Do I need a heater in 8a zone for 125 gallon pond with fish

[Pat Franciskato]

Heater needed for winter? Located in zone 8a and have about 12 fish in 125 gallon pond. Any suggestions. New at having a pond with fish in it. I have 2 small ponds about 125 gallon for each one. The one with the fish in it is above ground with retaining wall built around it. I have 4 goldfish and the rest are koi. My other option is bring them in for the winter and set up an aquarium but my space is limited so looking for suggestions to keep my fish thriving through the winter. Thanks

 

[Mmathis]

Well, that's a loaded question and you're going to get all kinds of comments -- but regarding the size and fish load rather than whether you need a heater or not.

In ponds, heaters are used to keep a hole open in the ice [for air and gas exchange]. It's a misconception that they are used to heat ponds. So, in zone 8a [I'm in the 8a/8b crossover area], freezing isn't usually a problem....well, sometimes, but not the deep and prolonged freezes that folks up north see. A shallow pond is more likely to freeze than a deeper one, and I'm assuming yours are fairly shallow?

For an alternative to an aquarium, you might want to look into a large plastic tote that you could set up like an aquarium -- the larger the better. Your main objcetive here is going to be keeping the water quality good.

Hope this helps!

 

[Pat Franciskato]

Well, that's a loaded question and you're going to get all kinds of comments -- but regarding the size and fish load rather than whether you need a heater or not.

In ponds, heaters are used to keep a hole open in the ice [for air and gas exchange]. It's a misconception that they are used to heat ponds. So, in zone 8a [I'm in the 8a/8b crossover area], freezing isn't usually a problem....well, sometimes, but not the deep and prolonged freezes that folks up north see. A shallow pond is more likely to freeze than a deeper one, and I'm assuming yours are fairly shallow?

For an alternative to an aquarium, you might want to look into a large plastic tote that you could set up like an aquarium -- the larger the better. Your main objcetive here is going to be keeping the water quality good.

Hope this helps!

Yes we don't have bad winters, not like up north, but we do have odd weather at times, so I don't want to get into the situation of having my fish outdoors, and we get one of those rare cold snaps that everything freezes, and I am not prepared for keeping my fish healthy. No my pond is shallow, preformed pond. I plan to make my backyard pond deeper in the future without use the preformed pond liners, but that is another project for another day.
So using the tote, is that just for days that have the hard freeze? Again and you probably know as well, we can have 70-80 degree weather one day and freezing the next day, just so unpredictable ups and downs.

 

[sissy]

I would not worry so much about freeze as like said way to many fish for that size pond .if you do go with a tote either get a heavy duty one or 2 totes and put one inside the other .You would not want it to bulge and break .I really don't know of a heater small enough for your pond .Koi get very large mine are around 2 ft long after 11 years

 

[Mmathis]

@Pat Franciskato Actually, I don't think I would move the fish back & forth depending on the weather, that could be more stressful than just leaving them outside. What I meant was to move them indoors or to a less exposed location for the duration of the winter. Do you have a covered porch or patio....some place that's not quite as exposed to the elements? This might be an alternative to keeping them inside.

Or leave them where they are and maybe do something like cover the pond with a heat absorbing something-or-other [but leave an open place for air]. You could make a frame out of PVC pipe that would fit over the edges, and glue or zip-tie some black landscape fabric over that as a cover. It would be light enough for you to move so you could check on the fish. And on really warm "winter" days, you could take it off all together. Yes, now I like that idea better than moving them to a tote. But it's whatever works best for you.

And like Sissy said, if you do get totes, get heavy-duty ones and yes, doubling them is a great idea. They will bulge and can break.

It's good that you're thinking about this now while there's plenty of time to prepare. You'd be surprised how many people don't plan ahead.

 

[Pat Franciskato]

I can make something to go over the pond. I understand that you mentioned too many fish for the size of pond, these are very small koi at this time, as they grow, I have another pond that I will be putting some of them in, but I want to make that pond much larger over the winter time. I am trying to think ahead, for when they grow, for when it gets cold, and prepare. I do know they will outgrow the area they are in, so it is not a permanent home. A coworker has a pond and said he just runs his pump all winter long, never ices over, and his fish (1 fish) does fine. I just wanted to take the best route for keeping the fish safe over the cold months, and consulting what others in my area(zone) might do or suggest to do.
May I ask, if I went the route of the landscape fabric(which I have a lot of), how will that work for protection of freeze? Don't mean to ask a dumb question. I also had seen some plastic thick bubble wrapped material at lowes, that you put over pools and outdoor jacuzzi tubs for the winter. Why could that not be used, if a place cut in it for air ?

 

[MitchM]

Heater needed for winter? ...

No.
I think an airstone should be plenty for your area.
Low water temperatures are not a concern for goldfish or koi.
I agree that your pond is overstocked, so that brings it's own set of problems apart from overwintering concerns.

I don't think a hole cut in a plastic insulating cover will be sufficient. You should have some active water movement as well.
Admittedly, I really don't know much about your weather conditions.

 

[Mmathis]

@Pat Franciskato Bubble wrap might work, but remember that you still need for air to be able to circulate. The only thing I would worry about is 1)if the bubble wrap sat directly on the water, there would be no air exchange, and 2) the bubble wrap might increase the heat too much. I'm sorry, but I don't have any experience along those lines. Again, you're not trying to heat the pond, but just keep it above freezing. Please don't overthink this.....

Maybe some other folks will chime in with their opinions & experiences. @Meyer Jordan @addy1 @Dave 54 @callingcolleen1 ........just rattling off names.

 

[Mmathis]

No.
I think an airstone should be plenty for your area.
Low water temperatures are not a concern for goldfish or koi.

I don't think a hole cut in a plastic insulating cover will be sufficient. You should have some active water movement as well.
Admittedly, I really don't know much about your weather conditions.

I tend to agree about putting anything over the pond -- other than maybe weed block. I'm not sure where the OP lives exactly, but I'm in the same "zone." Our winters are mild. My water temps in the pond have never dropped below the high 30's, and I've never had my water freeze except where there is splashing from the returns. The problem is that we do occas. have a good cold snap which can last up to a week, and I have seen water in exposed areas freeze solid -- maybe several inches deep. If that were to happen, I can see a 125 gal. pre-form freezing enough to turn fish into ice cubes -- but then the next day the sun will be out and we're all wearing short sleeves.

 

[Pat Franciskato]

I am located in central Ms. So I have that odd weather. I have a fountains in my pond. The second pond last year did not freeze over, and I did not have the waterfall/pump on in it. Yes I am afraid with our weird weather that we would get that dip down and have ice cube fish. I have a retaining wall around my pond so anything on top would not sit directly on the pond.

 

[tbendl]

Hey welcome Pat, I'm in South MS. I didn't do anything last winter but I didn't have fish. I don't plan on doing anything differently this winter either but you guys do get a little more severe weather up there and you don't have the depth. Sorry I don't have better info for you, just wanted to welcome another MS to the group.

 

[Mmathis]

@Pat Franciskato Can you post a picture so we can see what you are dealing with? What your pond and set-up look like.....

One thing you might consider, when/if you do wake up to a frozen pond, is to slowly pour very warm [I hesitate to say "hot" since your pond is so small] over a spot, just to melt the ice enough for air exchange to take place. You're probably not going to have enough prolonged "freeze" there, so this might help. And when/if your pond does freeze, it's probably not going to go all the way over night -- it will take a day or so -- that's in our climate, anyway.

 

[Pat Franciskato]

Hey welcome Pat, I'm in South MS. I didn't do anything last winter but I didn't have fish. I don't plan on doing anything differently this winter either but you guys do get a little more severe weather up there and you don't have the depth. Sorry I don't have better info for you, just wanted to welcome another MS to the group.

Thanks for the welcome! Do you have fish now? I saw last year that south Ms got snow at times, when central Ms did not. So never can count on the weather in Miss being predictable.

 

[tbendl]

Yes I added 6 fish about 2 months ago and already have babies. My understanding is they are hardy so I won't do anything different except stop feeding them.

 

[Pat Franciskato]

Still deciding what I plan to do....I have a green house that I will be putting up to house my plants. Might be an option to put them inside the green house, as I do have another form pond not being used. I still have not ruled out the aquarium inside. I got the fish to help with stress levels from work. Come home and sit back and watch them, soothing!! Since they are small fish at this time, I really don't want to hide my fish for a couple of months, as I enjoy seeing them daily. But the importance is keeping them healthy and alive. Like I had mentioned, I don't have fish in the backyard pond with the waterfall. That is also a preformed pond about 125. I want to remove the form and make that into a larger pond (deeper/wider) and not use a form, but the liner. I just have not started that project yet. Then I can move the Koi into that garden pond.