Depth of Intake Bay?

[YShahar]

Hi Pondering Ponders,

Any received wisdom on the depth of an intake bay? I'm a bit constrained in terms of surface area, having a space of about 1 meter square to work with. If need be, I could even make the intake bay 1.5 meters long, though I'm not sure if anything would be gained by that.

The question now is: how deep do I need to make it?

Also, is there any reason to use Aquablox (or my local equivalent -- milk crates) rather than just putting a "centipede" style pipe along the bottom and connecting that to my DIY pump vault? My thinking is that if I go the pipe route (assuming I can find a culvert-style pump that would work) I could simply slope the bottom towards the pipe and fill with the various grades of rock. Any drawbacks to this approach?

Cheers!

 

[TheFishGuy]

I think @combatwombat has an intake bay on his build, so he may be of some use to you!

 

[combatwombat]

I don't have an intake bay, but I studied them extensively before choosing the negative edge. The important thing really is surface area. Depth is not very critical as long as it's not too shallow.

The way aquascape inc designs them, they look for 1 gallon of storage per GPM of the pumping system. So, if pumping 5,000 GPH, that's about 85 GPM, so you need about 85 gallons of storage capacity. They also spec the weir to be about 1' wide per 8,000 GPH and to plan for about 6" of water depth over the weir. But the shallower the weir depth is, the better the surface draw you'll get, but less flexibility on water level fluctuation.

Check out ozponds on Youtube. He designed his intake bay the way you're talking about—used a culvert half-pipe sold one of their building supply stores (he's in australia) and connected to a 40 gallon olive barrel for a pump vault. Seems to work great for him.

 

[YShahar]

Thanks @combatwombat ! Good specs to go by in terms of water storage. I'll need to do some volume calculations for the whole pond then and start from there.

 

[GBBUDD]

I made my intake bay a little different from what i saw in the videos. while also having the negative edge.

From the pond i have a 1 foot wide gap in the pond wall where the water gets pulled into What we have called the dead pool. Long story but it's in my showcase . the smaller the intakes opening and the shallower it is the stronger the intake has pull . the stronger the pull the more it pulls debris into it, so the width is a foot the depth is also a foot even thought he water is 2 feet deep in this area on both sides of the opening. . but from there is a 17 foot length where the leaves etc. come into a larger area where the water then slows down and what ever got pulled in has a chance to settle as i do get a good amount of leaves at the foot of the negative edge. So the intake worked as suck pulling stuff in it settles like the intake but there's an over flow / negative edge that drops in a water fall to a catch basin and the pump vault which is actually an aqua bock custom cut and the intake for the pump is in the block and that's burred under 3 and 4 inch rock.

What am in saying? good question.. that a thinner shallower will work more like a skimmer and pul in the surface area more then at all levels of the pond. i do believe that is the best route yeah i don't like the idea of debris falling into the pond and falling to the bottom . i'd after it got pulled in and then allowed to settle in a 24" depth over a 6 foot depth

 

[YShahar]

Well, theoretically, I could make this a negative edge, though probably doing it at the same water level as the pond will be simpler.

So if I understand you correctly, your full depth is 3 feet (say about 90 cm) and extends 17 feet in total?

The area I've got to work with is between our patio and a planting area. The patio is slowly disintegrating, so I've got no problem taking more of it apart to get more space for the intake bay. I could probably carve out an area 2 meters long (call it 6 feet) by 1 meter wide (about 3 feet). Presumably then, I could use the calculation of volume that @combatwombat mentioned above to decide on the depth.

I like the way ozponds did his setup. Just need to see if I can find some culvert pipe. I priced the stuff new and it's expensive. What I need is a junkyard that doesn't mind me combing through the rubbish! The fallback will be milk crates, which I can buy locally. Even new, they aren't all that pricey.

 

[combatwombat]

Milk crates really do work great. If they’re easy to source and inexpensive, I wouldn’t hesitate to use them. You could also use plastic pallets.

 

[GBBUDD]

PICTURSES

your full depth is 3 feet (say about 90 cm) and extends 17 feet in total?

The intake bay is 2 feet deep it has a 1 foot opening to the pond but once the water enters the intake the area opens up and allows the water to slow down and be pulled toward the negative edge slowly. This way the leaves etc drop to the bottom and can be scooped up easily or vacuumed out. There's a better description / pictures in my showcase. along with how it was built and mistakes made at 3:35 the cameras looking at a tree stump in the water . the rock to the left is what cuts the pond off from the intake leaving the 1 foot opening.

AT 55 SEC IS A VIEW FROM THE OTHER SIDE LOOKING AT THE INTAKE BAY OR AS WE CALL IT DEAD POOL " i hate caps"

and at 2:32 is a better view of the opening

 

[YShahar]

@GBBUDD this is beautiful!

If I had a way to bring in some machinery, I'd consider doing something like this with the negative edge running to a rain reservoir under our patio. We'll be pulling the old stone and mortar off the patio in the next year or two anyway, so I'd love to dig it down and fill it with aquablox (or milk crates more likely). But given yeah, that would need an excavator, alas...

 

[GBBUDD]

if i had no option of equipment im not sure i would did it by hand. At least i know it wouldn't be anywhere near as big or deep. thank you

 

[YShahar]

So work on the intake bay has begun in earnest! Here are some photos of how it's going so far. The intake bay is going to be in a little "alcove" in the patio, so it will be part of the view from the seating area. The area I have to work with is about 1m wide and 2.2 m long, so not a very big area. Still, it's a major headache to dig out, given that once I get the topsoil off, I have to hack at the rock from the side; it's way too hard to go in from the top.

This first photo shows the progress as of stop of work on Friday afternoon. Because I need the soil for the stream area on the other side of the pond, I'm pickaxing it into a garden wagon and then hauling it out of the deep end and up the slope. Takes a bit of doing, I can tell you!

And here's where it stands as of stop of work this afternoon:

Top soil is mostly off the whole area and I'm slowly getting down to the rock beneath. All those roots are from a pepper tree, which we sadly had to cut down, as it was taking over the whole garden. In fact, it was the removal of that tree that finally decided me to finish the pond this year; with it there, the amount of detritus falling into the pond would have made it impossible to maintain!

Here's how the intake bay looks thus far from inside the pond:

The blue Ikea bags in the distance, as well as the big black rubber bucket are all filled with the sand that was under the patio pavers. Figured I can reuse that as cushioning for the stream bed. For the pond itself, I'll need to pay for a sand delivery (and rig up some way to get it down three flights of stairs!).

Oh, and I've ordered feather wedges from Amazon to try to split that big rock sticking out of the pond wall. Not sure I'll succeed, but worth a try!

 

[YShahar]

if i had no option of equipment im not sure i would did it by hand. At least i know it wouldn't be anywhere near as big or deep. thank you

Yep, that's my constraint as well. I'd love to turn the whole garden into one big water feature, but it's just too much to do. I think if we had actual soil, rather than rock on top of rock, I might be tempted. As it is, my effort to get at that one huge boulder on the bottom induced me to go deeper than I had originally planned. All to the good, considering that summer temperatures have gone up so much in recent decades. The poor fish are going to need someplace cool to chill!

 

[TheFishGuy]

So work on the intake bay has begun in earnest! Here are some photos of how it's going so far. The intake bay is going to be in a little "alcove" in the patio, so it will be part of the view from the seating area. The area I have to work with is about 1m wide and 2.2 m long, so not a very big area. Still, it's a major headache to dig out, given that once I get the topsoil off, I have to hack at the rock from the side; it's way too hard to go in from the top.

This first photo shows the progress as of stop of work on Friday afternoon. Because I need the soil for the stream area on the other side of the pond, I'm pickaxing it into a garden wagon and then hauling it out of the deep end and up the slope. Takes a bit of doing, I can tell you!


View attachment 148028

And here's where it stands as of stop of work this afternoon:
View attachment 148029
Top soil is mostly off the whole area and I'm slowly getting down to the rock beneath. All those roots are from a pepper tree, which we sadly had to cut down, as it was taking over the whole garden. In fact, it was the removal of that tree that finally decided me to finish the pond this year; with it there, the amount of detritus falling into the pond would have made it impossible to maintain!

Here's how the intake bay looks thus far from inside the pond:
View attachment 148031

The blue Ikea bags in the distance, as well as the big black rubber bucket are all filled with the sand that was under the patio pavers. Figured I can reuse that as cushioning for the stream bed. For the pond itself, I'll need to pay for a sand delivery (and rig up some way to get it down three flights of stairs!).

Oh, and I've ordered feather wedges from Amazon to try to split that big rock sticking out of the pond wall. Not sure I'll succeed, but worth a try!

Looks good! You are going to have a sweet pond setup once you are finished.

 

[combatwombat]

Don’t recall how big your pond will be, but an intake doesn’t need to be very big to be effective, especially if you don’t have a ton of leaf drop.

 

[YShahar]

Looks good! You are going to have a sweet pond setup once you are finished.

I sure hope so! The view from the patio is really pretty even with all the construction junk in the way. Can't wait to see it finished (if I don't keel over from hauling all that rock)!