contagious disease?

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Hello!

We had to euthanize one of our fish last week as it was showing signs of disease and its eyes went white, making it blind.

My father was always the one who dealt with all fish matters however he recently passed in an accident and me and my mum do not really have a clue. I was wondering if anyone could help me, I've attached photos of the fish and as you can see it was losing some of its scales and had big welts in places.

All the other fish seem fine (apart from one with raised scales and a few with growths)

Can anyone help me identify what is wrong as I would hate for the others to get sick.

Thank you
Zoe
 

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fishin4cars

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WATER QUALITY! First thing off the bat what are all your readings and have they been reading that for How long? Second, Find a VET! get someone to do scrapings and identify what is going on. Those are big nice fish, and with what you have that going on with one fish with Ulcers,and the other with possible dropsy/unknown internal infection that close, tha'st major signs you have a problem going on. no doubt about it!!
 

koiguy1969

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thats one bad ulcer...an injury was infected, or maybe from a parasite... did your fish by chance spawn this year yet? its common for fish to aquire injuries during the spawn. tho usually the females. i would immediately do a large water change. poor water quality contributes to ulcers and a number of other health issues. and the fishes immune systems tend to be on the low side this time of year, and at the same time parasite activity tends to be up.i would keep an eye for flashing from others in the pond as well.
 

stroppy

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so sorry to hear about your father .... i think to be able to help you more we need to hear more about your pond the size fish load and such, but i do realize this must be difficult for you right now, is there anyone in your neighborhood with a pond that might be able to help you also follow what koiguy and fishin have posted
 
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Ok so from your responses, it seems that it must be an ulcer. Are these contagious?

Also I have no idea on pond readings, as I said, I've never had anything to do with the pond before now and my knowledge on fish is extremely limited.

The pond is quite big.... It is 12 foot by 10 foot and just over 6 foot deep, making it very difficult to do a large water change. We have around 35 fish (most of them medium to large size with a few small)

I really don't know what to do, it seems to be the only one showing these symptoms, as I said in my other post we have one other fish with raise scales and signs of bloating and one with a nasty growth over one eye (which it's had for years) but all the others seem perfectly fine.

I think I may have to try and seek professional help.

Thank you for all your help.
Zoe
 

fishin4cars

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The ulcer could be or could not be contagious. that's hard to say without first seeing under a microscope what actually caused it. The problem is if the water quality is a issue then treating the fish is only fixing part of the problem. Water changes should be the first thing you should work on. You'll need plenty of chlorine neutralizer but you can simply add some chlorine neutralizer then turn the hose on very slow and let the pond over flow for a few hours. Doing this once or twice a week for a few weeks will get the water back to a better condition. By that point you should have time to find out what caused the ulcer. A pond with good water quality and healthy fish most of the time the fish can actually heal on their very own if it hasn't gotten bad. the two pics you showed would not have healed with out treatment. The white one could be a internal ulcer, could be dropsy, could be a tumor, just so many possibilities. If no new fish have been added in some time I would say that contangous infection is probably the lesser of the issues you should be concerned with. If it is it's already there. Water changes are going to be cheaper in the long run than treating a whole pond with medication. Treating with medication doesn't do any good if your treating with one medication and your fish have something else. treating the water is going to make all the fish better in the long run.
 
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Zoe (just to clarify a bit), by "readings, " Fishin was talking about measurements of ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH. Did your father have a testing kit? If you can't find one at home, go to an aquarium store or a pet shop that has fish and get an API Freshwater Master Test Kit, and run all the tests on your pond water. Then tell us the results.

As has already been said, the symptoms you reported are usually the result of something wrong with one or more of these chemical measurements. To fix that, the first think you do is water changes until the chemical readings are all good. After that, we can make more suggestions about what to do.
 

fishin4cars

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Shakaho, Thank you for adding that, I have been using digital testers for so long now I really didn't remember the company that made that kit. for the money, ( Less than the cost of one nice Koi) that kits works great! I'm not a fan of test strips but even those are better than not knowing what the water is doing at all.
I laugh sometimes when people say that the ammonia level should read zero. With test kits like the one you showed and the test strips are designed not to show the low end spectrum of ammonia as not to confuse beginners that are starting to learn to use them, My meter reads ammonia all the time, EVEN Filtered tap water in our area contains .003-.006 ppm of ammonia. Most test kits start showing positive at .25-1ppm. 1 ppm is really already to a dangerous level as it is causing respiratory problems for the fish and is causing stress levels to elevate which makes diseases more prone. My digital unit reads .025-.050 in the pond and aquariums on most occasions. That reading is 100 times less than what a drop type kit will read and 1000 times less than what a test strip kit will read. But they cost 16 times more than those kits also. ( NOT CHEAP!) I lost a fish about two weeks ago in my 300 gallon pond. ( small 3" koi) It was alive when I checked it at 9am and the pond had a reading of .031 at 3pm when I found the fish I went and tested and it was already up to .079. I couldn't find any sign of decomp on the deceased fish but that short amount of time the reading had already climbed, some of that could be algae decomposing in the sun and waste from being fed earlier in the day but I want to say this so others can understand that ammonia is being produced in a pond 24 hrs a day all year long. yes even when the temp is right at freezing. it's just slowed way down due to the fish are then dormant and not producing body waste but there is still breakdown taking place for decomposition, and the bacteria are still feeding on that breakdown. Spring is when a lot of pond owners start noticing problems because the bacteria are trying to catch back up with the waste being produced and what has accumulated over the winter. Nitrates which are what is left over after the ammonia is broken down is now elevated and the best way to get those back down is water changes and lots of plant growth which uses the nitrates as a nutrient when they are growing. Dr. Dave taught me to read more on Dissolved Organics, I learned quite a bit in reading more about it. I tried installing a saltwater venturi protein skimmer on my pond, In less than two weeks I have noticed a great improvement in the foam that was on the surface, Lower ammonia readings, and clearer water. Using a good test kit showed me what I already knew but verified that the addition of removing proteins and DOC help in lowering the level that the aerobic bacteria were having to try and breakdown.
 

sissy

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He can take his water there also and they do the test and give you a printed read out at most pet store mine rage for test from 3 to 5 dollars and then they will try to help you figure out what to do .I use a home test in between but there tests are great
 

addy1

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That would be the easiest for them until they can get control of what is happening, like sissy said take some water into a pet store that sells fish and as for help
 

fishin4cars

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Good advice, But Make sure that the person testing the water actually knows what he or she is doing. I've run into chain store employee's that simply had no idea what they were talking about. If you go to a more specialized store that just deals with just fish your far more likely to find people that really know what to advise. If you doubt what they are telling you take the time to ask here and get a second opinion. If they advise a full clean out, starting over, or advise all kinds of products, You can bet you need to get that second opinion. Water should always be changed gradually, product use should always be limited and use of a product should in most cases be one product, Ask the employee if she or he has fish and how long, also ask a few questions you know the correct answer to but give them a little test and see if they are just sells persons, or actually knowledgeable fish keepers themselves.
 

sissy

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I take mine to a independent pet store because they offer a readout and some chain stores you do have to be careful of make sure they know what there doing .My tests usually only take an hour and they take time to explain everything on the readout that I may not understand for sure.You really still need a good home test no matter what .
 
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Ok so I've just been to a koi store in my home town and bought a testing kit (couldn't get API but got a different brand)

All the readings came back completly normal (according to the booklet). none of them were even slightly worrying!

What does everyone suggest I do? should I still do a water change? Or could the infected fish just be a 'one off'?
The grey fish in my other post seems to be getting worse. I'm not sure it's dropsy as the scales seem to only be sticking out on one side...I think he must have something wrong internally, unless of course its a she then I guess she could be pregnant, however we've had the fish for around 15 years and have never had babies from them (that I know of anyway)

Thanks again for all your help.
 

stroppy

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i would do a water change about 20% today have you got decolar to add with the new water ? also what type of filters have you got as your water did look a bit murky ...if the fish has dropsy theres little chance of it getting better ...sorry, im sure others can help you more ..
 
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zoeandoscar said:
Ok so I've just been to a koi store in my home town and bought a testing kit (couldn't get API but got a different brand)

All the readings came back completly normal (according to the booklet). none of them were even slightly worrying!

What does everyone suggest I do? should I still do a water change? Or could the infected fish just be a 'one off'?
The grey fish in my other post seems to be getting worse. I'm not sure it's dropsy as the scales seem to only be sticking out on one side...I think he must have something wrong internally, unless of course its a she then I guess she could be pregnant, however we've had the fish for around 15 years and have never had babies from them (that I know of anyway)

Thanks again for all your help.

Fish arent mammals. They dont get pregnant. They lay eggs. But Koi eat their own eggs (and even young fish), unless there are plenty of "safe" spots in the pond, its not unheard of to never get, or at least see, any offspring.

Im afraid I cant offer much advice on the illness, but I would definitely seek professional help ASAP. A few years ago, we had one dead Koi in a 30 year old pond. The next day another. Third day we had 3 dead and only then did we seek help and found out it was some parasite that was easily treated with some product. Too late for many of them. Dont wait, go now. If you can catch a fish, take him to the Koi dealer for examination, or ask him to come to your pond. It really isnt that expensive, especially not if you consider what Koi's of that size are worth. Replacing just one of them will pay for many visits.
 

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