Bog building

Discussion in 'Pond Construction & Equipment' started by addy1, Jun 22, 2011.

  1. addy1

    Lisak1

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    What feeds the deck ponds?
     
    Lisak1, Feb 26, 2018
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  2. addy1

    addy1 water gardener / gold fish and shubunkins Moderator

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    I have a clear water pump that sends water up to the deck ponds, around 1065 or so gph. Harbor freight. We have it on a timer.
    The head pressure is so high a pump. that also did the pond, to pump it up would be costly in electricity use. And one pricey pump.

    Around 50-60 feet of pipes that climb a hill that is hard to walk up. Around a 25 degree slope.
     
    addy1, Feb 26, 2018
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  3. addy1

    brokensword Not all those who wander are lost

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    Okay, Lisa, you follow with me, see if we can make pump meet flow meet bog!

    Now, yellow brick road to the oil derrick in the sky (the big pump). Then we follow red riding hood until she splits in two at a tee where she consumes 1000 gallons of whatever addy's been brewing. And apparently, she's been playing in the mud as everything there is dirty. Gots ta send all that then to the BIG P.

    So, now we change lanes (colors) and find where the purple Waldo is; seems it's the one next to the the BIG P. Not a lot of help there, but let's continue our trek. OOOOHHH, wait, now we find the road signal has turned color again and we're covered in gray. Gray? WTF? Fine, we'll slip into our swim fins (abandoning our car, apparently) and float down from the bog to the BiG P. Big P; gotta get a new label for that one as it sounds like something the boy fish are doing in the back yard...I digress...So, somehow, that black squiggly is back and it's going to pee as well––no, that's not right, it's going to the PEA. Seems the same to me but WTH, spell check might be useful here...Fine, after graveling, erm, groveling for more directions, I get to the infamous light blue flowy thing that is coming from Little P, which times itself nicely to the cadence of the deck P's. Deck, sounds like we've gone from car to swimming and now to a ship. Gotta admit, quite a ride, this following of addy's flow chart. Flow chart! THAT'S what we need here!

    Oh no, MORE dirty water goes nowhere, though...

    Big P only gets bog water -- right, got it. That's the only fact I'm really really sure about in the moment. And it gets repeated for the slower folks like me...heh


    Okay addy, I think you've improved on the architectural design but methinks someone has far too many crayons to play with.

    But hey, been a fun ride!

    Now, where did I put that margarita? No, now I need something a lot stronger...



    :p
     
    brokensword, Feb 26, 2018
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  4. addy1

    addy1 water gardener / gold fish and shubunkins Moderator

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    vodka!

    Long and short of it, the only pond that gets filtered bog water is the big pond, the only pond that sends water to the bog is the big pond. All the other ponds get dirty water from the big pond.
     
    addy1, Feb 26, 2018
  5. addy1

    brokensword Not all those who wander are lost

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    See, addy? All you needed was ONE drink and all your cohesion came back! Now it's crystal clear!
     
    brokensword, Feb 26, 2018
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  6. addy1

    cas

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    @addy1 I understood the second illustration very well, but how does a skimmer work without a pump?
     
    cas, Feb 27, 2018
  7. addy1

    addy1 water gardener / gold fish and shubunkins Moderator

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    My pump draws water from it and the pond. I have a T in the line with a ball valve to control flow from the skimmer and pond. I have the ball valve full open from the pond, the valve from the skimmer I adjust to more or less water dependent on what is falling.

    The (swimming pool) skimmer is at the far end of the pond from the pump, we ran lines under the liner to the pump, where we added the ball valve which the goes into a T joining the line coming from the pond, that then goes to the pump.
     
    addy1, Feb 27, 2018
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  8. addy1

    CountryEscape

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    CountryEscape, Mar 6, 2018
  9. addy1

    brokensword Not all those who wander are lost

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    ;)
     
    brokensword, Mar 6, 2018
  10. addy1

    addy1 water gardener / gold fish and shubunkins Moderator

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    Geez you now know my secret!
     
    addy1, Mar 6, 2018
  11. addy1

    GBBUDD

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    I would expect there to be a ratio similar to the pond size and a percentage for a bog, My question is , is there a ratio where a bog of a particular size should have x GPH ?
     
    GBBUDD, Mar 8, 2018
  12. addy1

    addy1 water gardener / gold fish and shubunkins Moderator

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    No clue, I just used the pump I had with the bog I built, it works fine. Per the "rules" my pump is too small. I pump around 6000 gph, my amount of water wandering around is around 10000 gallons. more or less.

    Some say slow flow, some say medium, some say it does not mater. Mine runs pretty fast.
     
    addy1, Mar 8, 2018
  13. addy1

    Lisak1

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    Unfortunately @GBBUDD the wise words of @Meyer Jordan will have to stand on their own, as he passed away in late December.

    There may very well be a formula that would work best, but to be honest I haven't the slightest clue what that is. We were looking for a certain water volume out of our bog to feed the waterfall so we installed a variable pump and played around with the flow until we liked it. The plants grow great, the water stays clear, the fish are thriving... we may have hit on the formula by accident! We installed several ball valves that can also help with water flow - one is on the line that comes off the bog to feed a small waterfall and stream.

    I have read things that say the bog surface should be 1/3 the size of the pond surface, but I don't know where the math comes from. I don't think you could have a pond that was too big, though, so I would shoot for as large as I could get. I wish we had a much bigger bog, as I love seeing what I can grow in it!
     
    Lisak1, Mar 8, 2018
  14. addy1

    GBBUDD

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    GBBUDD, Mar 8, 2018
  15. addy1

    GBBUDD

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    I may have gone a little over board with the pump I chose a 12,000 gph . but after looking at hours and hours of any garden pond videos I could find or pictures and blogs . 5,000 GPH Looked to whimpy for what I was hoping to obtain. Hey you learn best by mistakes right. So push comes to shove I may have to have a bypass here or there. I believe the 12,000 to be perfect for the stream and falls but it may be to much for the bog
     
    GBBUDD, Mar 8, 2018
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  16. addy1

    Lisak1

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    @meyer was indeed a great resource here. Thank goodness he was an active contributor, so his advice will live on as long as these threads stay alive on the internet.

    Is your 12,000 GPH pump going to be the only pump on the pond? If so, you can definitely restrict what's going to the bog with a ball valve and direct more water to the stream and falls. Having the ability to adjust water flow post-build is a good idea in my opinion. We tinker with ours every now and then as things change - i.e., more plants in the bog means we can up the water flow a bit, or we can turn the stream on or off and increase or decrease the flow independent of the bog.
     
    Lisak1, Mar 8, 2018
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  17. addy1

    brokensword Not all those who wander are lost

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    Lisa, I found when my plants were thriving and growing, outgrowing actually, that the water had less places to percolate and would be shunted toward channels. That is, the more I had, the more I had to worry about where the water was going. Especially as my taro got to 7', the roots were filling in spaces in the pea gravel. It was a lot better this past summer WITHOUT the taro in there. Do you trim and cull your bog at all? I have to do this with the pennywort and parrot's feather.

    Michael
     
    brokensword, Mar 8, 2018
  18. addy1

    addy1 water gardener / gold fish and shubunkins Moderator

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    I cull my plants heavy every spring, dig up loads of them, then leave them basically alone. Occasionally I go in and yank plants. I keep the area near the water fall open. Keep a few bird bath areas open.
     
    addy1, Mar 8, 2018
  19. addy1

    Lisak1

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    Yup - I have to especially watch the irises as they will take over if I let them. I like to leave room to add a few different things every year that are annuals, like canna lilies for some pretty color. They take all summer to reach full size and once they die after the first freeze they’re easy to get out.
     
    Lisak1, Mar 8, 2018
  20. addy1

    GBBUDD

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    For now it is yes . but down the road i'm betting not. The way I see it the pond is phase one. it is going to have an airlift system that is going to pull water down through 3/8" pea stone a large shelf/bog in the pond but to get the flow needed the pipe will drop over the edge into the deep end of the pond where the air will have a full 6' of lift. The main drain with an air bladder along with the skimmer in the pond where it will hook up to the 12,000 gph for now. Along with a return with two water falls. But I am thinking like Addy and second phase will have an overflow from the pond where a second stream will run toward the main water fall where it will be about a five foot drop. There I am leaning toward moving the 12,000 gph there where head pressure will be reduced big time as it will only have to lift the water not push it as well. but that creates an issue with the return I may have to add a small submersible. I have not worked out the full design particularly for the winter if the pomp is left on at 12,000gph I have no fear of freezing but if I start traveling again i'd rather shut down the big pump and do the air lift and diffuser and a small 4200 pump or so. Ok long winded where a simple no would have sufficed.
     
    GBBUDD, Mar 9, 2018
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