High pH level!


crsublette

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crsublette said:
And, to use Dave's language, folk should be ashamed of them self for encouraging others to focus on pH. It is definitely that important of a basic water parameter folk need to know.
Quick clarification, to avoid confusion, the " it " I am referring to is KH.
 
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Sadly Charles this is the case in many of the ponds weve had reason to visit, thinking it through I think the trade itself is partially to blame for this state of affairs they know they are selling test kits to pond keepers but never insist on selling KH or GH kits unless asked by the fishkeeper.
Then you get the bad practice of fishkeepers not using it, education at source is the key to this.

rgrds

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Still a newbie but I have experience with this. When I constructed the pond I used a lot of cement on the brickwork and waterfall which I did not use any sealer on. I had some fish and some koi at the time which were fine but the ph was gradually rising. Turned out to be lime in the cement leaking into the pond. It got as high as 9.0 at one point. I sealed the cement using G4. I know there are chemicals and the like out there to reduce the ph, I think tetra even do a product called "water balance"(think thats the name) which puts you PH and KH at the correct levels, but I wouldn't use this if you have fish.
My local aquatic guy recommended gradual 20% water changes weekly. It took time but my ph is now stable and buffered and all my fish are fine :)
 

crsublette

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richyd said:
Still a newbie but I have experience with this. When I constructed the pond I used a lot of cement on the brickwork and waterfall which I did not use any sealer on. I had some fish and some koi at the time which were fine but the ph was gradually rising. Turned out to be lime in the cement leaking into the pond. It got as high as 9.0 at one point. I sealed the cement using G4. I know there are chemicals and the like out there to reduce the ph, I think tetra even do a product called "water balance"(think thats the name) which puts you PH and KH at the correct levels, but I wouldn't use this if you have fish.
My local aquatic guy recommended gradual 20% water changes weekly. It took time but my ph is now stable and buffered and all my fish are fine :)
pH "water balance" products compose of particular buffering solutions and minerals that raise your KH and also likely your calcium level.

Richyd, I bet ya your water's calcium concentration is quite low.

KH only stops your pH from falling. KH does not stop your pH from rising. Nature naturally lowers your pH and is often the predominant occurence in our ponds.

Calcium is what helps prevent your pH from reaching above 8.4. A high GH does not indicate a high calcium. GH is a test of many minerals plus calcium, but it is the presence of calcium that matters; this is how a GH test can be deceiving and not helpful.

As in nature, everything in pH chemistry is in balance. Free hydrogen ions (H+, this is predominately created by the nitrification process) and hydroxide (OH-, that is created by anaerobic conditions and algae) are always in equillibrium with water. So, when the H+ concentration goes up (pH goes down if KH is low). When the OH- concentration increase (pH goes up if calcium is low).

If calcium is not present to neutralize the carbonate (CO32-), then the carbonate reacts with water to increase the OH- concentration, which causes the pH to go up.

Lime is a general term for calcium-containing inorganic materials, in which carbonates, oxides and hydroxides predominate. The predominance of hydroxides (OH-) in lime is what causes Lime to raise the pH.

Again, in our ponds, we most often have a predominance of H+ created due to nitrification and other decomposing so it takes the addition of a tremendous amount of algae or lime or other compounds for the pH of our pond to go up.

Richyd, I bet ya adding calcium chloride flakes would have fixed your high pH. Not for sure where in the UK you would get it, but here in the states we get it from the hardware store and it is the product with zero additives.
 
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I’m a 68 year old guy with a few ponds,it started when my son came home with some goldfish from a school carnival,we put in a small pond then they kept getting bigger,I’ve had both koi and goldfish.the two fish my son brought home at age 10 died a few months ago when he had his 30 birthday. That’s 20 years.now I have heard all about this and that with ph and all that testing stuff .I have never tested my water.I have a prefilter that sends through the ultra violet to a 50 gallon barrel filled with media and that leads to a gravity feed waterfall ,which gives plenty of air,I live in the extreme heat of inland s cali.the only time I lose a fish is by a heron or a very smart red tail hawk.The one thing I do is bi weekly water changes about 40 percent,when doing those I never ad dechlor or that other stuff ,as I find the remaining water offsets anything that might be in my new water. I also do salt treatments 4 times a year adding 1 pound of salt per each 100 gallons three days in a row.,some times I throw in some water hyacinth but the stuff over takes everything.so my advise for the guy asking the questions about ponds,go to the pet store get some cheap feeder goldfish float the bag for about a half hour then turn em lose and see what happens I bet they will be fine, you can give a small salt treatment in a bucket before letting them out that wouldn’t hurt good luck with your new hobby. Keith
 
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I’m a 68 year old guy with a few ponds,it started when my son came home with some goldfish from a school carnival,we put in a small pond then they kept getting bigger,I’ve had both koi and goldfish.the two fish my son brought home at age 10 died a few months ago when he had his 30 birthday. That’s 20 years.now I have heard all about this and that with ph and all that testing stuff .I have never tested my water.I have a prefilter that sends through the ultra violet to a 50 gallon barrel filled with media and that leads to a gravity feed waterfall ,which gives plenty of air,I live in the extreme heat of inland s cali.the only time I lose a fish is by a heron or a very smart red tail hawk.The one thing I do is bi weekly water changes about 40 percent,when doing those I never ad dechlor or that other stuff ,as I find the remaining water offsets anything that might be in my new water. I also do salt treatments 4 times a year adding 1 pound of salt per each 100 gallons three days in a row.,some times I throw in some water hyacinth but the stuff over takes everything.so my advise for the guy asking the questions about ponds,go to the pet store get some cheap feeder goldfish float the bag for about a half hour then turn em lose and see what happens I bet they will be fine, you can give a small salt treatment in a bucket before letting them out that wouldn’t hurt good luck with your new hobby. Keith
I'll disagree with more than a few of your methods, though; water changes, salt, and UV are all unnecessary for successful pounding. Only DKP peeps go your route, and even they don't need all that stuff, though they'll deny it. I'm keeping 35 koi and 100+ gf doing non of those things. YMMV.
 

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