Just couldn't say no...so now what?

[JenH]

Hi everyone!!
Sure does feel like its been a really long winter; I'm dying to get back to my pond! A couple weeks ago my husband found one of my koi in my skimmer, dead. Now he threw it out without telling me, so I never got to look at it or anything but we think it managed to get in the skimmer box, and then maybe died from being stuck in there after freezing or whatever. I really have no idea and all of my other fish seem fine. Well, tonight while I was at Wal-Mart I just thought I'd peek over and see if they had any koi in yet, I bought one there last year and its turning into a really pretty fish for only $5. Well I found this little guy and just couldn't help myself so I bought him. Poor thing was in a tank with about 3-4 other koi and one dead one So now I'd like to know what to do with it. I'm still pretty new to all this, but I'm betting it's a bad idea to put him in my pond while it's still so cold out. Water temp a couple days ago was only 45 degrees. Also a little worried about what caused his roommate to die, and would hate to introduce anything bad to my healthy fish. So what do you guys suggest I do with him and when to put him in the pond with everyone else? He's tiny, probably only 3", but I think it's a butterfly koi. Also just curious from you experienced breeders, do you think he will stay yellow?

Oh and I think he'll be a jumper! He's been jumping in my little mixing bowl since I got home!


The video is just my fish from last week when it got up in the mid 50's, they were all coming out of hiding and just as friendly as ever!! I can't wait to get my pond fixed back up and start feeding them again!

 

[sissy]

thats a nice looking one .Looks like he has nice long tail too /

 

[capewind]

I absolutely would not put him into your pond.

1. As you already know, outside is still cold. He could be SLOWLY acclimated down to the temp, but it isnt worth the risk to the new guy, or your others ...

2. Always quarantine new fish. 3-4 weeks at a bare minimum, 8+ weeks is even better. 99% of the time, things will be ok, but that other 1%, well, sooner or later, we'll all become that 1% and watch our favorites go belly up because we were impulsive ... been there, done that ... more than once even ... NOW, now exceptions, quarantine period.

A waiting QT area is best. It really isnt fair to keep him in that little mixing bowl. So you got him home, and now dont have a ready place for him .... You need a tote, bucket, fish tank, etc (atleast 20 gallon capacity) ... a cheap air pump (under $10 at most pet stores) and ideally, a filter, but you can get away with regular water changes ... dont forget to use a product like Start Right, which will dechlorinate the water if you have town/city water.

BTW, the baby IS pretty. Your little butterfly looks to me to be a Kin Matsuba/Kikokuryu cross if you are curious of the likely color name. I have a few that were spawned outside last year that I am growing out. It wasnt wise to buy him without an area to put him, but he's going to be a pretty fish and the impulse is understandable;-)

 

[JenH]

Thanks for the info Capewind. Well I have a big utility tub in my laundry room I was thinking I could keep him in until it gets warm enough to add him to the pond. Which, btw, how warm is warm enough? I also have a little pond pump that I can stick in the water to aerate it as well. We only use the tub when we paint so its out of the way. Only problem is that I scrubbed and scrubbed that tub last night and couldn't get all the paint remnants out of the tub. Not actual paint but discoloration is all it is I think, so should be safe right?

 

[capewind]

I cant say if your tote is safe or not. I personally wouldnt risk it, but you can wait to see if others respond. Personally, for $10 or less, I would go buy another tote, and LABLE IT FISH ONLY ... Hubby has totes and buckets that are ONLY to be used for pond related things. It would be good for you to have a clean/safe tote, in case you ever need to treat one of your fish, so not a waste of money to go buy one. Sooner or later, we all need to isolate a fish for one reason or another.

Be sure to put something over the top in case he decides to be a jumper. I lost a really pretty (mutt color) koi this fall out of a kiddie pool. I knew better, but didnt think they were old enough to worry about it yet. I changed a filter, and the fish thought it was great fun to act like salmon swimming up stream:-( He was only 2" but had a purplish black back, with neon blue stripes down his sides ... I was soooo disappointed to lose him!!!

As far as what temp would be safe ... I am sure opinions will vary, but here's my view ... Once you have a home set up for this guy, and the temp has adjusted to room tempature, check the temp. When the pond temp has risen (and remains) so that the pond temp is NO MORE than 10 degrees different, then it would be safe in my view, to move him over slowly.

I have about 150-160 baby fish growing in the basement (now 3 - 9"). The bigger holding area is 750 gallons and non heated. They are now holding at 62 degrees (got as low as 58). Hubby is putting in another baby pond outside in the next few weeks specifically for them. About 2000 gallons. Not only will I need to wait for it to cycle (will help it out with the other ponds), I wont move anyone until the water temp is a steady 60+.

Another person who I know is highly experienced in moving young fish outside is Koiguy. He has a basement set up with babies too, and know at some point, he'll be moving his kids back outside, so hoping he sees this conversation. He has more experience than I do. He may say I worry too much. I would trust his opinion. Each time I have asked him something, he wasnt wrong in the advice he gave me

 

[fishin4cars]

Personally I wouldn't add any new fish to a pond until the temps have stayed above 60 degrees for at least three to six weeks. This is the time when biological activity in the filter is just starting back up and additional fish load is not a good idea. I agree with CW, it's probably best to go ahead and set up some type of QT pond or holding area. I'm was as quilty as CW about putting new fish directly in a established pond for several years. many times I experienced no issues at all. But there was that one time it didn't go well. I lost a collection of about 15 koi and goldfish in a single two week span right after adding a new fish. Now I always QT, and treat with salt at 4-5ppm and maintain that for at least 2-3 weeks then start slowly dropping the level prior to placing the new fish in the pond.

 

[JenH]

Ok so a friend of mine has a 45 gallon indoor aquarium, all he has in there is about 5 tiny little glow fish, and one of those algae eating fish that barely ever move and suck onto the glass, a tiny little frog and a couple of shrimp. It's freshwater, and he keeps it at 72 degrees. Would it be ok to add my koi to that tank until my pond warms up? I know they aren't aggressive fish, but I was a little worried about it eating my friend's shrimp. Also, since it came from Wal-Mart and a tank with another dead koi floating around with it, should I still keep it quarantined for a while before adding to my friend's tank if it is ok to do so? I picked up a plastic (BPA free) tub from Wal-Mart today and some water conditioner and a little aquarium filter, which doesn't seem to want to work with this tub, so I just have the air blowing through the tube into the water to aerate, and I guess I'll have to do water changes to make sure it stays clean. But is there anything ese I should be adding to the water to make sure he is healthy or whatever? I gave him a little food after transferring him and he was eating just fine so seems happy.

Thanks everyone!

 

[Dave 54]

No you shouldnt add your koi to a tropical fish tank and your QT setup ill have to be filtered cant add anything else not covered by CW or Larkin has already said apart from we QT for around 4 to 6 weeks


rgrds

Dave

 

[capewind]

Not now, not 8 weeks from now would I put this guy in your friends tank. Godforbid this little guy does have something, you would be putting your friends fish at risk.

Here;s a link to a great little filter that you can literally put in ANY container.
http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2753028&lmdn=Size&f=PAD/psNotAvailInUS/No

I have the 40 gallon version, and put it in with fry (1/8" long) with a nylon over the intake. You wont need the nylon, once fish get to about half an inch, they are big enough not to get sucked into the filter. Now I have it hanging inside of a 55 gallon tank.

As long as he is in that little mixing bowl, do NOT feed him. He'll be just fine for a few days without food. Most fish stores do not feed fish, or only very lightly, due to them again being transported.

 

[Dave 54]

Not now, not 8 weeks from now would I put this guy in your friends tank. Godforbid this little guy does have something, you would be putting your friends fish at risk.

Here;s a link to a great little filter that you can literally put in ANY container.
http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2753028&lmdn=Size&f=PAD/psNotAvailInUS/No

I have the 40 gallon version, and put it in with fry (1/8" long) with a nylon over the intake. You wont need the nylon, once fish get to about half an inch, they are big enough not to get sucked into the filter. Now I have it hanging inside of a 55 gallon tank.

As long as he is in that little mixing bowl, do NOT feed him. He'll be just fine for a few days without food. Most fish stores do not feed fish, or only very lightly, due to them again being transported.

It's always better to under feed than over feed CW, however as to shop owners not feeding their stock I've yet to come across one that does that.
You see all the shop owners we know do feed their fish as do koi dealerships admittedly in smaller quantities than the fish owner would .
The New animal welfare act here in the UK is a tough new set of laws that came in a few years ago now.
In part we all have a duty to care for any animal/creature/fish that includes quality of life this also to the best of my knowledge includes breeders dealerships and fish shop owners we are all liable for prosicution if we let our anmals etc suffer .
It gives the RSPCA much more scope to take people to court if you fall foul of this new law, which is a good thing in reality .

rgrds

DAve

 

[capewind]

however as to shop owners not feeding their stock I've yet to come across one that does that.

All I can tell you Dave is you are welcome to come to our side of the pond, I'll personally bring you to all the places in my area who sell fish (Koi, tropical and marine) and they call tell you the same in person.

 

[Dave 54]

All I can tell you Dave is you are welcome to come to our side of the pond, I'll personally bring you to all the places in my area who sell fish (Koi, tropical and marine) and they call tell you the same in person.

Perhaps they should introduce the same animal welfare act to the US version of our RSPCA if they like it then they could push congress to vote it in .
I might just take you up on the offer it was 1980 the last time I was over your side of the pond on my fourth visit to your beautiful country with the Royal Navy .
I just loved everything about the US from its burgers to its beautiful senic veiws (the beer though was weak ) not like our real ale that many of us Brits like to partake of

rgrds

Dave

 

[koiguy1969]

I just loved everything about the US from its burgers to its beautiful senic veiws (the beer though was weak ) not like our real ale that many of us Brits like to partake of

your beer may be a bit stouter...but when the beers gone ..we can use our cans and bottles for target practice. with the gun of our choice!... lol

 

[capewind]

Perhaps they should introduce the same animal welfare act to the US version of our RSPCA if they like it then they could push congress to vote it in .

You are kidding right? Do you see our news over there at all? Congress cant manage to vote on anything important LOL.

I might just take you up on the offer it was 1980 the last time I was over your side of the pond on my fourth visit to your beautiful country with the Royal Navy .

Come on over

(the beer though was weak ) not like our real ale that many of us Brits like to partake of

I blame Ronnie James Dio (rock vocalist with an incredible voice) for my choice in beer ... He gave me my first Heineken in 1986 He was playing at the Providence Civic Center (with Savatage and Megadeath as twin opening bands) A friend had told me to ask for their cousin at the gate behind the stage, that he could get us "back stage passes" ... That wasnt quite true .. what he did for us (me and my girl friend) was wayyyyyy better!!! Yes, he got us "back stage" but we spent 30 minutes ALONE with the band BEFORE the people with the actual back stage passes were allowed back! They had a table with these huge plastic totes filled with ice and Heineken's ... We asked if we could have one ... Ronnie knew we were underage and said we could split one LOL. What an incredible human being he was. It was so sad that he passed from cancer a few years ago.

 

[capewind]

your beer may be a bit stouter...but when the beers gone ..we can use our cans and bottles for target practice. with the gun of our choice!... lol

Yup! Dad started me with coffee cans on a sawhorse, then moved up to the beer bottles LOL.