Help First koi and its sick! (white fuzzy stuff)

[topofthehill1]

First the basics. New pond and New Koi. The first day seemed somewhat ok. I thought maybe he lost a scale at the fish store on his extraction from their tank but I wasn't overly worried about it. Second day still on bottom ate two pellets. Called store I bought him at they said maybe he was in temperature shock because he was inside and I put him outside. Today near the top of pond, will not eat and covered in white fuzzy stuff. I scoped him out of the pond and brought him to an indoor tank for treatment. But I have no idea what is wrong with him so here are the pictures. Very very hard water, ph 6, nitrite 0 and nitrate 0 reading from pond test strip. New pond. Temp 67 F

More info than most people probably want here. I am new to having a pond, last year I built a small pond above ground as a test pond and everything went well. So I dug a pond 4*11 and the deepest part of the pond is 3 feet to shallow about 2 feet with a liner. I filled it up added the gold fish and one shubukin from the above ground pond. Total of ten fish. most about 4-5 inches long. They were in the pond for about a week and I went and bought this koi. the nitrite and the nitrates have not moved from zero at all. The filtration is a pump in the tank that split to a fountain and a small sponge filter. I have had fish as long as I can remember but have never had a koi. Also I have no salt in the pond but I had not heard mention of that until today. I can not recall saving a fish ever once it had stopped eating so I am helping someone can help.

 

[fishin4cars]

You did good posting the info and pics. Now treating it, Hmm. First off I would treat with salt don't know how big the tank is your holding it in is but I woulds start at 1 cup per 100 gallons and increase from there. Second a GOOD anti-fungus medication. make sure to remove charcoal or activated carbon and treat as needed with antifungal meds.
Last but not least how long has this pond been set up? It takes a new pond aprox. three to 6 weeks to cycle, another month or more to stabalize. Looking at what I'm seeing from the pics I would say you appear to have someting out of line in the water, could be PH, hardness, or ammonia as they will all effect the skin of the fish. Double check and if possible have the person you got the fish from check it there and make sure your getting the correct readings. I have seen some test kits get old and give false readings. Don't try to feed him at all until you have him better stabalized, Starving is the least of your problem. Keep the water temp as stable as possible, 67-72 is perfect. can go a little warmer with no harm for treating but stable is the key. maybe someone else will chime in on a good medication for fungus, I can clearly see it, and it needs to be addressed ASAP.

 

[topofthehill1]

Thanks for your quick response. I will add that the pond is on its third week. The readings I was getting didn't really seem to show any sign of a "cycle" per say. One week no fish, second week goldfish only and third week added the one koi. I would think it should be understocked. I will try to have the water tested by someone else. The general hardness looked to be at least 60 and carbonate hardness around 80. I have no knowledge of hardness so I will get to reading I guess. going to get some salt and fungal meds Thanks for the advice. Not off to a good start with my first koi

 

[fishin4cars]

This is about the best article I could find for one that isn't eating, From what I was finding medicated foods are the best but if it isn'teating that won't do much good.
also I think you may be still a little early about seeing the pond cycle. In most cases it averages about to start a new pond to cycle without additives, if your way under stocked it could take as long as six weeks for the cycle to really take place. during that time ammonia is there and will slowly rise. that would be my #1 test I would have double checked.

hope this one helps.
Cotton wool or cotton ball disease is a charming name for Saprolegnia — a nasty fungus that grows when bad water quality stresses your koi. Expect to find it when the water contains quantities of uneaten food and when the pond has too many koi for its size.

Fungus can attack any weakened portion of a koi, from the skin to the gills. It usually takes hold opportunistically, when the koi are stressed. Be sure that you always check for the presence of fungus when your fish suffer an unrelated trauma or illness.

When a koi has cotton wool fungus, the fish develops what looks like a fine-textured fur coat over its body that's actually mold growing on the skin. Sometimes the fungus looks like a pale-orange or ivory-colored layer. As the disease progresses, the fungus grows longer, cotton-like tufts.

Treat this disease by correcting the conditions that lead to the outbreak:

Decrease the number of koi in the pond.
Improve water quality via partial water changes; an upgraded filtration system; an ammonia remover like AmQuel Plus or Zeolite; and increased aeration.
You can also use medication against the fungus. Adding methylene blue (a dye commonly used as a fish medication and available at most pet stores) to the pond at a rate of 1 teaspoon per 700 gallons helps kill the fungus, but individually treating each affected koi in a quarantine tub stops the progression of the disease much faster.

Either sedate the koi or hold it so you can remove the patches of fungus with a cotton swab. Then dab the affected spots first with malachite green (a fungicide) and then with propolis (an antibiotic and topical treatment). Return the fish to the quarantine tub and watch closely to make certain no secondary fungal or bacterial infection sets in.

 

[topofthehill1]

Thanks again, I feel like I might be on the right track with your help. I am pretty confident it is not cycled. But I thought it would survive a cycle sense my numbers looked good to me. I hate to make a sacrifice to the pond cycling gods. I guess I was wrong but I am shocked at how quickly he took a turn for the worse. Yes I think I will have my ammonia checked. I have had aquariums for about 20 years but pond experience is less than a year. And haven't had a sick fish in years and years. The only guy I can find near me with any fish knowledge that I actually believe sold me something called Pimafix which says its all natural extract from west indian bay trees. I dont know about all that but the active ingredient is pimenta racemosa. Its in a 30 gallon tank now. The disease description in right on. I might try the cotton swab technique as that looks like it would produce some quick results. If anyone doesnt think what I bought will work feel free to chime in.

 

[fishin4cars]

I can say, what have you got to lose? If you don't do anything it's going to die anyway. Give him salt and maybe try some stress coat. Those have been tried and proven to help. The med. if it says it will help surely has been tested on fish so I would give it a shot. I've used Hydrogen Peroxide on sores and it's helped too.

 

[talal101]

I'm sorry I don't know what to say to help you but I just want to say that I sympathize with you because I have been in the very same situation and right now I don't think I will be buying anymore koi for a little while

 

[topofthehill1]

Well just so its complete, last night it looked to be in better shape. Quarantine tank with salt, stress coat, and anti-fungal. Woke up this morning and it was dead. So frustrating. I appreciate everyone's help but it seems like once a fish is too sick to eat its too sick to treat. Not that its going to starve to death I know fish can go along time without eating.

Rant here: Getting a new fish and obviously its sick the next day and the store tells you not to worry about it not eating. Its very aggravating. And while this is my sole experience with koi; it seems like the only place to get any decent information these days is on the internet. People say they are delicate fish but in the past I have had salt tanks, brackish tanks, all kinds of fresh water tanks. In my mind a koi looks alot hardier than fish I have had in aquariums. Thanks for everyones help. I might just stick to my goldfish. :lol:

 

[vertigo72]

That sucks man .
Too late now, but I have to ask.. did you have an airstone in your quarantine tank?
Also.. you write: "The filtration is a pump in the tank that split to a fountain and a small sponge filter. "

Thats not going to do it. You need a proper biofilter. I strongly suspect you have a serious ammonia problem. Likely you tried to feed your new and stressed Koi, and kept trying by throwing more food..? and a small sponge isnt going to do much to get rid of the ammonia. That you had zero nitrites may well have been because you had close to zero nitrifying bacteria. Check for ammonia.

Now dont give up, but build a proper filter and wait long enough before you try another koi. Id also get a smaller one to start with.

 

[topofthehill1]

Vertigo72,

The quarantine tank was an established thirty gallon tank with a aquaclear filter from a 55 gallon tank. It is a little strange because it did have what appeared to be improvement maybe 8 hours after being in the tank. From my experience it was a tough looking fish I would have never guessed it to die over night from the disease alone. I'm a little stumped. As I'm tying this I'm hoping I didn't add to much salt because last night it was actually swimming.

I have a hozelock 550 per gallon pump which I split about one third of the water to a fountain and about 2/3 to a hozelock pressurized pond filter/uv light that has a sponge in it. The UV is turned off. My best guess is I have about 750 gallons in the pond. Yeah to me it doesn't look like alot of filtration but the numbers on nitrites and nitrate hadn't budged. And I did test my test strips against another tank. I will say that you got me as I have not checked the ammonia. I did only attempt to feed it once per day. But I guess I will building my own filter but the one I am using the neighbor gave me and it looked like it would do the job if I didnt go crazy with the amount of fish. Sometimes gifts from neighbors are more trouble than they are worth I guess. Well I appreciate your advice and suspect you are right on about the ammonia. Guess I will need to build a filter now. And I'm still giving up temporarily.

 

[fishin4cars]

one suggestion, get that tank up and running good. use it for a quarantine tank for your fish. My bet is that fish already had something going on before you put it in your pond. that is one bad point of a pond. Quarantine tanks allow for several different things 1 you can't monitor the sides of the fish and closely observe in a pond, a fish tank does allow this, second, if a fish is sick it is far easiler to treat in a 55 gallon tank than a pond, Lot cheaper too!, third if something is wrong with a fish you have it isolated to a managable size if you have to break it down and start over in case if highly contagious disease. 55 gallon tank vs cleaning a whole pond, I'll take that tank any day! 5th this keeps your healthy fish safe until you know for sure the new fish is good to go. I recommend isloating new fish for 3-4 weeks, most symptons will normally show in the first two weeks the second two will show parasites such as gill flukes, and anchor worms which can take up to three weeks to show up.
lastly, If you have been keeping fish for any length of time I can bet you have kept something that is far less delicate than a Koi, they are really tough fish! maybe not guite as hardy as a goldfish but then again, I can't keep Orandas at all, the longest I have been able to keep one is about 8 months, Ryukins and Lionheads, 6 years and counting. try and figure that one out! LOL

 

[talal101]

I know how hard it is to lose a fish that you like so I'm sorry but I will say that you should try again and don't give up....I wasn't planning on getting another koi after mine got sick and died but I realized I still had warranty on the fish so we decided to try a last time and if it dosent work then I'm sticking to goldies for life lol

 

[addy1]

In the first post topofthehill1 states that the ph is 6, that may have what caused the koi to get ill.

You may want to keep an eye on your ph, mine was low and hurting the goldfish I put in. koi are even more sensitive.

I had to add oyster shells to get my ph to stabilize. My well water is around 5-6, now the ph sticks around 7.5 or so.