Water loss


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Hello everyone.

Too bad I didn't think about consulting a forum before spending huge amounts of money and time on my pond. I am happy with the current one, though, after literally years of trial & error, but I have one problem that is really frustrating and I hope someone here could help me with it.

I have a plastic pond of about 1000 L, to which I connected a 4000 L/H pump which goes to a small stream (~3M long), and another pump which goes to a plastic spillway. the stream is made of black liner.

My problem is this: every time i run the system, I lose a considerable amount of water. The water level in the pond immediately is lowered due to the water that now fill the tubes, the stream and the spillway - I get it. What I don't get is why after an hour of run, another amount of water (seems like the same amount but not sure about it), is lost. After another hour, there is another lowering, this time the pumps are getting exposed so I turn the system off.

No matter how much I searched, I couldn't find a tear in the liner or any other spills. I even took out the pebbles I put in the stream in the first place, assuming that maybe the lost water are trapped between them, but without effect. the loss of water occur both during day and night.

so, if someone could offer a solution to this problem, it will be very appreciated.

Thank you.
 
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An incredible amount of water can be lost from waterfalls. And fast moving currents
 

mrsclem

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Where is the 2nd pump and what does it supply? If it feeds the water back up to the top, it may be pumping too much. The 4000 pump may be too much as well. Need those pics!
 

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and welcome @Iceviper
 
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Do you actually have a leak?
When you turn off the pump, does the water all flow back to the pond and resume the original level?

If there is indeed water loss, most leaks occur from a waterfall, stream or the plumbing.
It's best to start with turning off your pump(s), this way you take all the plumbing and water features out of the equation.

If you turn off the pump and top off the pond, does the level remain or is there water loss?
 
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Hello again to everyone. thanks for the greetings and sorry for the late reply. I am attaching here a couple of picture in which you can see the setup. I know, some cleaning is in order...
secondly, the pond is 265 L, not 1000. my bad.

anyway,
GBBUDD - What do you mean by water loss due to waterfall? the point is that all the water is getting back to the pond, isn't it?
poconojoe - yes, already tried to plug off the pumps (both, and one at a time to check if it is a problem from the stream or just the small waterfall). worth trying it again, though.
mrsclem - the second pump fill the small artificial spillway.

I know that a leak might occur due to fast moving currents, and did everything I could to prevent that from happening. I checked closely that not a single drop goes out of the stream, which has a fast and nice flow. the water fills most of the liner, but don't get to the shoulders to spill.

 

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Again, most leaks are from either the plumbing or a water feature such as a waterfall or stream.

You said you turned off the pumps. Did you wait long enough, maybe a couple of days with both pumps off to see if the water level changed?
 
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Again, most leaks are from either the plumbing or a water feature such as a waterfall or stream.

You said you turned off the pumps. Did you wait long enough, maybe a couple of days with both pumps off to see if the water level changed?
yes. actually I turn the system on just a couple of days every week. in all other days the system is turned off, with the water level at the top (after a re-fill because of said problem), and this is how I can tell there's no leakage from the pond. about the plumbing, can't tell. it's a possibility. I checked the area around the tubes (they are covered with sand), and it was dry.
 
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yes. actually I turn the system on just a couple of days every week. in all other days the system is turned off, with the water level at the top (after a re-fill because of said problem), and this is how I can tell there's no leakage from the pond. about the plumbing, can't tell. it's a possibility. I checked the area around the tubes (they are covered with sand), and it was dry.
Ok, you determined there's definitely no leak in the pond.
That leaves the plumbing or one of the water features.
You'll have to determine from process of elimination which it is.
Just because you don't "see" a leak or moisture, doesnt mean there isn't. Water can be tricky.
 
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ok, i'll check the plumbing again. I agree that this might be the source of the problem.

By the way, what do you about the pump power vs. the pond volume?
 
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I would bet that it's somewhere in the spillway, river or the plumbing connection at the spillway.
How did you transition between the plumbing to the spillway? Is it just an open pipe flowing into the river or is there a box or weir that the plumbing connects to?

What type of pipes or hoses are you using?
The common corregated "pond hose" they sell is horrible. It doesn't last very long. Its prone to cracking and pin holes. It won't last very long, maybe one season, two if you're lucky.
Any pipes that are buried should be standard ridgid or flexible PVC properly primed and glued.

I only use regular ridgid PVC and flex PVC now. I wish I knew about flex PVC earlier. I would have saved money and work in the long run. It's totally compatible with regular ridgid PVC. It uses the same primer and glue and uses the same fittings.

All my plumbing is within the pond and bog. If something ever did spring a leak, the water cannot escape the system. I guess that would be hard for you to do with the river, but I thought I'd mention that.
 
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When checking plumbing, check primarily at fittings. That is where you are most likely to find a leak. I really bet it's your stream/waterfall, though. It's very easy to get a leak in a stream. Check every inch of your liner edge around your stream for a wet spot and/or run the feature when full and inspect every inch to see where water may be wicking up and out of stream.
 
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If it's possible, can you take the plumbing out of the equation?
Disconnect at the pump, connect a temporary hose to the pump, run it up to the spillway/stream. If it's still losing water, it's your spillway or stream.
 
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brokensword

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you could also run a hose from the pump and place it at the river's beginning, thus eliminating the plumbing and waterfall/weir. If you still lose water, then you know it's the stream. If not, then you know it's either the plumbing or waterfall/weir. Then do the hose to waterfall/weir bypassing the plumbing, as PJ suggests.
 
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I would bet that it's somewhere in the spillway, river or the plumbing connection at the spillway.
How did you transition between the plumbing to the spillway? Is it just an open pipe flowing into the river or is there a box or weir that the plumbing connects to?

What type of pipes or hoses are you using?
The common corregated "pond hose" they sell is horrible. It doesn't last very long. Its prone to cracking and pin holes. It won't last very long, maybe one season, two if you're lucky.
Any pipes that are buried should be standard ridgid or flexible PVC properly primed and glued.

I only use regular ridgid PVC and flex PVC now. I wish I knew about flex PVC earlier. I would have saved money and work in the long run. It's totally compatible with regular ridgid PVC. It uses the same primer and glue and uses the same fittings.

All my plumbing is within the pond and bog. If something ever did spring a leak, the water cannot escape the system. I guess that would be hard for you to do with the river, but I thought I'd mention that.
1. I use flex PVC hose to the river, which go directly to a shallow basin inside the river. the basin edges are pretty high so the water doesn't manage to accumulate before spilling into the river, so no water lose from the basin.
2. in the spillway I use regular, simple garden hose

I do suspect the connectors has some contribution to the problem. I am thinking about changing the setup a bit, maybe decreasing the river flow power.

Poconojoe, brokensword: thanks for the idea. As I wrote, in the past I tried turning off each of the pumps to eliminate problems but never tried to isolate the plumbing. I'll try that.
 
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