Turtles with Koi???

Discussion in 'Garden Pond Talk' started by Karen, May 9, 2011.

  1. Karen

    Karen I'd rather be Fishin'

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    Just started/built our pond. Haven't added any fish to it yet...letting it run and filter right now. My kids want to add those small turltes "painted or slider turtles". Can you have Koi and small Turtles in a pond???
     
    Karen, May 9, 2011
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  2. Karen

    mew5280 Mary, Denver, CO

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    I'm not an expert, but I had a turtle and koi together just fine. Just one turtle and one koi at the time. And I have a small pond, 600 gallons.
     
    mew5280, May 9, 2011
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  3. Karen

    vertigo72

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    Many people say it can be done, and probably so if you have small turtles and big enough fish, but do keep in mind turtles are predators and will eat smaller fish. Here is a video that shows why I would think twice: warning, not pretty scenes for fish lovers:

    [ame]
     
    vertigo72, May 9, 2011
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  4. Karen

    mikeinpgh

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    I want to put a turtle in my pond also. The majority of what I have read leads me not to do it. I've read the turtles might hurt or kill the fish. Also, the turtles will probably just wander off some day.
     
    mikeinpgh, May 9, 2011
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  5. Karen

    Karen I'd rather be Fishin'

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    Thanks for all the info....appreciate it!
     
    Karen, May 9, 2011
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  6. Karen

    fishin4cars True friends just call me Larkin Moderator

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    We tried it, must have put 10-12 baby turtles in the pond over the years. Sliders, soft shells, painted, and Musk Every one ended up wandering off. The one that stayed the longest was a musk turtle, he wondered up on his own and got in the pond and stayed for a couple of years. he was cool, got so tame he would come up and eat out of your hand. When we re-did the pond I moved it to the small pond, Guess he didn't like that one as he only stayed in there for a few days and then we never saw it again. Starting small they seem to be fine if you can keep them there but as they grow their instincts are going to drive them to hunting for food. It's natural instinct, question is can you handle if he finds and catches one for a late afternoon snack.
     
    fishin4cars, May 9, 2011
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  7. Karen

    hewhoisatpeace Evil Genius

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    Neat idea if you want to teach the kids survival of the fittest, but bad idea with koi. Too expensive and well-mannered to execute. Maybe with feeder goldfish, but if you think fish are messy, you ain't seen nothing yet. Turtles are truly filthy animals, littering their water with body fluids and body parts, which will soon begin to stink if not cleaned almost religiously.

    There is a variety of turtle that looks like sliders and is a vegetarian, but hard to find. And still messy. How big is your pond? Unless it is over 1000g, I'd try to stay away from koi. Shubunkin goldfish, which are cheaper and far hardier, still grow to be 8-10 inches long, and are a lot easier to keep. They have long fins and awesome color variety, plus they change color often as they age, like koi.
     
    hewhoisatpeace, May 10, 2011
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  8. Karen

    NichrfUNLV

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    I have a pond with 7 red eared sliders and plenty of goldfish/koi...

    I bought a lot of "feeder goldfish" and they never touch them.

    I adopted my turtles from people who had them in tanks so they are accustomed to humans feeding them.

    The point is how "domesticated" they are.

    As for their "messiness".......I have a good filter I only have to clean my pond once a year. Yes they are messy but the fish/plants do a good job of cleaning them up.

    Last but not least the turtles are a riot to watch especially when they beg for food!
     
    NichrfUNLV, May 10, 2011
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  9. Karen

    fishin4cars True friends just call me Larkin Moderator

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    I had the turtle that stayed in the pond with my fish for well over a year. 100% wild, yea, musk turtles stay pretty small but I never saw it go after a fish and really never noticed much waste. I don't recall missing any fish when it was in the pond. It would come straight to the edge and hide and wait for food. he was so fun to watch because the Big fish would just push him out of the way to get to the food and they got along fine. Now, that being said, that was one turtle, Not a pond full and another of the same kind could react 100% different. I have seen many ponds with small to med. size sliders in them and haven't seen that much of problems either. If you do put turtles in, I would recommend really good filtration and keep a close eye on them. This is one of those topics that could go either way, it could work and it could not. I'm not saying it is safe and each person responding can easily be correct for a given pond on any given day.
     
    fishin4cars, May 10, 2011
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  10. Karen

    UT_Bruce

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    Assuming the turtles are too tiny to eat your koi, the thing I'd be most worried about is disease, increased organic waste, and parasites. Turtles poop and pee a LOT, thus upsetting nitrogen levels and increasing sludge production. Turtles also carry parasites that could be harmful to such an expensive investment as Koi.

    This comes direct from my friends the Krebles, fairly famous koi breeders in my neck of the woods.

    I would say... if you can find a way to 'de-parasite' the turtles, and supplement your pond with a microbial digester (such as my BZT Koi & Pond), small turtles would be ok. Otherwise, I'd avoid adding them, unless you're willing to risk your investment.
     
    UT_Bruce, May 10, 2011
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  11. Karen

    mogsie

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    wow ut_bruce you really do your very best to promote microbial bacteria additives dont you !! particularly your bzt koi & pond, ive yet to read 1 single post from you where you dont reccomend something along those lines !! lol

    you should post first in the introductions thread,
     
    mogsie, May 10, 2011
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  12. Karen

    UT_Bruce

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    Thanks for pointing that out. I'm learning my way around here, so please cut me a little slack. Microbial additives is my field, so that's generally what I know about, but I suppose I should tone down the product naming convention and stick to generic terms. I do want to be helpful, but not step on toes. I have much I'd like to gain from this forum as well.

    As for the introductions thread, I'll gladly take your suggestion to heart, though I'm heading out to see the Dalai Lama in a few minutes. Should be back Friday. And no, I won't be trying to sell him bugs. :)
     
    UT_Bruce, May 10, 2011
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  13. Karen

    talal101

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    i would not risk it because you may get attatched to the turtle and as it grows it my attack your koi and then you have a double dilemma
     
    talal101, May 10, 2011
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  14. Karen

    j.w I Love my Goldies

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    I think if it was me I'd build a separate shallow pond for the turtles. You don't have to worry about them eating your fish or making a mess except in their own little sanctuary. Make it safe so they can't escape as they will try and are quite good at climbing :nono:
     
    j.w, May 11, 2011
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  15. Karen

    talal101

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    Yeah I agree j.w, she has a great idea. Why not make a separate shallow pond for the turtles and if not possible i would say don't get a turtle or get a very young turtle and feed it by hand so that is won't hunt and get a taste for fish
     
    talal101, May 11, 2011
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  16. Karen

    Karen I'd rather be Fishin'

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    I guess I should've mentioned...the pond is at 2000 gals. and the turtles are about the size of a half dollar, just a little bigger than a quarter. They are very small, but have 4 of them that the kids "rescued" and want to add to the pond....haven't bought any fish yet, going this weekend. I have a good filtration system, at least it should be.
     
    Karen, May 11, 2011
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  17. Karen

    j.w I Love my Goldies

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    Oh man if they are that little then no problemo. It will be a long time before they can catch a fish or even get one in their little mouths. Maybe by then they will have become accustomed to them and will be friends...........who knows :lol:
    They are tiny but still can escape. They need a floating platform to climb on to get out of the water cuz I think they can drown if they don't have one and they love to sun themselves too :cool:
    Mine loved to eat raw hamburger and tadpoles (made the mistake of putting some in the little pool I made when I was a kid) :(
    They were tiny little turtles I bought at the pet store but they could move pretty fast in the water :rolleyes:
     
    j.w, May 11, 2011
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  18. Karen

    j.w I Love my Goldies

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    Oh and remember to have the kids and anyone else wash their hands if they handle the babies as they can carry Salmonella :(
     
    j.w, May 11, 2011
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  19. Karen

    fishin4cars True friends just call me Larkin Moderator

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    They need a floating platform to climb on to get out of the water cuz I think they can drown if they don't have one and they love to sun themselves too

    Actually they need the place to get out and sun so the the shell can harden and they can process calcium. If they can't sun bath the shell softens and it can cause parasites, diseases, and shut down internal body functions.
    This is true, baby turtles are carriers, best prevenative is washing you hands with hot water and antibacterial soap, You can also use bleach but bleach isn't really good for your skin and is pretty strong, you can dilute it but that makes the bleach less effective.
    Salmonella is the reason they quit selling them in pet store for a long time, Now to get one from a pet store they either have to be hatchling raised and bred or be 4" across.(1 year old)
     
    fishin4cars, May 11, 2011
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  20. Karen

    Karen I'd rather be Fishin'

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    I let the kids go ahead and put the turtles in. We added a piece of drift wood. Not a good photo but here is one of the lil' guys taking a break....found out they are called "painted turtles". Still haven't added fish yet....
     

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    Karen, May 11, 2011
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