Koi emergency?

[WaterGardener]

I just looked up Wipe Out. It seems to be an antibiotic and the directions state to remove the filter media before using that product.

If you didn't do that, it's likely that you just "wiped out" your beneficial bacteria. Now your pond will have to restart the nitrogen cycle, adding more stress to the fish.

Never add an antibiotic to your pond. If you need to treat a fish, put it in a hospital tank and add the antibiotic to that.

 

[koicrazy]

I read that too but right now would be really hard to remove all the filter media as I hurt my back the other day and am trying to mend too. I took the easy way and then this morning did a huge water change then added in Aquascape beneficial bacteria.
I hope it's going to be OK, so far they're all still OK.

 

[koicrazy]

I read that too but right now would be really hard to remove all the filter media as I hurt my back the other day and am trying to mend too. I took the easy way and then this morning did a huge water change then added in Aquascape beneficial bacteria.
I hope it's going to be OK, so far they're all still OK

 

[WaterGardener]

Sorry about your back and sorry to be the bearer of bad news. But the type of bacteria in the Aquascape product (a phosphate solubilizing bacteria like an innoculant for seeds or soil, if you are a gardener) is not the same type that is needed for the nitrogen cycle (nitrosomas and nitrobacter bacteria). So I think you have most likely done in your beneficial bacteria.

 

[koicrazy]

I read that too but right now would be really hard to remove all the filter media as I hurt my back the other day and am trying to mend too. I took the easy way and then this morning did a huge water change then added in Aquascape beneficial bacteria.
I hope it's going to be OK, so far they're all still ok

Sorry about your back and sorry to be the bearer of bad news. But the type of bacteria in the Aquascape product (a phosphate solubilizing bacteria like an innoculant for seeds or soil, if you are a gardener) is not the same type that is needed for the nitrogen cycle (nitrosomas and nitrobacter bacteria). So I think you have most likely done in your beneficial bacteria.

I'm very confused, I thought this was adding beneficial bacteria. It says it supports the nitrogen cycle in ponds, am I wrong?

 

[GBBUDD]

You missed two important notes from @WaterGardener
I. Treat the fish in a temporary holding pond. hospital tank/ pond. Smaller amount of water and much cheaper to treat. that way you are not affecting your ponds eco system.
2.There are probably BILLIONS of types of bacteria. BENIFICIAL BACTERIA is not nitrogen cycling bacteria. I am no biologist but i do know there's no add a bottle to a new pond and throw in a full load of fish over night. It takes time for the bacteria to establish it's self. There are so many buy my product it does this but won't do that , and all to often we hear i added this and all my fish died. Start right helps to boost the immune system/ slime coat. It does nothing to kill something else to get it there.

 

[koicrazy]

You missed two important notes from @WaterGardener
I. Treat the fish in a temporary holding pond. hospital tank/ pond. Smaller amount of water and much cheaper to treat. that way you are not affecting your ponds eco system.
2.There are probably BILLIONS of types of bacteria. BENIFICIAL BACTERIA is not nitrogen cycling bacteria. I am no biologist but i do know there's no add a bottle to a new pond and throw in a full load of fish over night. It takes time for the bacteria to establish it's self. There are so many buy my product it does this but won't do that , and all to often we hear i added this and all my fish died. Start right helps to boost the immune system/ slime coat. It does nothing to kill something else to get it there.

Thanks for your replies, I hear what you're saying and will do my best to do the right thing.
I do have a large tank for clean outs and treatments, I'm just not able to move it around right now.
Sounds like I'm lucky I haven't lost any yet.
I'm in need of some stress relief too.

 

[WaterGardener]

The product you used is "A" beneficial bacteria, but it is not "THE" beneficial bacteria that the nitrogen cycle needs. It may help with sludge at the bottom of the pond, but that is it. The manufacturers are not exactly upfront and honest about it. Misleading, actually.

Keep an eye on your water parameters and keep Prime on hand to bind ammonia and nitrites when they show up.

For a hospital tank, you can use a kiddie pool or water trough or even a large plastic storage bin. Be sure to cover it with a net or grate of some kind to keep the fish from jumping out.

 

[GBBUDD]

Thanks for your replies, I hear what you're saying and will do my best to do the right thing.
I do have a large tank for clean outs and treatments, I'm just not able to move it around right now.
Sounds like I'm lucky I haven't lost any yet.
I'm in need of some stress relief too.

Wadka

 

[Lisak1]

I'm in need of some stress relief too.

That one actually MIGHT come in a bottle!

Give yourself a break from all the water changes and clean outs - totally unnecessary. Let your pond water mature - and it may take three years to get there - but then it's like gold. Something no product in a bottle can help you achieve.

(One caveat: You may want to work to remove the salt from the pond though and water changes are the only way to achieve that.)

 

[Mgessert]

Does it say which bacteria are in the concentrate?

 

[koicrazy]

The product you used is "A" beneficial bacteria, but it is not "THE" beneficial bacteria that the nitrogen cycle needs. It may help with sludge at the bottom of the pond, but that is it. The manufacturers are not exactly upfront and honest about it. Misleading, actually.

Keep an eye on your water parameters and keep Prime on hand to bind ammonia and nitrites when they show up.

For a hospital tank, you can use a kiddie pool or water trough or even a large plastic storage bin. Be sure to cover it with a net or grate of some kind to keep the fish from jumping out.

Thanks! Is this the same thing as Prime?

 

[koicrazy]

The product you used is "A" beneficial bacteria, but it is not "THE" beneficial bacteria that the nitrogen cycle needs. It may help with sludge at the bottom of the pond, but that is it. The manufacturers are not exactly upfront and honest about it. Misleading, actually.

Keep an eye on your water parameters and keep Prime on hand to bind ammonia and nitrites when they show up.

For a hospital tank, you can use a kiddie pool or water trough or even a large plastic storage bin. Be sure to cover it with a net or grate of some kind to keep the fish from jumping out.

Thanks!

Does it say which bacteria are in the concentrate?

It doesn't say which bacteria are in it, it says it supports the nitrogen cycle, it's a weekly maintenance product.
Is this the same thing as Prime?

 

[koicrazy]

That one actually MIGHT come in a bottle!

Give yourself a break from all the water changes and clean outs - totally unnecessary. Let your pond water mature - and it may take three years to get there - but then it's like gold. Something no product in a bottle can help you achieve.

(One caveat: You may want to work to remove the salt from the pond though and water changes are the only way to achieve that.)

He's still alive this morning! I did do a huge water change yesterday. Now I'm going to just walk away, the more I mess with it, the worse it gets.
Is it too early for my "stress relief "??

 

[WaterGardener]

No. It's not the same. You don't need any weekly maintenance products. Supporting the nitrogen cycle means nothing. Just hype. The nitrogen cycle needs no help. Everything it needs is already in your pond.

Prime is made by Seachem, or you can use Safe, also made by Seachem. Same thing, but Prime is a liquid and Safe is a powdered form. It dechlorinates and will bind ammonia and nitrite when they are present when the nitrogen cycle is getting established. So I suspect you are going to need it to protect your fish from those toxins.

When using Prime or Safe as a binder, it will last only 48 hours, so it has to be redosed at those intervals until the ammonia and nitrite are gone. It does not affect the water tests, so ammonia and nitrite will still show up on tests, but it won't be available to harm the fish.

What is your salt reading? I would not completely stop water changes until that is gone.