Keep things Nice and simple

[Dave 54]

Having been a koi Keeper for the last 26 years I see time and time again other keepers who act like their subject is rocket science and it basically annoyes me greatly it really does......
Keeping koi infact any fish for that matter isnt rocket science its just a matter of plain old common scense and we must remember this when it comes to a novice fish keeper as we have a duty to keep things nice and simple
Start with the basics and the newbie cannot go wrong if you get a novice who thinks that they know everything quite simply walk away because your wasting your time.
Sad I know because of the fish that will most probably die at their hands as you cant educate pork can you ??? .
However most newbies with a little advice and steared in the right direction take on everything that you say.
Here you have the makings of a fish keeper, you must also make sure that they read up on their subject this way they start to learn on their own and will need less and less help eventually when its their turn they will be in position to pass on that knowedge that you freely gave them in their early days .
Act like our subject is Rocket science you can bet your bottom dollar that their will be one less newbie as they dont understand a word your saying to them.
I had good teachers especially when it came from me stopping indoor koi keeping to acctually going into the pond .
I had to forget most of what I knew about indoors and think purely pond, forgetting much of what I was doing prior to going into the pond only taking the health side of things with me , thinking big was the hardest part .
So remember if you come across a newbie in your travels, keep it plain and simple and you'll not only have a good fish keeper but probably a good friend too ......


rgrds

Dave

 

[Mucky_Waters]

Come on Dave, why don't you tell us what you really think.

 

[Mmathis]

Great advice!

 

[Dave 54]

What I really think m'mmm its to cut out the bull giving the novice a clear shot at becoming fish keepers not frightened off the hobby .
I say this because I've acctually come across ex novices who said that me keeping it plain and simple has turned them around and they now enjoy the hobby where as before they got confused .
You dont stay in the hobby for 26 years without having one or two pet hates .
What you have to remember is we need novices to keep our hobby moving forwards all the time .

rgrds

Dave

 

[Mmathis]

In my experience with things I'm interested in, I throw out the "complicated," then go elsewhere for my info until I find something dumbed down enough that I can understand it.

 

[addy1]

lol my system couldn't be more simple, non-complicated. I love it that way.

 

[sissy]

If you make it sound hard people fail and most will buy tons of stuff they don't need .I just try to keep it easy and simple so I can enjoy it more and not worry about all the money I spent that I should have used some where else .I think my biggest expense right now is the electric bill :razz: and the taxes they add to it .I realized when I added all the taxes it came out to 37.55 a month .GEEZE

 

[Dave 54]

Thats my whole point why make it sound harder than it is when it is in acctual fact the opposite , I once hung off a fish keepers every word because of this only to find that the guy was talking through his perverbial A**e.
I was then I discovered it wasnt rocket science but plain old common sense and since then I've always told newbies the correct way of doing things

rgrds

Dave

 

[Mucky_Waters]

I think in order to keep things simple in any hobby you first have to be clear about your goals and objectives. In order to do that you need to be clear about what the hobby is to you. This is where things start to get muddled up and that leads to the confusion and complexity we so often see surrounding "this hobby".
For instance, someone who keeps a 50 gallon preform pond on their deck with a few goldfish and some water hyacinth, is going to have a different set of goals than a person with a 10,000 gallon pool taking up their entire back yard, stocked full of prized Kohaku, Sanke, and Showas. And yet, you'll often find both these people in the same forum giving (or asking) advice about how to manage a pond. Their objectives and pond management systems couldn't be more different, and yet because there is such a blending of people and ponds in between they are linked together. And that's where the things start to get complicated.
Add to that the all the controversial products and "myths" out their that are perpetually pushed (Barley straw, hydrogen peroxide, bacteria in a bottle, cement will kill fish, etc..), it's easy to see how things can get complicated real quick for beginners.
For a certainty, my pond goals and objectives are going to be fundamentally different than yours. I don't keep any koi, and I'm not sure I ever will. You may not have any turtles or frogs in your pond. That means that we are going to have a very different set of goals in mind when we build and manage our ponds. So, who's way is right and who's way is wrong?
It's easy to say keep it simple, but the reality is one person's simple is another person's rocket science. Even among the "experts" in this hobby there is plenty of disagreement about how to do things, if you have ever followed any threads in Koiphen.com over the years you would already know that. Lots of disagreements about what is right or wrong way to do things. Thing is there is so many aspects to this hobby that there is room for just about everybody to be right, and everybody has the right to be wrong once in a while. It just depends on what point of view you are looking at it from.

 

[Dave 54]

I think in order to keep things simple in any hobby you first have to be clear about your goals and objectives. In order to do that you need to be clear about what the hobby is to you. This is where things start to get muddled up and that leads to the confusion and complexity we so often see surrounding "this hobby".
For instance, someone who keeps a 50 gallon preform pond on their deck with a few goldfish and some water hyacinth, is going to have a different set of goals than a person with a 10,000 gallon pool taking up their entire back yard, stocked full of prized Kohaku, Sanke, and Showas. And yet, you'll often find both these people in the same forum giving (or asking) advice about how to manage a pond. Their objectives and pond management systems couldn't be more different, and yet because there is such a blending of people and ponds in between they are linked together. And that's where the things start to get complicated.
Add to that the all the controversial products and "myths" out their that are perpetually pushed (Barley straw, hydrogen peroxide, bacteria in a bottle, cement will kill fish, etc..), it's easy to see how things can get complicated real quick for beginners.
For a certainty, my pond goals and objectives are going to be fundamentally different than yours. I don't keep any koi, and I'm not sure I ever will. You may not have any turtles or frogs in your pond. That means that we are going to have a very different set of goals in mind when we build and manage our ponds. So, who's way is right and who's way is wrong?
It's easy to say keep it simple, but the reality is one person's simple is another person's rocket science. Even among the "experts" in this hobby there is plenty of disagreement about how to do things, if you have ever followed any threads in Koiphen.com over the years you would already know that. Lots of disagreements about what is right or wrong way to do things. Thing is there is so many aspects to this hobby that there is room for just about everybody to be right, and everybody has the right to be wrong once in a while. It just depends on what point of view you are looking at it from.

You are indeed quite right in what you say I have a koi pond others dont but its not about the pond its about the fish I see people spouting off about how to do this and that and the poor fish keeper becomes confused and often looses heart and there fish.
Between us there is no difference there as we all keep fish be they goldfish tench orfe or koi .
This is what I mean by keeping it nice and simple this is where you find the so called experts spouting off and thats the health issue of peoples fish .
If people are going to help it has to be kept simple and basic so that they can understand what we are telling them . .
I always say the best way forwards for any fish keeper is to read up on their subject especially health matters this way they dont have to go through he pain of loss because they couldnt see something being uninformed so to speak so it is up to the more senior Aquarists to give good sound simple advice pointing that person in the right direction .
I run a koi website and if you visit you'd find that that site is ther for learning we dont have any arguing because Carl the site owner and myself who has run it for him decided that we didnt want any of that.
So far I've only had to ban two people one for being racist against my heritage and the other for being very disrupted not only on our site but on two others she was banned from all three in under a month . all the others banned were spammers which are the bane of websites.
Strangely the woman who was banned later turned out to be a senior member of koiphen ( it makes you think ???) if you wish to visit Carls site PM m and I'll give you the address.
Its been running for three years and the most ever online was 160, at the moment it is slow ( thats the koi keeper for you ) its winter so we koi keepers go to ground tuck their koi up and cover the pond till the spring this is when things pick up..
You are more than welcome to visit .

rgrds

Dave

 

[sissy]

I guess when I started ponding my only goal was living fish and I knew nothing more ,just went with the flow and my own intuition and never lost a fish .Only mistake I really made that was a waste of money was going with a preformed .I would say getting 2 koi aggie and bert were my next but i love them to much to say that .I have not lost one fish ,but sure have given plenty away .Gold fish just have to many babies .

 

[Dave 54]

Going with the flow can sometimes end in total disaster sissy this is why I tell people to go out and buy books and read them .....
Otherwise when things go disasterously wrong you only have yourself to blame ......
rgrds
Dave

 

[sissy]

It has been over 8 years and koi were only a couple of inches long when I got them and are now over 2 feet long and what i have learned has been from the puter .I have had to replace the liner because a new neighbors dog fell in and ripped the liner i had .All of my fish are over 8 years old well older really because first pond was put in in 2004 and second pond was put in a year later .I have helped several neighbors with there ponds and now they have happy healthy looking ponds that they never had before .I guess growing up with a natural pond that was spring fed and crystal clear water and healthy fish helped me learn .My father never had a filter or aerator back then .He was an organic farmer when organic was not a key word .Our farm was 5 acres and not big by all means but we had plenty to sell to our steady customers every year since 1959 until mom and dad retired in 1985 .

 

[HARO]

Going with the flow can sometimes end in total disaster sissy this is why I tell people to go out and buy books and read them .....
Otherwise when things go disasterously wrong you only have yourself to blame ......
rgrds
Dave

I agree 100%, Dave, but after eight years of trying to tell people to get a good book and read it, I have come to realize that NOBODY reads any more! I brought in eight decent books to sell at the garden centre where I work, and all 8 are still on the shelf. Everyone just wants a quick answer or solution.
John

 

[Mucky_Waters]

I believe the lack of book reading has more to do with the internet than people simply not wanting to take the time to learn. I have tons of books on all kinds of subjects (I've even read some of them :redface, but all the information in all those books can be found somewhere on the internet. In fact some of those books can be found in their entirety on the net. I almost never buy books anymore, not because I don't like to read, or because I'm looking for an easier way, but because I can usually find the same, or more up to date information, on the internet. The fact that it is quicker and cheaper is just a perk. Not only that, but the internet often offers that information on subjects in multimedia formats that books just can't do. For instance, I'm not much of an automotive mechanic, but I'll sometimes take care of small vehicle repair or maintenance tasks if I have the time, when I do, the last thing I'd think to do is go out and find a book. Maybe 20 years ago that might have been what I would have done, but now I usually do a search on youtube, where I can get direct verbal and visual instruction from a mechanic and actually see what he is doing with my own eyes. That sort of instruction is clearer and easier to follow than text in a book.