Hello to All and HELP!

Discussion in 'Introductions' started by AlaPAMa, Apr 22, 2013.

  1. AlaPAMa

    AlaPAMa

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    We purchased a house 2 years ago that included a 3500-4000 gallon goldfish pond in the front yard. The pond was unattended for over a year in Central Virginia. It wasn't gross or grown up, just not clear water. I have never owned a pond before and had NO idea where to start. Last spring I had it drained & cleaned, at which time I learned that there were around 2 dozen Comet?Fish plus some guppies and a LOT of frogs. By summer it will be 3/4 covered with plants; 2 water lilies a large corkscrew rush, an invasive mint plant, a small arrow Arum, a bog iris & 3 Hibiscus Coccinineus. The pond guy told me that it would never be clear because it got too much full sun in the hottest part of summer?

    ANYWAY, my pond is not clear and I want it to be. After two years of research online (no sun/too much sun, UV Bio filter pump/trickle tower, Barley pellets/Barley Ball that the neighborhood dog thought was his toy, DefensePac, etc...), I think my HEAD WILL EXPLODE! I don't believe that brain matter is conducive to clear pond water. Although the fish might like it.
    Currently there is a 3 inch wide black film surrounding the pond edge......oh wait, it's moving.......zillions of tadpoles!

    Can anyone on this site help me clear up this matter (pun intended [​IMG])

    Thanks!
     
    AlaPAMa, Apr 22, 2013
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  2. AlaPAMa

    addy1 water gardener / gold fish and shubunkins Moderator

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    [​IMG] to our group!

    My pond is in full sun, sun up to sun down, it is never green or murky, usually no string algae, I use a bog to filter my system. Pea gravel and plants. For me it works fine, just fine.
     
    addy1, Apr 22, 2013
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  3. AlaPAMa

    Mmathis TurtleMommy

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    Welcome! You've come to the right place! Maybe the fish will take care of the tads for you :)

    So, what kind of pump & filtration do you have? Yes, sun is a problem, but there's a lot more that goes on, and ways to fix [or live with] it. Got pics? We love to see pics.
     
    Mmathis, Apr 22, 2013
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  4. AlaPAMa

    Waterbug

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    Step 1. Find a new pond guy. He's read some myths on the web and believed them. That's fine for owners, but when you're charging money I think you should actually know something.

    Back when I cleaned ponds I guaranteed clear (and we'd agree on a test for "clear") in 7 days and wasn't paid unless the definition of "clear" was met. Once cleared we could talk about more long term clear. To me the pond business means clear, people who pay always want clear. If you can't clear a pond in 7 days you shouldn't be in the business.

    The sun light myth is only related to green ponds (only one thing that effects clarity) and is based on the fact that sun light is one thing a plant needs to grow and reproduce. This leads to the myth that by reducing sun light all the algae in the pond will die. Sounds logical enough as long as you don't have much experience with ponds. Algae needs very little sun light. Algae will grow very well in a fish tank inside a house while getting virtually no sun light (house lights are a different kind of light). Even in complete darkness algae to remain alive for a very long time.

    Reducing sun light can reduce algae growth, so your pond would be less green, but it would still be green. Clear ponds on the other hand normally have water that is toxic to green water algae. Norm Meck's experiments poured water from a clear pond into water from a green pond and the algae was killed on contact. So clear ponds have nothing to do with sun light or nutrients.

    UV filters are 100% effective in clearing a green pond when installed and sized correctly. Other than copper based chemicals and oxidizers it is the only 100% effective, every single, can't miss, time.

    However, given the age of your pond, the amount of life, I'm guessing your "clear" problem isn't green water algae. I'm guessing a combination of things mainly related to decomposing organics, possibly some tannins and maybe a little bit of suspended algae. If you look really close can you see lots of ground pepper size bits of suspended stuff? Can you see the bottom? How deep? Submerge something white. How deep before you can't see it? Before it disappears what color does it become. Pretty much impossible to diagnose over the net.
     
    Waterbug, Apr 23, 2013
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  5. AlaPAMa

    AlaPAMa

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    Thanks for the warm welcome. You wouldn't believe how stupid one can be made to feel on some of these forums.

    TurtleMommy; I have a smartpond 700 GPH with UV light. I inherited it along with the pond. I would love to post photos (of one of my fish "taking care of the tadpoles") but I am not only new to this forum, I am new to "community life" therefore am not knowledgeable of posting photos thereon. :(

    Waterbug, I live in a very rural area and the pond guy who came out was the only guy I could find and he traveled 40 miles. I don't really want to have to hire someone but the web just has far TOO MUCH information from which a lay person to glean truth. Yes, I can see the particles floating. At the risk of quoting the pond guy again, he told me that the algae was very low.
    At the risk of being crucified by this and all pond forum, I don't feed the fish. I figured if they survived, and even thrived, over a year unattended that the 'circle of life' was well in place. Also, above referenced pond guy informed me that "the more you feed them, the more they poop thus more 'floating matter'". AND that there were twice as many fish in the pond as was viable.
    The pond is 15'x8' with 24" at the deepest point. I will attempt to do your white stick test to ascertain the depth at which it is still visible.

    addy1: I don't know what "I use a bog to filter my system" means. :/
     
    AlaPAMa, Apr 23, 2013
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  6. AlaPAMa

    addy1 water gardener / gold fish and shubunkins Moderator

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    It is a big plant filter/bog/gravel filter, up flow of water through pea gravel, planted with plants, that water falls back into my pond.

    Some like them some say they don't work. I have used them for years for my ponds. Here is a link to some info on building one.

    https://www.gardenpondforum.com/topic/6894-bog-building/
     
    addy1, Apr 23, 2013
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  7. AlaPAMa

    AlaPAMa

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    "Other than copper based chemicals and oxidizers it is the only 100% effective, every single, can't miss, time." Waterbug, I don't know what that means either ^_^
     
    AlaPAMa, Apr 23, 2013
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  8. AlaPAMa

    HTH Howard

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    UV lights loose their effectiveness over time. The water also has to be exposed to the light long enough for the algae to get a lethal dose of UV. Replace the bulb. Others know more then I do about the flow rate.

    We really need a picture to be of much help.
     
    HTH, Apr 23, 2013
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  9. AlaPAMa

    AlaPAMa

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    oh, and did I mention that since the addition of DefensePAC, I now have foam. I read that it could be pollen or fish sperm... what??


    IMG_2481.jpg Fish eating tadpoles :)
     
    AlaPAMa, Apr 23, 2013
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  10. AlaPAMa

    AlaPAMa

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    Well here goes nothing in the photo posting attempt:
    IMG_2481.jpg IMG_2482.jpg IMG_2483.jpg IMG_2484.jpg IMG_2485.jpg IMG_2486.jpg IMG_2487.jpg IMG_2488.jpg IMG_2489.jpg IMG_2490.jpg
     
    AlaPAMa, Apr 23, 2013
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  11. AlaPAMa

    AlaPAMa

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    I'm assuming you need a picture of the pump/filter..... here goes..... this filter sits inside a mesh drawstring bag. I have it sitting atop a cinderblock as the water is too deep for the lift.

    pond pump.jpg
     
    AlaPAMa, Apr 23, 2013
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  12. AlaPAMa

    DrCase Moderator Moderator

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    Welcome to the Forum
     
    DrCase, Apr 23, 2013
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  13. AlaPAMa

    HTH Howard

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    I think you need a real filter with some mechanical a bio media.. The one shown is not near enough. That is unless you are not shown us the filter.
     
    HTH, Apr 23, 2013
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  14. AlaPAMa

    bethbealmccue

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    we put up unbrellelas around pond,,,,, stops all the suna. and did a 1/3 wash out and chamge filter all the time, got a bio filter and had to drain it once to get all the sludge out of bottom,,, it worked
     
    bethbealmccue, Apr 23, 2013
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  15. AlaPAMa

    bethbealmccue

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    ur lucky...i need palnts and ave too many fish,,, i put an add last year in a free paper for free fish and had people come and get them,,,
     
    bethbealmccue, Apr 23, 2013
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  16. AlaPAMa

    bethbealmccue

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    i need plants not paints wheres the cheapest place to get them
     
    bethbealmccue, Apr 23, 2013
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  17. AlaPAMa

    bethbealmccue

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    oh we use pond salt too and flush pond let it overfill and add new water, we do this at least twice a month
     
    bethbealmccue, Apr 23, 2013
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  18. AlaPAMa

    bethbealmccue

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    yep it sounds llike the old pond i had that we had to drain and get rid of liner and rebuild,,,,,oh my
     
    bethbealmccue, Apr 23, 2013
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  19. AlaPAMa

    callingcolleen1 mad hatter

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    Hello! :) AlaPAMa, and good pond filter can do wonders. There are many to choose from. I choose to use a filter that goes before the pump, but many use a filter that attaches AFTER the pump. Either way a good filter is very nessary. I also feel the 750 GPH pump may not be large enough for 3500 gallon pond in full sun. You can also just attach a hose to the pump and run to other end of pond, to create a "flow". You can never go wrong adding more filteration when pond is in full sun.

    I would also take a close look at the edge of the pond, as I feel the outside sand and dirt may be seeping in as the plant beds look higher than the pond. This is a common mistake and I have seen lots of ponds where the outside nutrients were washing into the pond water during a heavy rain or just watering the plant beds would cause the dirt to seep into pond.
    Overflowing the pond may not work for you as your pond appears to be much lower than the surounding ground and plant beds, and you would risk having more dirt and extra nutrients wash into the pond from the ground.

    Your fish look big from what I can see, and murky water could just be coming in from outside. If you could take a closer look at your liner and see if you could lift the liner where needed and adjust the edges. You may have to get "creative" :) PS ... BIG WeLcOmE!
     
    callingcolleen1, Apr 23, 2013
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  20. AlaPAMa

    AlaPAMa

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    As I mentioned, I know nothing about any of this. The above attached photo is of the device that I clean monthly and makes the pretty little plume of water. I call it a filter.....is it not? It has an UV light in the encasement. Dare I repeat..... I know nothing of this.....which is why I joined this forum, to learn. I do want to learn. It appears that I have done nothing bad.... yet..... because I have too many fish and lots of healthy plants..... the water is just murky (suspended particles, see I do learn :smile: ). The house (and pond) was a foreclosure, the previous owner's evicted 3 years ago. The pond left to it's own devices for a year. Apparently they built the pond themselves. Unfortunately, as they were evicted, I have NO documentation, information on any of it. I didn't even know that the pump existed for several months. I saw a black cable, originally thought it was a snake, only to discovered a big, black, gooey thing attached to the other end, submerged in my pond. After I cleaned it, ran power to it, and resubmerged it, I learned that it was a fountain.
     
    AlaPAMa, Apr 23, 2013
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