Leaking pond...PLEASE HELP! Newbie!

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Hi Everyone,

***I AM A TOTAL NOVICE*** :bye2: ...and i need your advice ASAP to save my fish! :goldfish:

My name is Mark and I am a complete novice when it comes to ponds so please go easy on me!!! ;-)
Here is my story to fill you in really quick on our pond situation.
Bought a new house...it has a pond with fish and a waterfall feature.

Pond spec:
  • 4.5 foot deep approx
  • 10m2 area
  • black plastic liner
  • pond put in by previous owner about 10 years+ ago
  • pond is at ground level
  • water fall feature made from large stones...2ft drop approx
  • 130 small to medium (palm size) fish including lots of goldfish and one large koi (about 24ins in length)
  • using a velda clearwater 100 filter (size of a small dustbin), 2x UV's built in...it's a beast!
  • decent powerful pump (hozelock) can't remember the spec but it works superb and powers the water fall really well.
  • black reinforced flexi-hose from the pump to the filter and then from filter to waterfall.
  • We also have a huge plastic grid frame system which is on stilts and 'covers' the pond my 3 small children are safe. (was professionally installed)
So...here is the issue...very brief story.

The pump we inhertited failed and died.
The pump was running to a filter and then into the water fall.
The filter was also...disgraceful...apparently! :-(
Spoke to a supplier and they said the pump was too small for the pond.

So...I made an enquiry to a supplier..."What do I need please?"

Supplier "For that pond size you need this pump
(a hozelock, cant remember the spec but it is good and serves the waterfall spec, great pressure)
and a Velda 100 clearwater filter with 2x built in UV's."

"I said "Ok how much?"

"£1000"

Shit!...I didnt have that sort of money
so I bought a £150 hozelock pump and stuck that in...
we didn't connect it to the filter of water fall.

We just put it in the pond and turned it on. :disappointed_anim:

Yes, yes I know...
I did say I was a novice...
please dont judge :regular_waving_emot

Anyway...
a big fish died soon after.

So I called them back
and spent £1000 on their system.

The pond was green by the way...
you could only see down about 10inches, if that.

They sent me a hoover for free
(hozelock)
they said if I clean it it will help the filter.

I tried but it was fruitless...
the hoover kept blocking...
the pond was
6inches deep in pond sludge on the base.
(I found this out later)

Then the filter began to leak after about a month!!!!
It was full of sludge.
By the way the pump was not on the pond floor
I suspended it abouy 2 foot from the bottom with some rope
attached to my pond cover grid system.

Called in an expert pond cleaner.
Cleaned the filter.
He emptied the pond.
Put the fish in a holding tank.
Cleaned out all the sludge.
Cleaned the liner.
Began the refill...used the right 'treatment' to treat the new water.
Put te fish back in.
We paid him and he left.

It took us about 2 days 'on and off' to refill back to the previous level.
All looking good.
Pond super clean.
Fish happy.
We are happy.

And then the water began to drop!
2 foot in 2 days
now it's 6 inches per day and still dropping.
I am now down to 18ins from 4.5 feet in 6 days.

SHIT!

We didn't have a leak before...in 3 years of ownwership.
We've had guys in the pond fitting the grid sytem about 18months ago...no leaks since then. All fine.

The pond cleaner guy cleans it 7 days ago and it's not stopped dropping since.
I've spoken with him several times.

He says...
This has never happened before.
He said it might be:

the sludge was blocking a leak that was already there
he found several large stones on the base and said it may have been those
he said it may have already been leaking for all he knows (suggesting i'm at fault)...it has never done this before.

what he wont do is "CONSIDER" the "POSSIBILITY" that he might have split it during the clean.

...and so, here I am.

He has offered to help, but what do you good people make of all this?

I obviously need to find the leak and he has offered to help.
He hires holding tanks so I'll leikely take him up on this.
He said he has not been happy with my attitude!!!

I have no issues with leaking in 3 years...neither did the previous owner
He spends one day in my pond.
It is now leaking...and hasn't stopped...YET!

now I'm no brain surgeon but... :regular_waving_emot

could it have been him?
could sludge block a leak?
could rocks land on the base, create a leak but then that leak be blocked by either the rock or the sludge?

(remember...this pond has never dropped it's level other than when it has been a really long hot spell with no rain in the warmer months...we lose say a few inches over 4-8 weeks.
This is normal right?
It never drops in winter

So...I'm thinking call the guy back...get one of his tanks, put the fish in and put my small pump in that has a fountain feature to keep the oxygen going.

Then sort the leak...issue...no idea how to do this though!

Over to you guys...

Thanks - Mark

Sorry it's a long story but at least you have all the details. :D
 
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could it have been him?
could sludge block a leak?
could rocks land on the base, create a leak but then that leak be blocked by either the rock or the sludge?


yup, yup and yup

Could also be some leak in the waterfall some place

Try switching off all pumps and see if water continues to drop... The fish will cope with 18"

Regards, andy
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21940871@N06/
http://swglist.wordpress.com/
 

Mmathis

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Welcome! And WOW, what a story! I certainly don't have enough experience to know, but it sure seems like the leak is either low/deep in the pond, OR it has something to do with the water distribution [hoses], OR, maybe the waterfall. They say that a waterfall is the most likely place for a leak [but I don't think you said that the waterfall was worked on??]. And for the water level to be going down THAT fast, my guess is that it's NOT a hole in the liner -- unless it's a very big one, and that should have been obvious [but yes, it is possible for a rock & muck to keep a hole covered].

Process of elimination......

Have you noticed any places in the yard where water seems to be pooling, or wet where it usually isn't?

Turn off your pumps for a little while [get an air pump and add an airstone so the fish have some circulation] and see what happens to the water level. If it stabilizes once the pumps are turned off, then you know it ISN'T a hole in the liner. Which leaves that it's something to do with hoses or the waterfall.

Hopefully this "pond guy" isn't the only resource you have, because depending on how comfortable you are with finding the leak and doing repairs, you might end up needing a professional to help. Whether he "did anything" to cause this, or not, his attitude doesn't sound reassuring. As for a "holding tank," a few large plastic totes or a kiddie pool [with added aeration/filtration] on your part would do to store the fish during the investigation & repair -- because it's obviously something that needs to be looked into ASAP.

Best of luck, and keep us posted!
 

sissy

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you say black plastic or is it a true pond liner .I know that I have seen ponds made with the 6 mil black plastic stuff and most only last 5 years or so .Pic of liner would help
[sharedmedia=core:attachments:56132]
 
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You said you called a pond cleaning expert. Waterbug is gonna come and tear this place up!

No way to tell over the internet where it is leaking.

Often when there is a waterfall or stream involved in a water feature, that is where the leak is. The water is flowing out of the steam somehow. But not always.

As noted you could just let it drain until it stops leaking. That would give you the level of the leak.

Or, you could turn of the waterfall and see if that stops the leak.

This does sound like a cool water feature. Can you post any pictures?
 

sissy

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I think you need to go out and buy something to put fish in and then find out what kind of liner you do have .If it is truelly plastic then it will need changed out to a regular pond liner .No pond guy is going to touch the pond to clean it if it is plastic liner .Well unless he really needs the money and does not care .Fish are never really happy with a clean pond that is only for our benefit not theres .They just want it ammonia free and love eating the muck on the liner .
 

slakker

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I would put an air in there and run off the pump to see if the leak still occurs. Hopefully it doesn't, as that would isolate the issue to somewhere in the return run to the waterfall... Then debug it one component at a time. Is: leak in hose, waterfall attachments, waterfall itself, etc.
 

fishin4cars

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First off, is there any sign of moisture around the falls? If so start looking for water escaping between a rock and a fold. If no water there then you can try letting the pond drop to where the leek is located. But if your losing that much water I'm not sure it would be a good idea to leave the fish in this pond. If it's on the bottom it could get to low before finding the leak for the fish to survive. Did the Professional pond cleaner use a pressure washer to clean, If so very likely that they may have gotten the tip to close to the liner and the water prseeure cut the liner. I recently had a helper that did this and I spent two days patching small cuts in the pond.
 
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When I say black plastic...what I meant was that it's a 'proper' pond liner.

I've decided a plan of action.

1) Waterfall - i've positioned the outlet for the waterfall directly into the pond to check if it's the actual waterfall leaking. water is still pumping into the pond and creating air...just not down my waterfall.

if no probs then after this...

2) I plan to remove the fish and put them into a holding tank with a small 'water feature/fountain pump' to keep oxygen going for them. I will turn off my main pond pump and filter to check if water is leaking via the liner.

Thoughts?
 

sissy

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could they have crushed or damaged one of your hoses or hose connections .
 

Mmathis

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flufgold said:
Ok...update

After 12 hours the water has not dropped...normally it would drop...what's the difference.

I have bypassed the water fall!

It appears that at this early stage it might be the waterfall that is actually the cause of the water loss.
Stand by for further updates.
Good detective work!
 

fishin4cars

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Ok...update

After 12 hours the water has not dropped...normally it would drop...what's the difference.

I have bypassed the water fall!

It appears that at this early stage it might be the waterfall that is actually the cause of the water loss.
Stand by for further updates.
Don't add any water, start looking VERY close along the water line. It is either in the fall area, or along the water line. If it's along the water line, you'll need to mark the hole, lower the water level down another 6" or so and clean clean clean the area, then simply apply a patch. If you need a patch go ahead and get a couple coming. Most pond stores sell them. I have extras I can sell if cheap if you can't locate. Hopefully it's in the water fall and just needs some tweeking. Good Luck!
 

addy1

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I just found 3 tiny leaks which added up to a daily drop. The cause, one: a moved rock (some critter), two: roots grew over the waterfall flow, redirected a trickle out and over the edge, Three: roots in the bog nicely redirected trickle of the water flow to out of the bog. No holes! thankfully. All areas fixed, noted and will have corrective action once the vegetation starts to die back for the winter.

It is surprising how much water you can lose with a trickle loss.
 

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