Do you have an HDRPE liner from American Tilapia / Florida Tilapia / Pondliner USA? How's that going for you?

[combatwombat]

I think most of you know how it's going for me. POORLY. And I know there are a number of members here using one of these liners. I want to know if I'm the only one here. I know I'm not the only one with this problem because I recently unearthed some youtube videos of people with the exact same problems.

So, sound off please. Do you have one of these liners? How's it going for you? I hope for your sake is going really well.

@TheFishGuy , @poconojoe: I know both of you are using these liners. Problem free? No leaks?

 

[poconojoe]

Sorry to hear you are having problems.

I have an HDRPE liner from American Talapia in my bog. It has been trouble free since the Spring of 2020.

What specific problems have you had?

 

[combatwombat]

Sorry to hear you are having problems.

I have an HDRPE liner from American Talapia in my bog. It has been trouble free since the Spring of 2020.

What specific problems have you had?

30+ small, seeping leaks and a leaking factory seam. Was losing 250 gal/day before patching one of the larger ones.

 

[Mmathis]

Curious, but what is HDRPE made of? All I’m familiar with are PVC and EPDM.

 

[combatwombat]

Most other places that sell it just call it RPE—reinforced polyethelene. It is a layer of woven (aka reinforced) HDPE sandwiched between two layers of LDPE.

 

[poconojoe]

30+ small, seeping leaks and a leaking factory seam. Was losing 250 gal/day before patching one of the larger ones.

Have you contacted the supplier?
Especially for the fact that the factory seam gave out.
They might be able to blame nature for the small holes, but the seam, there's definitely no excuse for that.

 

[combatwombat]

Have you contacted the supplier?
Especially for the fact that the factory seam gave out.
They might be able to blame nature for the small holes, but the seam, there's definitely no excuse for that.

I wrote to them yesterday requesting a call to discuss next week. Will see what happens.

But here’s the thing: I have 2 years built on top of what appears to be a crumbling foundation.

Short of writing a $100k check to have this all redone by a pro builder in month or two, what could they possibly do to fix the problem? And what are the odds they’re going to do that?

I had this same experience some years ago with a deck stain. I followed the application instructions perfectly, documented it, and it still started failing after one season.

Called the company, they reviewed my documentation, and said, “Yep, you’re right. We’re going to refund the $150 you spent on our product. Sorry about that.”

And I said, “What about the $1,000” it will cost to hire someone to remove your product and reapply another?”

“Sorry, our warranty excludes labor.”

…checks warranty laws…

Yep, that’s totally legal (in most places). Buyer beware.

 

[GBBUDD]

The year and a half exposed and blowing around is the tough sell here as I see it in one of your time lapse videos you cab see the 6 feet of extra liner close to the deck being blown straight up. From what I can remember..

 

[poconojoe]

I wrote to them yesterday requesting a call to discuss next week. Will see what happens.

But here’s the thing: I have 2 years built on top of what appears to be a crumbling foundation.

Short of writing a $100k check to have this all redone by a pro builder in month or two, what could they possibly do to fix the problem? And what are the odds they’re going to do that?

What are you referring to when you say a crumbling foundation? The liner?

Is the liner installed in a pond or bog?

 

[poconojoe]

If you have to remove the liner, you will see if there are any rocks or other sharp objects under there that may have caused all the holes or it just somehow developed the many holes due to a manufacturer defect.
But, there's absolutely no excuse for the seam splitting.

What, if any, did you use as an underlayment?
Did you spread a layer of sand?
How's your soil? Is it rocky?

 

[combatwombat]

What are you referring to when you say a crumbling foundation? The liner?

Yep.

Is the liner installed in a pond or bog?

Both.

If you have to remove the liner

That would take months with my current schedule, lots of equipment rental, and some magical place to store the boulders removed. Not an option I can stomach.

What, if any, did you use as an underlayment?

Woven road building fabric under and over liner. I’m hindsight, I wouldn’t do this again or recommend it. Should have used carpet or non-woven fabric. But this liner is advertised as “no underlayment required” so I thought I was going above and beyond.

Did you spread a layer of sand?

No, but the the bottom of the excavation was basically native sand. Loamy/sandy soil above that.

How's your soil? Is it rocky?

No. Very soft. Some smooth, round field stones, but every stone/twig/root/etc. within the excavation was removed.

I do hope like hell that it’s just around the top where the liner was treated more roughly and draped over the ground with no underlayment.

The year and a half exposed and blowing around is the tough sell here as I see it in one of your time lapse videos you cab see the 6 feet of extra liner close to the deck being blown straight up. From what I can remember..

I would be happy as hell if that were the extent of the damage and it was my fault.

 

[poconojoe]

Geeze that's horrible.

You said you were losing 250 gallons before patching one of the larger ones.
How much is it losing now since the patch? Was the 250 gallons the pond, bog or combination of both?
Are both the pond and bog losing water as separate entities?

Idk....maybe you'll have to drain, clean and patch since it would be a tremendous undertaking to replace the liner(s).

 

[TheFishGuy]

I am having a small problem with it in my waterfall but it is hard to say if it is the liner or just by terrible waterfall construction skills. I really hope you get all of this figured out! It would be a real bummer to have to redo the liner…

 

[combatwombat]

How much is it losing now since the patch?

I think 100 gal/day, so might have fixed 150gal/day with that one little patch. Can't confirm yet as it keeps raining every 4-6 hours since a day after the patch. Had a 12 hour stretch where I measured 50 gal of loss, extrapolated to 100/day. Would like to see a day or two go by with that # confirmed.

Was the 250 gallons the pond, bog or combination of both?

Unknown at this point. Mostly the pond, I think. I have a negative edge, so until I take the time to isolate all three parts of the feature, I won't know for sure. I wanted to patch the leaks I know I have before bothering with that.

Are both the pond and bog losing water as separate entities?

Unknown for now.

Idk....maybe you'll have to drain, clean and patch since it would be a tremendous undertaking to replace the liner(s).

Yes, and I'm fine with that. If there's a big leak from damage and I can find it and fix it, that is the best case scenario. Would take it in a heart beat. My fear at this time is that there are 100 leaks and each one is bleeding a gallon per day. That is liner failure.

 

[poconojoe]

Damn.
Well, I guess time will tell.
Once it stops raining and you can isolate each feature, then maybe you can get a better idea of what is going on.

I really hope it's just some stupid external plumbing leak. That would be a much better scenario.