square ponds. I think the skimmers should be on opposite sides of the pond that the filters are on, rather than on adjacent sides. That should create a better current. It seems like you will have 4 pumps on the bottom of the pond? That should really keep too much debris from setteling... just be sure you have precautions to ensure that if a pump line comes loose from a filter or turtle squirter etc, it will not empty the pond or lower the level to where your skimmer pumps will run dry and burn up.

 

[Jason]

Thanks Diesel, Yep, I measured 6" of over hang all around to keep me from cutting any lol. I though about the skimmers too, but I also would loose more flow rate, but maybe not too bad since it's only 10'? The 4 bottom pumps will be on cinder blocks, and I definitely don't want 2 ponds again if I don't have to.

 

[dieselplower]

Cool man. I didnt mean to make it two ponds, I just meant that in a square pond, the skimmer should be on the opposite side of the filter return. So that is how I would do it even though you have 2 of each. I dont think you would lose much flow through a 1" pipe over 10". If they were higher flow pumps, it might be more of an issue.

 

[sissy]

I know for 3 months my liner settled down as the weight of the water compressed the ground under it .I put aerator hoses in my filters in the summer because of the plants using up so much oxygen at night .I have it on a timer and it comes on at midnight and goes off at 5 am .Electric rates are cheaper then and plants use up oxygen at night but give it off during the day .I feel the same way about a bottom drain .To scared to take the chance of ruining a good liner if I did not do it right ..You could use crates to tie your pumps too as cutting 1 side of the crate would also give your fish a place to hide in case of a predator or if you use the block put it side ways so the fish can swim threw the holes .Those crates are cheap at walmart .I don't have a skimmer nothing really blows in the pond so not sure about those things .Also where did you get your liner ,don't keep secrets . :cheerful:

 

[j.w]

Nice size pond w/ plenty of room for your koi! Will be fun watching you build it.

 

[Jason]

I am going to change the skimmers now diesel, good idea!

Sissy, I actually found the site on this forum, It was the Discount Billboard Tarp site (can't think of the name of it, Have it at home) I have not purchased it yet, but is in cart, waiting for Tax Returns to get everything I need!

 

[sissy]

ok I know what you are talking about and thought it was somewhere different .

 

[shakaho]

Make it deeper. 2 1/2 feet is typically given as the deepest water in which herons and other big wading birds can stand and fish. That means a heron can feast in a pond of that depth. If you are keeping koi, you should probably go at least 4 feet deep, since koi are much more sensitive to heat than goldfish.

I suggest you contact a koi/pond club in your area and find out how others have built ponds of the size. Here are a couple.

http://www.nfkc.info/

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Panhandle-Koi-and-Pond-Club/149436081901817

Pond people are always happy to show off their ponds and explain how they work.

With 4000 gallons, you really should have a bottom drain, and doubly so if you will have koi.

 

[sissy]

I have koi with no bottom drain and pool net works to clean it plus I did notice on the billboard sight that you should not cut them because it can weaken the edges around where the cuts are .I do understand deeper for koi to keep them cool but also wonder what the water table is in Panama City .Could go more above ground to make it deeper .I had to because of the side walk from the front porch to the basement

 

[Jason]

Shakaho, Thanks for the advice, But I have my mind set on 2-1/2' for a number of reasons. I live about 1 mile from the Beach here in Panama City so I can't dig much past 1-1/2' without hitting water and no floating liner for me, It does not get cold enough to go deeper and I like shallower ponds all around, My 2 ponds now which are both under 2' have been fine over the last year since I built cover for the fish to hide under/in, which will be the center island in the new pond as well as a 11'x11'x15' sun sail canopy I have that I have been dying to use will go over half of the pond too. My Liner is White meaning it won't get near as hot as my Black lined ponds do now in the summer. My fish load will be very small for awhile as I only have 14 fish at 4-6" 2 of them close to 10".

Im not trying to have a rebuttal for everything you mentioned because you are 100% correct! And the bottom drain is a no go since I do not have an inline pump for it. Thank you for the links! Do you have good pond supply stores around you?

Im trying to use all existing supplies when I move, as the owner of the house we are in now said he wont take care of the ponds when we move so I can take all with me when we move into our new house. This new pond will cost me around $1,000 after all said and done (which is VERY cheap for a pond that size) after Blocks, Liner, Filter builds and skimmer builds, tubing, lighting, hoses, spitters, UV, Plywood, Fittings, electrical, re-bar, and a wholllleee lot of hard work and time!

Supplies I Have to use at my disposal already:
250GPH Jebao Pump,
(2) Jebao 400GPH Pumps,
500GPH Pondmaster Pump,
650GPH Beckett Pump,
950GPH Pondmaster Pump,
1,200GPH Beckett Pump,
(2) 27 Gallon DIY Filters,
13W UV,
20' 1" Tubing,
50' 3/4" Tubing,
20' 1/2" tubing,
7'x10' - 20mil PVC Liner,
10'x10' - 45mil EPDM Liner,
(2) 6 Outlet Outdoor Digital Timers,
Set of 6 - 24 LED Pond Lights,
Set of 4 - 24 LED Pond Lights,
19 Cinderblocks,
1 Ton of landscaping Rock/Boulders,
1/2 Ton of Various Color Granite Slabs,

And I m sure I forgot some things but Hopefully I can use these items to their fullest to keep cost down :fingersx:

 

[Jason]

Sissy, I will be going 8" above ground with this one as the top row of cinder blocks will be above ground level for that reason.