Skimmer and or bottom drain

[GBBUDD]

A bottom drain in epdm as your first seal your first puncture through a liner is a bit risky.

But I have to agree with you both. If done properly and the epdm is protected and shielded from the uv rays of the sun. It can live 50 years. I installed rubber roofs back in the 80's and one was just like a pond it had parapit walls on 4 sides with two roof drains. It's covered by a deck it has been replaced the rubber has not.

But nothing is forever mother nature will even claim your concrete ponds I don't care how thick you make the walls .

Look at the Roman's part of the aqueducts still are used today. I'm sure they have been patched but still going after 3000 years.

But if you are thinking of a bottom drain and your a first time builder I would recommend digging the trench for the drain and the piping just like you would if you were putting it under the liner but make everything a little larger so you can install the fabric liner and fabric them place your plumbing and drain ONTOP /INSIDE the liner. And then cover it all with rocks . Maybe concrete to hold the drain in place so it can't move and run the plumbing up and over the sides. Wala bottom drains no puncture.

 

[combatwombat]

But if you are thinking of a bottom drain and your a first time builder I would recommend digging the trench for the drain and the piping just like you would if you were putting it under the liner but make everything a little larger so you can install the fabric liner and fabric them place your plumbing and drain ONTOP /INSIDE the liner. And then cover it all with rocks . Maybe concrete to hold the drain in place so it can't move and run the plumbing up and over the sides. Wala bottom drains no puncture.

Aren't you going to get a bunch of crud stuck in your trench that the bottom drain can't get?

 

[GBBUDD]

Not if its filled with pipe , rock , and gravel . How many boulders do you have that are backfilled with gravel. besides i have no issues with the muck muck it the bi product of decay and muck while yes it promotes growth it does not allow water flow through it but just saturated. Plants thrive from this and also gives insects bacteria and microbes A home this is a pond ! I'm pulling apart the static bog due to the African violet. while it was full and flowering its not the look i wanted. you would not believe all the critters in that muck, worms, beetles spiders, and all kinds of odd things i cant even describe like the translucent work/slug 2inches long that when it moved you could see it's inside sliding in the outer clear casing

 

[combatwombat]

How many boulders do you have that are backfilled with gravel.

Lots! But I don't have a bottom drain. Haha. I guess most of the folks I know with a bottom drain are pretty militant about "no rocks on the bottom" and "no nooks and crannies for crud to accumulate." You're pretty much the only person I've ever known to have both a bottom drain and gravel bottom. Honestly, kind of wish I'd explored it further myself. Every time I looked into it, the consensus seemed to be "bottom drain and gravel are incompatible."

I know better now that there are no hard and fast pond rules, but I didn't know that when I was making that decision. Almost certain I couldn't do it with sand, though. And, so far, I am really liking the sand bottom.

 

[Fruit loop]

Lots! But I don't have a bottom drain. Haha. I guess most of the folks I know with a bottom drain are pretty militant about "no rocks on the bottom" and "no nooks and crannies for crud to accumulate." You're pretty much the only person I've ever known to have both a bottom drain and gravel bottom. Honestly, kind of wish I'd explored it further myself. Every time I looked into it, the consensus seemed to be "bottom drain and gravel are incompatible."

I know better now that there are no hard and fast pond rules, but I didn't know that when I was making that decision. Almost certain I couldn't do it with sand, though. And, so far, I am really liking the sand bottom.

Hmmm you went with a sand bottom?? Interesting! Why did you decide that? What do you like about it?

 

[combatwombat]

Hmmm you went with a sand bottom?? Interesting! Why did you decide that? What do you like about it?

It looks awesome, feels nice on the feet, will provide a ridiculous amount of SSA for bacteria to colonize (I am pumping water through the sand) and leaves/debris can’t get down into it so I can just net out stuff that sinks.

 

[Fruit loop]

It looks awesome, feels nice on the feet, will provide a ridiculous amount of SSA for bacteria to colonize (I am pumping water through the sand) and leaves/debris can’t get down into it so I can just net out stuff that sinks.

That is really an idea! I'll have to look at your more recent posts to take a look. Last time I saw your videos you were still moving boulders with the purple beast.

 

[combatwombat]

Downsides are that it’s easy to displace by kicking it around and it silts your the water pretty quick when you disturb it, but I plan to filter out that silt over time.

 

[combatwombat]

That is really an idea! I'll have to look at your more recent posts to take a look. Last time I saw your videos you were still moving boulders with the purple beast.

I am actually STILL moving boulders with the purple beast. haha

 

[GBBUDD]

It's too early to tell he only just got his water running yesterday.

 

[Jhn]

Downsides are that it’s easy to displace by kicking it around and it silts your the water pretty quick when you disturb it, but I plan to filter out that silt over time.

It will stop doing that overtime once bacteria and stuff gets going colonizing it. That is why reef tanks with sand beds don’t get kicked up all over the place even when fish disturb it because the finer stuff gets stuck together by bacteria colonies and other critters living in it. Granted freshwater is a little different.

Have a 2’ deep section of my pond that has fine sand in it for 12-13 years now, doesn’t kick up at all when I walk through it. Lilies have kind of taken over that area of my pond as I just left them there after they jumped their pots. As you said crap doesn’t sink in to it and is easy to scoop crap off of it.

 

[combatwombat]

It will stop doing that overtime once bacteria and stuff gets going colonizing it. That is why reef tanks with sand beds don’t get kicked up all over the place even when fish disturb it because the finer stuff gets stuck together by bacteria colonies and other critters living in it. Granted freshwater is a little different.

Have a 2’ deep section of my pond that has fine sand in it for 12-13 years now, doesn’t kick up at all when I walk through it. Lilies have kind of taken over that area of my pond as I just left them there after they jumped their pots. As you said crap doesn’t sink in to it and is easy to scoop crap off of it.

That's good to know. The water turns brown really fast right now whenever I disturb it, but have been hoping that will improve over time. Figured I could add quilt batting or run a sand and gravel filter sporadically as needed if it didn't improve.

 

[GBBUDD]

Yes but didn't you place flow through the sand like a bog or was it reverse and more like a under-gravel filter.

 

[combatwombat]

Yes but didn't you place flow through the sand like a bog or was it reverse and more like a under-gravel filter.

It’s a pressure filter—so water being pushed through like a bog. Figured suction wouldn’t work with sand.