Val and I are in total shock.

Discussion in 'Fish & Koi Talk' started by Dave 54, Feb 22, 2018.

  1. Dave 54

    Dave 54

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    Last weekend I did a routine water change using the trickle method of adding waterthe winter (trickle it in using the ambient temperature of the pond to warm the incoming trickle as it enters the pond
    Being 30+ year veterans at keeping Koi ,we have never lost a lot a koi to the winter yet,as a result of our water change I was horrified to find not one but 11 koi died and we dont know the reason for this damage . the water test kits all read normal Our clubs health officer spent a freezing hour testing water with me his assistant ,and eliminated everything we could think of . we checked over two dead koi the latest to die and the first we saw yesterday , they look alive but each when you look at the gills they both show dead gill tissue in patches with red in between that looks normal too us
    We looked at what can damage the koi;s gills like that as either poison or some unknown factor
    Believe you me we covered anything we could think of and more so but have come up drawing a blank with nearly everything we can think of .
    Our oldest koi at age 30 + years hurts the most we though of him as a friend he was always first up for food and loved Orange as a treat .
    Strangely all but one koi that survived are our latest koi i;e bought within the last few years with a 27 year old koi for company , why did these three survive whilst 11 others perished.
    Was it the CyHV3 KHV virus ?, no its far too cold this time of year to be active , the same can be said for Parasites .
    If it was bacterial the koi wouldnt be in perfect condition , strike that off the list
    I changed my Policarbonate sheets this year could it have been those .
    Im also experimenting with milk bottles shreaded and made into filter material so It might have been culprit but its been working faultlessly since last summer and should be alright .
    Are there any long term koi keeping members of the Forum that has a working koi health Knowledge such as ourselves that could possibly answer this please or add fresh input as to the reasons why ?
    Thanx

    Dave 54
     
    Dave 54, Feb 22, 2018
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  2. Dave 54

    sissy sissy

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    WOW really sorry to hear this and I am sure you will get to the bottom of what happened .Is there any way these plastics were treated with something .I can't see that happening but the you never know .I mean any thing in the water would show up in your tests except for some type of poison .I know here plastic is recycled over and over again but it is tested to be sure it is food safe .
     
    sissy, Feb 22, 2018
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  3. Dave 54

    j.w I Love my Goldies

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    So sorry to hear this Dave.
     
    j.w, Feb 22, 2018
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  4. Dave 54

    BarbO

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    I am so sorry to hear this story Dave. I am a long time Discus keeper and water quality is #1 with these fish. We are taught that when fish die this fast, it is chemical poisoning of some kind. Chlorine comes to mind first. Does your water have it there? If so, maybe the city added more on purpose or accidentally? Do you have any bad neighbors who could have poured something into the pond?I hope you don't lose anymore Koi. Best of luck.
     
    BarbO, Feb 22, 2018
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  5. Dave 54

    RobAmy

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    Not good Dave, sorry for the loss
     
    RobAmy, Feb 22, 2018
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  6. Dave 54

    HomerJay

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    Chlorine or Chloramines? I would have to suspect one of those unless it's well water. When was the water last changed?
     
    HomerJay, Feb 22, 2018
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  7. Dave 54

    Lisak1

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    Oh, no! This is terrible news! I hope you can get to the bottom of it @Dave 54 .
     
    Lisak1, Feb 22, 2018
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  8. Dave 54

    mrsclem mrsclem

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    Dave- so very sorry to hear this. I hope you can find out what caused the deaths as not knowing is the worst. I would never imagined that you would experience a loss like this.
     
    mrsclem, Feb 22, 2018
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  9. Dave 54

    Tula

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    Oh no ! @Dave 54 , I'm so sorry, I'm sure you and Val are in complete shock. I know you loved your oldest koi and would proudly talk about him, very sad.

    When was the last time you saw them alive and active? Did anything change between then and when you found them dead? Again, I'm so very sorry.
     
    Tula, Feb 23, 2018
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  10. Dave 54

    Dave 54

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    Firstly thank you all for your kind words and in answer to some of your questions ,@BarbO @HomerJay the chlorine is taken out before entering the pond with the use of a large three chambered water purifier chloromines arent a problem here in the UK.
    @Tula The water change was the weekend before during our winter water change program which is routine once Monthly with the filters , they were all fine after the water change up until I found them and you know the care and attention we give ours besides I've got them all through every winter that they have been outdoors .@mrsclem Neither did we Val was so proud of Brown Top our oldest and largest koi which she treated like a pet we thought we would still be reporting his birthdays up past 40+ and besides that we even have an arrangement with a koi rescue service run by my friend Max who is the charities owner .
    @sissy we thought about this but why now in the middle of winter Our health officer and I thought about that also he thinks it could be the suspect I don't for some reason but if he is right there would be miles of cut up milk bottle surfaces that may be leaching out a chemical.
    @BarbO , we are having problems with our next door neighbour but I dont think he would stoop that low , besides the problem he has with us is a parking issue Taxi's dropping off in his space and all that , all rather childish we tend to ignore his rants nowadays and we are still friendly with his wife .
    @Lisak1 if there is a bottom to get too we'll find it .
    Dave 54
     
    Dave 54, Feb 23, 2018
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  11. Dave 54

    addy1 water gardener / gold fish and shubunkins Moderator

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    So sorry Dave. Hope you find out the cause.
     
    addy1, Feb 23, 2018
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  12. Dave 54

    Becky Administrator

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    Oh my goodness, how awful! I'm so sorry to hear that @Dave 54, must be awful for you and Val. I hope you manage to get to the bottom if what caused it :eek::(
     
    Becky, Feb 23, 2018
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  13. Dave 54

    Tula

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    I'm still scratching my head wondering what happened and feeling sad you for and Val.
     
    Tula, Feb 23, 2018
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  14. Dave 54

    Faebinder

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    Wow so sorry to read this story.

    Thoughts:
    Chlorine Containments do not explain big fish dying first, it should be smaller fish. Oxygen is the culprit... but why. The trickle water should have taken care of the water temperature difference unless it just didn't do it.
     
    Faebinder, Feb 23, 2018
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  15. Dave 54

    sissy sissy

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    Stuff that is put in city water can deplete oxygen in the water as the oxygen in water is what causes bacteria to grow .I know that is why city water here is now treated with activated charcoal .I can even buy the buckets from the guy for 5 dollars a bucket( 5 gallon bucket ) and that is dirt cheap for activated charcoal .
     
    sissy, Feb 23, 2018
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  16. Dave 54

    bettasngoldfish Maria

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    I am so sorry to hear this Dave :(

    Please keep us updated.
     
    bettasngoldfish, Feb 23, 2018
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  17. Dave 54

    Tula

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    @audioenvy , You've recently become a "Certified Koi Keeper", have you any thoughts / insights, on this situation ?
     
    Tula, Feb 24, 2018
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  18. Dave 54

    audioenvy

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    audioenvy, Feb 24, 2018
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  19. Dave 54

    Dave 54

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    Mortified Becky utterly mortified , I'm going through everything we do to see if anything is different , one theory I have may be the super chilling of the ponds water due to high winds coming over from Siberia the wind's speed coming up the side of the flat is quite fast which would give us a higher than normal windchill which may well be the culprit , I'm spending the rest of the time reading up on gill damage and its causes , but with all the drop test readings reading normal and this being bourne out by Our health officers more sensitive drop test kits excluding ammonia Nitrates Nitrites and Ph levels
    Kh levels chlorine levels etc came up as slightly down and nil, we even thought poison ........
    We will eventually hit pay dirt with the answer with both of us looking into it ..

    Dave 54
     
    Dave 54, Feb 25, 2018
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  20. Dave 54

    Lisak1

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    Poison did cross my mind, too @Dave 54 - but wouldn't you think that would take all the fish, not just most of them? And the surviving three still look fine? That's the mysterious part - why did they not all succumb to whatever it was that caused this?
     
    Lisak1, Feb 25, 2018
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