greetings! ...need assurance and advice.

[clive xavier]

hey there.

i've been lurking on the forums for the last couple of days. my wife and i bought our house in december. one of the selling features (to me at least) were the ponds in the backyard. as long as i've wanted to own a house, i've wanted a pond in the backyard.

when we found this place it was ideal as there were already 2 ponds constructed.

the large one is 2400 gals. partially below ground. it's 3.5 deep in the middle, the shallow part is 2ft 10". the pond is 15' 10" long. it's 12 ft. wide at the deep end and 7' 10" wide at the shallow end.

i78.photobucket.com/albums/j94/lockedandloadedkillah/IMG00215.jpg

currently there's a pool style command filter unit with little to no filter media in it. the pump hasn't run since before we moved in. i tried to run the pump (a GE industrial style pump) the pump has power to it, but nothing happens. like it's seized.

i78.photobucket.com/albums/j94/lockedandloadedkillah/IMG00217.jpg

i78.photobucket.com/albums/j94/lockedandloadedkillah/IMG00216.jpg

2 bubblers have run non-stop. there are 4 fish in there. maybe koi maybe something else. the water has gotten considerably darker as the weather's warmed up.

i want to install a skippy style filter. i'm undecided if i want to use two 55 gal blue drums or one 110 gal stock tank. i change my mind 20 times a day on that. also, i've read all the great stickied threads in the DIY section, but i'm totally confused on a few things.

currently, the pond is set up like this: skimmer -> filter -> pump -> inlet.

i want to install the skippy near the back of the pond (near the fence)in the deep end and have the second 55 gal provide a waterfall. if i do that, i'm guessing i'd have to cap off the old inlet as the water fall would become the inlet, is this correct? i was thinking about just putting a ball valve on the old inlet for draining purposes.

to install the 2 barrel skippy or stock tank i'm thinking i have to go:

skimmer -> pump -> 1st barrel -> 2nd barrel -> waterfall (input)

is this correct or am i waaaay out to lunch. this conundrum is actually keeping me up at night. i think about it all day. i sketch the layout over and over and i'm just not 100% this is correct.

can i incorporate the exisiting pool filter into a sort of pre-pump filter?

skimmer>pre-filter>pump>barrel 1> barrel 2> water fall / inlet

i'm planning to buy a SEQUENCE 750 series 4600 gph is this too much pump for my application? i figured for only $10 more it'd be worth it to have the extra GPH. it comes with a basket strainer and a priming pump.

for filter media i plan on using a mix of floor scrubbing pads in a bird netting bag, bacti-twist and whatever else. i understand skippy sells the floor pads already cut up. can they not be used whole?

i'm wicked anxious to get going on this, but like i mentioned i'm not entirely sure my plans are feasible.

we also have a smaller pond near the house, that's approx. 200 gals. i just put goldies in there. oh, also there's a bog pond in the corner of the yard that has water plants of some sort in it.


one day i'd like to have the large pond overflow into a basin and then flow into a stream into the smaller pond and have that pumped back into the skippys at the large pond.

...of course there'd be a bridge!

thanks a bunch in advance for any advice / assistance. this is quite a nice community you folks have going here. :beerchug:

 

[clive xavier]

thinking outloud.

well after reading on here, you can add tap water if it won't exceed 10% of your capacity...

i topped the large pond off, tried to get the pump going, with no luck. i skimmer flushed a bunch of oak pollen and debris out. then washed the pond to the shallow end, where debris could cling to some plants. at dusk, i could actually see the 4 fish in there snacking on bugs. they were quite lively. usually, they snap up some pellets and just disappear.

i haven't ordered the pump yet, but i think i'll be going with the sequence 750 4600 gph. i suppose i'll just slow the flow down if the falls are too quick. i thought i could score some free blue barrels, but that's not working out. i'm just going to get the 110 gal stock tank. less piping to worry about vs the twin 55s. also, i'll need considerably less rock to conceal it.

 

[jethro13]

Re: thinking outloud.

if you have a soft drink bottling plant close to you you might try them for your barrels. I know the Pepsi plant near me used to give them away on certain days.

 

[koikeepr]

Car washes want to get rid of 'em too. The soap to wash the cars with comes in those barrels. If you get two barrels, run them in parallel with a tee to the pump and not one behind the other.

 

[clive xavier]

thanks jethro and koi keeper.

ahhh!

i was always playing on running them side by side, but thought the first barrel would over flow into the second and then waterfall out into the pond.

so instead i'll just position the pump between the 2 barrels, with a straight pipe outta the outlet to a T and fill both barrels simultaneously. does that mean both barrels will flow out as waterfalls? or should i tie them back together to make one output?

i was considering going with the stock tank simply because i thought it'd be easier and cheaper to plumb, take less rocks and plants to conceal and offer less chance for leakage with fewer connections. i can get blue barrels from deltona, which is a bit of trek for $20 each. so it'd still be cheaper than a stock tank from TSC for $69. hmm.


so then; i'll run it: skimmer -> pump -> barrels -> pond?

i have the existing pool filter, i'd like to utilize as a prefilter.. are the sequence pumps decent at handling solids?

 

[clive xavier]

here's some pics. the first includes permanently fixed items and also where'd i'd like to place the skippy filter.

...after looking at it. that's probably not the best placement of the filter system. i think i might put it at the far right side where there's currently an incorporated flower bed. wouldn't that allow better overall filtration? i could have one barrel flow out into pond as the water fall and have the other piped backed into the pond thru the existing inlet.

hmmm. it'd also allow and nice divide between the dining patio and the pond.

here's the existing skimmer and pool filter set up.

current pump that is downsteam of the pool filter.

lastly our smaller pond near the house.

 

[clive xavier]

possible configuration.

does this seem feasible?

i like the idea of having the stock tank filter / waterfall in this location, because:

• it'll fit the space perfectly
• concealing the area with rocks and plants will be easy
• it'll provide a nice divide between the dining area (standing up you'll be able to see over the filter / falls and into the pond)

any reason why this configuration will not work?

-thanks.

 

[koikeepr]

ok, lots of stuff going on here.

First of all, I see your pump laying on the floor uncovered. That's a no-no for most pumps as they need to be protected from the elements. I'm not sure why you need the pump to handle "solids." your filters should be catching all that BEFORE it hits the pump. The sequence also has a leaf trap before it that will catch any bigger things that may go in. You should be placing your pump at least on a brick so it doesn't get saturated and cover it with at minimum a plastic laundry basket that you can place upside down on top of it.

You can tie your barrels back together so that the is a single flow out, yes. You really shouldn't have your skimmer going directly into your pump. I would tee it in after the pump if I were you. The water there is already "skimmed", so putting it through the pump is not necessary.

Either way you can do a stock tank or barrels.

 

[koikeepr]

oh, and don't forget you'll need a swing check valve before that stock tank so that the water in there doesn't go rushing back into the pond if you have a power outage. You can put it right on the outlet of the pump.

 

[clive xavier]

ok, lots of stuff going on here.

First of all, I see your pump laying on the floor uncovered. That's a no-no for most pumps as they need to be protected from the elements. I'm not sure why you need the pump to handle "solids." your filters should be catching all that BEFORE it hits the pump. The sequence also has a leaf trap before it that will catch any bigger things that may go in. You should be placing your pump at least on a brick so it doesn't get saturated and cover it with at minimum a plastic laundry basket that you can place upside down on top of it.

You can tie your barrels back together so that the is a single flow out, yes. You really shouldn't have your skimmer going directly into your pump. I would tee it in after the pump if I were you. The water there is already "skimmed", so putting it through the pump is not necessary.

Either way you can do a stock tank or barrels.

thanks for all your help so far koikeepr. the pump shown above is the one that i'll be replacing. i will create some sort of pump box to keep the elements out of the new one.

I'm not sure why you need the pump to handle "solids." your filters should be catching all that BEFORE it hits the pump. The sequence also has a leaf trap before it that will catch any bigger things that may go in.

i thought i'd be using the new pump to pump water into the filter. the waterflow would terminate at the filter / waterfall. the first 2400 gal cycle the pump would move, would technically be unfiltered. is this correct? of course leaves and large debris would be caught in the skimmer basket...

i'm a bit confused here, please bear with me.

is the steadfast schematic: skimmer > filter > pump?

the skimmer is where all the unfiltered water enters the system right?

so the pump is pulling the water thru the filter? i thought it was pumping water into the filter and letting it fill from the bottom up and flowing out as a waterfall.

thanks for your patience, i feel i'm missing one important element here. i don't know what it is, so i can't relay it.

 

[koikeepr]

ok, what you're confused about is gravity, I think. Your water line will determine how you can set things up and weather your pump is before or after the barrel/stock tank.

In your case, your case, your pond looks to be about 18" or so high. So, if you were gravity feeding your barrel, the top of the barrel would need to be no higher than 19-20 inches (just above water line to prevent overflow). Unless you can dig down and place your barrel into a pit to accomodate this fact, you need to do the reverse, which is pump feed your stock tank. This is not the most efficient way to do it, but it works perfectly fine with an external pump like the sequence.

It appears you have a pool skimmer instead of the standard pond filter. This is perfectly ok, but help me understand what is in your skimmer. Do you have any sponge or filter media in it, or is it completely empty and just serving to receive water?

In a pond skimmer, there is typically a leaf basked and a sponge of some sort to collect debris before it enters the filter. I am not sure if you can rig up a basket in yours to do so. If not, if I were you, I would put a barrel in BEFORE your bio barrel to act as a settlement barrel. In this case, you'd need to have the water enter that barrel first, and then enter the bio barrel. If you plan on going with a stock tank, then this would just be a smaller barrel before it. I think a 30 gal barrel would be fine. You can get these on Ebay for $30 bucks with shipping.

You would then use this barrel to collect the debris so that it will be easy to flush out and won't clog your bio barrel. I would make this smaller barrel exactly the way I made mine in the bio seciton. This barrel was a settlement barrel before my main bio filter. Here's the link to it.

If your barrels will be on the ground and above water line, you want your pump to PUSH the water through the filters. So, you would have your skimmer > pump w/ leaf trap> settlement barrel > bio filter/stock > waterfall

If your barrels/filters can be at water line (just an inch ot two taller to prevent overflow), which means you are running a gravity fed system, then I would do it as follows: skimmer > settlement barrel (if your skimmer is not equiped with a basket) > bio barrel > pump > waterfall.

Based on the little I am hearing about your system and from what I can see of it in the photos, I'm assuming your situation is option 1.

Feel free to ask as many questions as you like.

 

[clive xavier]

i got a 27 gal heavy duty tote from HD for $12. i'm going to use that as a skimmer / prefilter. i also scored a basket that fits inside the tote to serve as a leaf basket.

it is my plan to use the existing skimmer opening to dump into the basket that's in the tote. i'll have the basket elevated off the bottom of the tote slightly, incorporate a 2" bottom drain near the bottom.

i'll have a 2" outlet near the top of the tote where water will flow out to the *sequence 1000 series pump after passing thru some standard 1.5" pond filter media. what advantages does running the 2" up turned 45 offer? better flow? i plan on working that into the mix.

i'll install a 2" ball valve pre-pump to isolate it should i need to service it. should i install a 2" check valve after the pump? (my setup wll pump into the filter and gravity flow out as a waterfall) i'll definitely create some sort of pump containment house.

*the new sequence 1000 series are 2" inlet and 2" outlet. they also push farther and apparently, are more energy efficient.

thanks for all your help koikeepr. i talked to the guy i got the pump off today and that's when he told me about sequence switching up the pump design. i was half expecting it to actually be here today since it was supposed to have shipped on 05/03. looks like 5 more days to gather fittings and plan, plan, plan.

 

[DrDave]

I had one of those in use for about 2 1/2 years, then it cracked and fell apart. The weight of the water when it was in good shape was too much for the sides so I had to frame it with angle iron and a wooden spreader. It works, but not a good investment for long term.

 

[koikeepr]

I think Dr.D is correct. Totes like those are not great with hot weather and then cold, and they end up getting brittle over a short time. $12 may sound cheap on the get-go clive, but it's worth making an investment on a barrel of rubbermaid container. Just a few more pennies only.

 

[clive xavier]

hey dr dave and koi keepr. the tote i'm talking about is to work as a the pre-filter / skimmer contraption. i plan on getting a 100 or 150 gal stock tank for the main filter / waterfall later this week from TSC.

i hear what you're saying tho about it getting brittle and breaking down. in 2 years i'll have something better suited for the job.

hmm. maybe i'll just use the 27 gal tote as a pump house. it is a heavier duty one, boasting it can handle 750 lbs. it's not like sterilite thickness.

i blew a lot of my 'budget' on the pump. i've factored in the cost of the stock tank / pvc / media, but if i had to include a proper pond skimmer this project would never get going.

i'm really anxious to get it up and running is all. there's nothing happening except a few bubblers and i wanna save the 4 koi that have been living in there since we got the house in december.

do you guys think i could just use the current pool style skimmer as it sits and connect it to the sequence until i can get a proper pond skimmer going?

it's equipped with a 6" removable basket but that's it. if that can work it'd make my life a lot easier.

the delay from sequence is a temporary set-back but i'll gather additional supplies while i wait.

thanks for the feedback guys. i'll be back with a million more questions and concerns as this progresses.:lol: