New to Group

[epro38]

I have my pond and its history on youtube. Please check it out and tell me your comments. Thanks.

You can see my other video from 2011 under Epro38 on Youtube.

 

[epro38]

Also when you are watching the video check out the underwater video of the Koi and other fish.

 

[addy1]

to our group

Nice pond and build and fish

 

[Fishylove]

Welcome! Great fish!

 

[CometKeith]

Welcome to another Chicagoan. Beautiful pond!

 

[j.w]

epro38
Nice looking pond and looks like you have a combo of koi, shubbies and goldfish.
What is that panel for behind the nice rock wall you have there?

 

[fishin4cars]

Welcome aboard. Very nice looking pond. Hope your ready for some serious comments. That pond is way to small for Koi. Although all the fish look healthy right now your going to have serious issues as the Koi grow. There isn't enough room in that pond for even one of the koi to grow to the size they should. Koi need room to swim and exercise. As you notice in the video the fish are all hanging in one area. What are you going to do when the Koi get to a size when they can't even turn around. I would remove the koi and stay with 3-5 goldfish only. I don't like saying a Koi needs "X" amount of gallons per fish as filtration and such can differ from pond to pond. But realistically a koi pond should at least be 1000 gallons or larger for one or two adults and that's with really good filtration that is adequate for the waste being produced. Koi can reach full size at 24" to over 40" in size and can weigh 30# plus when fully grown. THEY DON'T ADAPT TO THE SIZE OF THE POND. To many people believe that a koi will only grow to the size pond. fact is Once a fish gets to large for a pond they start having health issues.

 

[j.w]

Guess it's time to get the shovel out epro38 :goodnight:

 

[sissy]

Very true and wish I had known that before i bought koi .welcome

 

[epro38]

Thanks to all for viewing and the comments.

CometKeith - We need more Ponds in Chicago in effort to catch up with up Wisconsin neighbor.

J.W.- thanks. Those are glass blocks that glow blue from the inside at night giving a cool depth look.

Fishin4cars- Thanks, I am ready for some serious comments. But you just seem to fire off with some serious criticism. It's ok, I encourage criticism. So let me respond. Although this is my first pond build, i am very familiar with Koi. Most people believe that ALL Koi will grow 2 feet (and some do) However,many can grow very healthy at only half that size. People often think the koi are just growing to the size of the pond when actually it's just like us humans.. they have genetics. Most U.S. koi have little ties to Japanese Koi through all of the cross-breeding (although they still very much look the part) And i rarely see them get over (or near) 2 feet unless they have a closer pedigree to Japan and those are fairly expensive.

In my '11 video i state my pond is roughly 500 gallons. It had alittle over- haul in spring to bring it to about 800 gal. (Still on the small side, i know) But the video doesn't show even 5% of the space they have to swim. But even larger Koi wouldn't have a hard time "turning around". The deepest goes down 4.5 feet and i never pan around to show the rest of the interior. I put the camera there because i knew they were there.

The reason why the fish all are bunched up like they are is because I had recently put my hand in the water just before that video and that is their meeting spot when i do so. The age old debate of how many inches of fish per gallon is just that... A debate. Do i recommend throwing 50 fish into a bucket and calling it a pond? I dont. The key is water quality. And if you keep it stable it has been well proven that you can far exceed the inches per gallon calculator (theory) with very healthy fish.You could have 2 identicle ponds- One with your suggested 3-5 goldfish and mine as it stands with fish far healthier than your goldfish because of water quality.

My fish right now are on the small side.. You never mentioned once that if they every get over crowded i could re-locate some. Which is what I've always expected as a possibility. You just say their going to get sick.

Know it all's like you, usually turn out knowing the least. All book smarts. Before you fire back saying you've been pond building for 30 years, I'll say this, i know and have consulted with similiar builders (and more importatly people with fish experience) who would disagree with much of you say. Everyone has an opinion, and most feel their need to share it. But thanks for your input. I'll let you know when my fish get unhealthy.

Good luck to all with their underwater creations

 

[HARO]

:banghead3:

 

[sissy]

Mine all come running when it is time to eat and still wish I had stayed with goldies I just feel they are easier to take care of ,but no one told me what I was in for 8 years ago ,but I have learned a lot with the internet and this sight and have only had 1 fish die which was last year as I did not know that shubbies sometimes will jump out during spring breeding .I can eventually relocate my fish to the pond at the other house which is 20 x 20 and over 6 feet deep and was 20 by 30 but wanted to limit the natural spring that ran into it .Now the spring runs to another pond area and we allow some of the water to run into the 20 by 20 when we uncap the pipe to allow it in .I have 13 fish now and aggie and bert are around 2 feet now and were only a couple of inches long 8 years ago .

 

[fishin4cars]

Thanks to all for viewing and the comments.

CometKeith - We need more Ponds in Chicago in effort to catch up with up Wisconsin neighbor.

J.W.- thanks. Those are glass blocks that glow blue from the inside at night giving a cool depth look.

Fishin4cars- Thanks, I am ready for some serious comments. But you just seem to fire off with some serious criticism. It's ok, I encourage criticism. So let me respond. Although this is my first pond build, i am very familiar with Koi. Most people believe that ALL Koi will grow 2 feet (and some do) However,many can grow very healthy at only half that size. People often think the koi are just growing to the size of the pond when actually it's just like us humans.. they have genetics. Most U.S. koi have little ties to Japanese Koi through all of the cross-breeding (although they still very much look the part) And i rarely see them get over (or near) 2 feet unless they have a closer pedigree to Japan and those are fairly expensive.

In my '11 video i state my pond is roughly 500 gallons. It had alittle over- haul in spring to bring it to about 800 gal. (Still on the small side, i know) But the video doesn't show even 5% of the space they have to swim. But even larger Koi wouldn't have a hard time "turning around". The deepest goes down 4.5 feet and i never pan around to show the rest of the interior. I put the camera there because i knew they were there.

The reason why the fish all are bunched up like they are is because I had recently put my hand in the water just before that video and that is their meeting spot when i do so. The age old debate of how many inches of fish per gallon is just that... A debate. Do i recommend throwing 50 fish into a bucket and calling it a pond? I dont. The key is water quality. And if you keep it stable it has been well proven that you can far exceed the inches per gallon calculator (theory) with very healthy fish.You could have 2 identical ponds- One with your suggested 3-5 goldfish and mine as it stands with fish far healthier than your goldfish because of water quality.

My fish right now are on the small side.. You never mentioned once that if they every get over crowded i could re-locate some. Which is what I've always expected as a possibility. You just say their going to get sick.

Know it all's like you, usually turn out knowing the least. All book smarts. Before you fire back saying you've been pond building for 30 years, I'll say this, i know and have consulted with similar builders (and more importantly people with fish experience) who would disagree with much of you say. Everyone has an opinion, and most feel their need to share it. But thanks for your input. I'll let you know when my fish get unhealthy.

Good luck to all with their underwater creations

1st Let me apologize if I offended. That was not the purpose of the post. I did go and view some of your video's and one where you were talking I thought you said 150 gallons. That is the reason I said 3-5 goldfish. 800 gallons could keep small koi for quite some time. Again with proper filtration. 2nd, you stated that genetics have to do with size, some of that is true, some is not. I've seen koi that didn't reach 12" full grown and fish from the exact same parents reach 24"+. There are more than just genetics that need to be considered. I hear that quite often though usually in the opposite direction. usually it's in discussions on how large a koi will grow. But here is my question. Do any of us know what the genetics of the koi we have are? I know the genetics of exactly two fish in my pond. Those two were purposely breed and culled for a particular look by the breeder. So other than those two (Including the fish that I have personally raised I have no clue. I too have some three and four year old fish that have not reached 12" yet. Others have reached 16" and are just over a year old.
I agree with you 100% on the how many inches of fish per gallon, as well as how many koi per gallon. If we do any serious research you will see literally thousands raised in pretty small inclosure's. Again as stated, some can get away with it due to the filtration and water change practices we follow. Have I kept koi in a 500-800 gallon pond, Sure I have. Was I successful? Well that depends on what each of us considers successful. Did I have to relocate? Yep. Did they survive and stay healthy, yep. was I able to keep them for many years and enjoy them. NOPE. they eventually out grew the pond.
I didn't say as they grew that your fish would become sick, I said it can lead to health issues. Did I mention you could re-locate, No and the reason why? Because I believe that when you take on the responsibility to raise a pet that you give it the care that is needed to give you many years of enjoyment. Relocating is always a possibility, But is the new owner going to give your pets the same quality care as you do? Simple fact is we will probably never know. So I don't ever plan on that as a plan of action.
last thing I would like to say as well. I have been on this site for quite a while, you only a few days. many people may get offended by some posts. But PLEASE, keep in mind we may be responding to your thread but I answer to anyone that may read. maybe a new comer to the hobby, maybe to a reader that doesn't even have a pond yet, maybe a well seasoned hobbyist that is new to forums. I'm really not here to Impress anyone with knowledge. My personal purpose is to help another hobbyist be successful and be able to enjoy there pond and aquatic pets to the fullest.
I Don't feel I'm a know it all, I learn something new daily and always open minded that there is in most cases more than one way to get the results we are after. Do I read alot of books, yes, I do. Is that where I learned from. No far from it. I learned mostly from the school of keep it living, If you kill it you goofed up.
Again sorry if I offended, Your pond is very nice looking, Your water crystal clear, and your fish look quite healthy. I was just concerned with the type and amount of fish you have and what appeared to be a very small pond.

 

[sissy]

my neighbors indoor sand bag pond and he got koi but big ones and is now planning an outside pond to move the big ones too .Like anything else it grows and my pond is 10 by 24 and 4 1/2 feet deep and just never expected that these fish would get this big .It is just the unexpected you have to look out for when it comes to ponds .We make comments on here to help and I think I have learned a lot on here and all ponders have to look out for each other .I have only been at this for 8 years so I am a newbie others on here have been at this ponding thing for years now and i rely on them for help and also I like helping others where I can.I think that's what we are all looking for help once in awhile .

 

[epro38]

No apologies necessary but let me add my two cents of explanation. I woke up this morning with emails from gardenpondforum.com commenting on my recent thread? Also with a letter from a relative telling me that they signed me up to the site under my name because they wanted to show others the pond i had built. I understand the good intentions that were ment from this person (moreso now than this morning) however I also knew quickly that i was being fed to the sharks.

I was not in the best of moods when i made my first earlier reply here. As well with explaining to that person why i was displeased. I made that person feel pretty bad over something petty and to that person when/if they read this I sincerely apologize.

I can take criticism but sometimes have a hard time analyzing between it and being attacked, which as defense mechanism can speak out abruptly if not rudely and that i apologize. This is my baby. This i what i spent a year building and hours a day maintaining and enjoying. I think everyone can relate to that. I went full force into educating myself the countless hurdles involved in this. Like probably every builder I've hit unthinkable challenges and am constantly learning more each day from these experiences and others. These fish are my pets (each with a name and identity just like my dog) and are my responsibility to give them the best quality of life i am capable of. As no one would like to give up a pet, i would do so only if it were in their best interest.

I appreciate you taking the time to reply as well following up. The 'know it all' jab was unnecessary as i do appreciate and consider all comments and criticism especially from those more experienced. It just came unexpected and at the wrong time of day lol I'm more of a night person.

Thanks again for all the comments and hopefully i didn't cause any hard feelings amongst the community.