Petsmart koi possible problems

[waynefrcan]

1 is quarantined and it’s hours not days away from fish heaven.

 

[WaterGardener]

You should have quarantined all the new fish before you put them in your pond. Then you could treat them for parasites and diseases to keep them from infecting your pond.

I'm very careful.adding new fish because I don't want to harm the ones I have. I put them in a cycled 150 gallon quarantine tank with good filtration and leave them there for as much as 6 months. If I see any problems, I can treat that small amount of water and not have the expense of treating the entire pond.

Just putting a fish in quarantine won't cure them, if that is what you mean. I'm not understanding what you intend to say, other than one fish is dying.

Also, if you have 10 year old koi that are only 12" long, I have to wonder why they are still so small. Are you sure those are koi?

You should be able to find those medications online. Fluke-M comes from England, but if you don't want to use that, get praziquantil. That should be easy to find.

 

[waynefrcan]

You should have quarantined all the new fish before you put them in your pond. Then you could treat them for parasites and diseases to keep them from infecting your pond.

I'm very careful.adding new fish because I don't want to harm the ones I have. I put them in a cycled 150 gallon quarantine tank with good filtration and leave them there for as much as 6 months. If I see any problems, I can treat that small amount of water and not have the expense of treating the entire pond.

Just putting a fish in quarantine won't cure them, if that is what you mean. I'm not understanding what you intend to say, other than one fish is dying.

Also, if you have 10 year old koi that are only 12" long, I have to wonder why they are still so small. Are you sure those are koi?

You should be able to find those medications online. Fluke-M comes from England, but if you don't want to use that, get praziquantil. That should be easy to find.

lol ok they’re probably bigger just estimates. We have winter conditions here for 6 months -20 to -35 C, no feeding.1 in quarantine with no treatment but salt at .3 %. .

 

[waynefrcan]

Well I put .3 - .4 % salt with the quarantined koi and seems some improvement.

 

[waynefrcan]

As usual the opinions are all over the place on what amount will kill the bad organisms and what won’t harm the fish.

 

[waynefrcan]

This is a weird one. Tonight all the fish are swimming and eating even ones just at noon today we’re sitting on the bottom. Maybe just stressed from those sick Petsmart koi and have fought it off after 10 days? Even less red streaks and fins.

 

[WaterGardener]

Thanks for the update. Glad to know they are improving.

There are always different ways to deal with problems. Good that you found one that seems to work for your fish.

 

[waynefrcan]

Between noon and the evening that day I did take 1 sick fish and 2 dead ones to see an aquatic species Vet. She couldn’t determine the illness anymore than what I and you guys know and internet info as the symptoms shown could be any number of things. She did say the gills showed redness.

I’m a bit annoyed that the Vet could not even narrow down the possibilities. She did say the signs could just be stress related.

She recommended a salt treatment and gave formalin meds also and gave detailed instructions on how to do both.

So now as mentioned the pond fish have improved on their own and slowly have got better. But still some sick and weak ones just not as bad as before. I have done a .15 % salt treatment so far.

Now I’m debating the next step. More salt which means disrupting the whole pond balance with draining the pond etc because I have plants.

 

[waynefrcan]

The quarantine tank after .3 to .4 % showed improvements with both fish. I drained the whole tank 1.5 times and got the salt level down to .02 %. Then I put in the formalin and the koi died in 1 hour and the goldfish developed black patches and was dead by morning. So that stuff is a killer if the fish are weak. It would be the last resort for the pond fish I think.

 

[mrsclem]

Posted on your other thread. Formalin doesn't mix with salt.

 

[WaterGardener]

It should be plainly stated on the bottle that it can't be used with salt.

I have used it more than once over the years without any negative effects to the fish.

I realize that you ended up with a very small amount of salt in the quarantine tank, but that doesn't take into account the amount of salt the fish would have absorbed.

Black patches sound like ammonia burns. Also, gills are supposed to be red, very red, like blood. That's a good thing. It's when they turn pale that there is a problem.

 

[GBBUDD]

My suggestion is do not buy from petrol. For a pond there are many decent breeders or stores that specialize in koi that are reasonably priced. HOWEVER this does by no means excuse the recommendation of quarantine.
I pretty much have limited myself to one dealer but he buys from dozens of breeders in Japan. So I will still give newcomers the basic round of proforma c a prazi. But you still need to observe the behavior or skin condition even swimming habbits for signs of trouble.

 

[waynefrcan]

It should be plainly stated on the bottle that it can't be used with salt.

I have used it more than once over the years without any negative effects to the fish.

I realize that you ended up with a very small amount of salt in the quarantine tank, but that doesn't take into account the amount of salt the fish would have absorbed.

Black patches sound like ammonia burns. Also, gills are supposed to be red, very red, like blood. That's a good thing. It's when they turn pale that there is a problem.

blunted, red gills, rapid breathing

Possible septicaemia

Those are in her report.

.02 % that’s nothing but with formalin (formaldehyde 37%) still a killer.

 

[waynefrcan]

My suggestion is do not buy from petrol. For a pond there are many decent breeders or stores that specialize in koi that are reasonably priced. HOWEVER this does by no means excuse the recommendation of quarantine.
I pretty much have limited myself to one dealer but he buys from dozens of breeders in Japan. So I will still give newcomers the basic round of proforma c a prazi. But you still need to observe the behavior or skin condition even swimming habbits for signs of trouble.

Are you saying (buy American made) should not be adhered too?). I haven’t bought a koi in 5 years, but at that time there was just introduced a law banning imports or breeding of Japanese koi, forgot all the details. Somehow still Petsmart got around that with USA bred koi. I know they are of lesser quality and the worst trait is as they age all their colors start fading to white

 

[WaterGardener]

If those fish did have septicemia, there is little chance that anything would have saved them. Even when people go septic, it's difficult to save them. It can be done with some pretty serious drugs, but I doubt a fish would have a chance.

I doubt the final blow was the formalin itself, but maybe the abrupt water change and addition of more medication was too much for them to handle.

Sorry that you and your fish are going through this.