Chances of a standard comet staying black?

[Shdwdrgn]

I know that typically baby comets will start out black, then at some point their colors come on fast. I have also never seen a black standard comet in the fish store - only the fancy ones with the googly eyes and fat bellies. However I have one in my pond this year that is not showing any signs of color. This was one of four survivors from the last batch to hatch out last year, and the other three have had their oranges and whites for a couple months now.

They are getting close to 3" in length, so I'm starting to hope this guy might actually stay black. This one has some distinctive silver to its underside. At first I thought I was seeing a splash of orange on its belly, but then I realized it was just the reflection from the other fish it was swimming by. The silver in its scales is VERY highly reflective, looking more like a platinum koi rather than a white comet, and you only see it when he turns. Looking down on him, he looks completely greyish-black, and sometimes in the sunlight it looks like he has an ultraviolet sheen.

So what's the chances? Is it possible to get a dormant black gene out of orange and white parents?

 

[j.w]

I have wondered that also and have one big black comet about 6" that still has not turned and some others a bit smaller than him also.

 

[Shdwdrgn]

Wow! Usually my babies have turned within a few months, or if they are Fall babies, they turn the next Spring. It's good to know someone else is seeing black comets, maybe they're just a rarity that never makes it to the pet stores.

 

[fishin4cars]

I would say the chances aren't great, BUT that is only a educated guess....LOL Only personally had 3-4 true black comets myself. I've bought a 6" Black comet and within 6 weeks it started changing colors, I've had many goldfish that were born from even predominately black parent and none stayed black. Now black I mean black, not the dark olive green blackish ones. I'll call Commons? These are usually culled in most cases or are feed off to something larger. In time those will take over a pond if allowed. Most breeders sel those off first as feeders. I always try and remove as many of those as possible before the one year old mark to try and get fish of color. They will weaken a line of offspring greatly. Black Comets, like the black moor should breed some true black, If one of those was used to cross color back in then it's possible to see true black in the line. But I haven't seen many Large BLACK comets, so my guess is, most change over time. I will say this though, The Black Long Fin Comet I bought is now 50% black 50% orange, 13-14" long and one of the most impressive comets I have ever owned. If I found another solid black or close to solid black comet i would try another one just to see what it would turn out like. One factor for certain I'm curious about is water temps for Black comets. ??? Would cooler water temps effect the stability better for the black? Mine always looks better in cooler water, Even the shubunkins that have a lot of black seem to show up better when the water is cooler. I'm now at almost a month of 90 degree afternoon water temps! Very few of the fish with true black in them look very good right now, Comets or Koi, But The yellow and whites, and red and whites are really bold and full of luster and look great. I've read that UV and temp can have effects on some colors and blacks and yellows for sure seem to be the two colors most effected in my opinion by this. Food sources seem to effect the deepness effect on orange and red. Again, this is from what I have experienced and read through in forums but not proven that I am aware of.

 

[Shdwdrgn]

I've been noticing some of my younger comets this year have a very deep, almost red color to them, but I can't really say what has caused this. I'm pretty sure all of my smaller comets have come from a single pair, but they have been getting different types of food this year, plus nibbling on live plants in the water over the previous couple years, so it could all be diet. My water temps haven't gotten over 80 degrees, which is surprising considering how much of the Summer we've been in the upper 90's.

I'm not sure about the olive-green you referred to, maybe its the same as some of the fancy black ones I've seen that seem to have a coppery-green tinge when they flash in the light? This comet I have is certainly not that sort of black. There is a bit of a greyish look to his blackness, but that could just be from the silvery undertones. Oh, and that deep purple that I mentioned before? I also noticed it on a koi today which was originally more platinum, but the black pinecone scales seem to be taking over (he's looking pretty dark these days).

You have a 13-14" comet?!? That's an impressive fish! I didn't know they could get that big. My largest comet is 4 years old and only about 8" long. I don't know what I'll do when my fish outgrow this pond, but I'll probably try to keep the babies thinned down. I see a lot of people selling fish around here, shouldn't be too hard to get rid of the extras.

 

[fishin4cars]

I don't have a clue why that one got so big, I have two for sure that are two or three years older than that one and they are only about 8" maybe 9" as well, But at the same time I have seen a few that are even bigger than the big guy I have. Most of them always seem to be solid orange or orange with a bit of white, never seen a shubunkin that large or a white one that large but that's not to say they don't exsist. Most books say 12" max but I've seen enough that were bigger to say that I know they can get larger than 12" Black comets that I have seen are midnight black. The ones your talking about that have a coppery orange undercolor will change probably in time, I've seen those as well and once in a while one will get a really copper color, those are cool but you rarely see them for sale in the retail market, and I'm not sure why not as they are very attractive fish.

 

[Shdwdrgn]

I might have to net this comet and try to get a picture of it to see what's really going on. I've seen plenty of white comets (and have a few), but never any silvery colors, yet this one obviously reflects the colors from the other fish as it swims past. One other thing that's been in the back of my mind is that I have a 2-year-old shubunkin who may have gotten in on fertilizing eggs last Fall, introducing new genes... which may explain where the black came from.

One of my new koi has the black pinecones on top of an orange head, given him a very coppery look. My wife likes to call him copper-top.

 

[stroppy]

i have one in my pond that is 2 years old and only now has he/she started to turn orange

 

[j.w]

Ok mine is definitely not midnight black. I hope he will turn oj instead of being the kind Larkin says can take over a pond. I wouldn't like that but guess I would live w/ it if it happens cuz I can't cull..............just can't. I'll let ya know if my dark big ones ever start changing.

Stroppy good to know cuz I don't really want a bunch of commons taking over. Poor buggers I hope they don't hear me talking about them like this.........I do love them just the same..............just don't make anymore of you!

 

[stroppy]

Ok mine is definitely not midnight black. I hope he will turn oj instead of being the kind Larkin says can take over a pond. I wouldn't like that but guess I would live w/ it if it happens cuz I can't cull..............just can't. I'll let ya know if my dark big ones ever start changing.

Stroppy good to know cuz I don't really want a bunch of commons taking over. Poor buggers I hope they don't hear me talking about them like this.........I do love them just the same..............just don't make anymore of you!

i tied to take a photo of mine to show you jw ... he looks really good almost gold underneath and around the gills ... but the little ***** wouldnt keep still, i cant cull either

 

[addy1]

sigh me either, they have a pond for life.............

 

[j.w]

Maybe I will try to take a pic of mine too and I know what you mean about them not ever co-operating for the photo shoot...........like little toddlers they are...........squirmers and wiggly butts

 

[Lesley]

Wow! Usually my babies have turned within a few months, or if they are Fall babies, they turn the next Spring. It's good to know someone else is seeing black comets, maybe they're just a rarity that never makes it to the pet stores.

 

[Mmathis]

@Lesley Hello and welcome!