Weeds

[RachelR]

Hello, all. We are planning on putting down weed stop fabric covered with rocks around our pond once we are at that point in our renovation. My concern is that we did this in our flower beds last summer, yet we noticed today we have a bunch of weeds/plants starting to grow up between the rocks. I don’t know what we could have done wrong, but we want to avoid this same problem when we do the pond area. Does anyone have any solutions or advice? I considered using vegetation killer on everything in the flower beds, but we have some bushes in them we are afraid will be damaged if we do this. Help!!!

 

[JamieB]

Thick mulch is the trick to keeping weeds down, but it’s only good if you pluck out any weeds that pop up growing in it. It prevents weeds from growing up from the soil, and new seeds from growing deep roots.

 

[Stephen Noble]

Hi RachelR,
Are the weeds showing up at a seam between two pieces or all over the place where the weed fabric covers?
If all over, the fabric was probably too thin. I would first carefully remove all of the weeds surrounding your pond (to clean bare earth), carefully cover the area with some Preen and then use a very heavy weed barrier. Make absolutely sure all of the ground surrounding the pond slopes away from your pond before using Preen. Groundwater flowing into the pond could kill your fish.

 

[RachelR]

Thick mulch is the trick to keeping weeds down, but it’s only good if you pluck out any weeds that pop up growing in it. It prevents weeds from growing up from the soil, and new seeds from growing deep roots.

The weed blocking fabric we bought was supposed to be the best fabric. Mulching now isn’t an option because we have several tons of rock down. Plus, mulch has to be replaced more often than we want to do it. We mulched for 20 years before we put the rocks in.

 

[Stephen Noble]

Could you please post a picture of the area? It will greatly help.

 

[Waterbug]

Yes, this has been a problem with weed blocking fabric for many years. I see it in many yards and have heard professionals talk about it. There are several issues.

There will always be edges. The fabric, even when permeable will funnel water to edges and seams giving plants more water there and weed growth. Same thing happens at the edges of roads and sidewalks, cracks in concrete, etc...

Once down and gravel or whatever is placed on top organic material starts to collect on top, composts and a perfect place for plants to grow. Non-permeable material like plastic collects water so the plants can grow on top. Wood mulch for example is sometimes added and it makes a great compost for plants. So you get a few years of few weeds and then more and more.

Holes will be created over time from install, creatures digging, people digging. Some plants can grow in those holes and thanks to the fabric be very hard to remove.

Over time the fabric tends to become exposed in places, UV destroys it, more plants get in.

The biggest issue is once this fabric is installed and starts to fail it can be very difficult to remove.

Some landscapers I respect refuse to use these products anymore. But many homeowners insist on its use because it sounds good. It's good marketing. IMO the best thing to do is to make something that is long lasting and is realistic in expectations. You will get weeds. Best to make them super easy to pull. For me that is done with sand. I add enough sand to the soil so the soil won't compact. That can be even 100% sand if level and washing away isn't a risk. Easy to pull weeds from sand and the fast drainage (hopefully) reduces the window for a weed to get going so fewer weeds. I also like high and low spots so weed seeds tend to wash down into low spots where I can have a deep bed of sand. 4-12" if possible.

Keeping after the weeds is best too. Easier to remove a 3 day old weed compared to giving them a month long head start.

 

[Somethin' Fishy]

Avoid the weed killer so that it doesn't wash into your pond.

Personally, I use layers of newspapers and cardboard and sometimes with weed fabric on top of that. Still, seeds from unwanted plants always seem to arrive from above and will somehow find just enough dirt in between the rocks to take hold; but at least they're easier to pull.

In areas around our pond where I didn't have to worry about runoff into the pond, or runoff into areas that would drown edging plants, I placed scraps of pond liner under the rocks.

 

[sissy]

I think weed blocking material is just a scam ,it keeps water from trying to get to the ground under it but birds and other critters drop seeds where ever they go .Even the wind and rain bring seeds with them .The only thing I use it for is to line my flower hanging baskets to help keep some of the water in the plant basket and I just buy the dollar tree stuff .I also use a baby diaper in them .I know my sister uses preen but not sure the harm that does .Why do you want to use it around the pond as it will direct water into the pond and may direct unwanted chemicals into the pond also .

 

[Lisak1]

Weed barrier fabric is a scam. And rocks as mulch are a nightmare IMO. Our neighbor just put fabric and gravel on the side of the house facing us - he didn't want to have to mow it anymore - and now all he does is spray weedkiller all over his rock garden. Drives me nuts. The weeds started popping up within a couple of weeks.

The weeds still grow between the rocks as silt and dirt build up on top of the weed barrier, and very quickly at that. And a seed doesn't need much dirt to start growing. Yes mulch has to be replaced, but adding more mulch is much easier - and more sustainable - than spraying chemicals or pulling weeds from between rocks.

 

[RachelR]

Hi RachelR,
Are the weeds showing up at a seam between two pieces or all over the place where the weed fabric covers?
If all over, the fabric was probably too thin. I would first carefully remove all of the weeds surrounding your pond (to clean bare earth), carefully cover the area with some Preen and then use a very heavy weed barrier. Make absolutely sure all of the ground surrounding the pond slopes away from your pond before using Preen. Groundwater flowing into the pond could kill your fish.

We actually paid extra for the premium weed fabric from a landscaping company; it looks like it was wasted money. I think we will stay away from using chemicals around the ponds. I sure don’t want to kill my fish and frogs!

 

[RachelR]

We actually paid extra for the premium weed fabric from a landscaping company; it looks like it was wasted money. I think we will stay away from using chemicals around the ponds. I sure don’t want to kill my fish and frogs!

And the weeds are coming up everywhere. We were sure to overlap our seems by about 6” or so. I’m so disappointed in it.

 

[RachelR]

I think weed blocking material is just a scam ,it keeps water from trying to get to the ground under it but birds and other critters drop seeds where ever they go .Even the wind and rain bring seeds with them .The only thing I use it for is to line my flower hanging baskets to help keep some of the water in the plant basket and I just buy the dollar tree stuff .I also use a baby diaper in them .I know my sister uses preen but not sure the harm that does .Why do you want to use it around the pond as it will direct water into the pond and may direct unwanted chemicals into the pond also .

I don’t want to use it around the pond, that’s why I was asking for suggestions. I am wanting to use the weed killer in the flower beds where the rocks are-no flowers in them, just a couple of bushes.

 

[RachelR]

Yes, this has been a problem with weed blocking fabric for many years. I see it in many yards and have heard professionals talk about it. There are several issues.

There will always be edges. The fabric, even when permeable will funnel water to edges and seams giving plants more water there and weed growth. Same thing happens at the edges of roads and sidewalks, cracks in concrete, etc...

Once down and gravel or whatever is placed on top organic material starts to collect on top, composts and a perfect place for plants to grow. Non-permeable material like plastic collects water so the plants can grow on top. Wood mulch for example is sometimes added and it makes a great compost for plants. So you get a few years of few weeds and then more and more.

Holes will be created over time from install, creatures digging, people digging. Some plants can grow in those holes and thanks to the fabric be very hard to remove.

Over time the fabric tends to become exposed in places, UV destroys it, more plants get in.

The biggest issue is once this fabric is installed and starts to fail it can be very difficult to remove.

Some landscapers I respect refuse to use these products anymore. But many homeowners insist on its use because it sounds good. It's good marketing. IMO the best thing to do is to make something that is long lasting and is realistic in expectations. You will get weeds. Best to make them super easy to pull. For me that is done with sand. I add enough sand to the soil so the soil won't compact. That can be even 100% sand if level and washing away isn't a risk. Easy to pull weeds from sand and the fast drainage (hopefully) reduces the window for a weed to get going so fewer weeds. I also like high and low spots so weed seeds tend to wash down into low spots where I can have a deep bed of sand. 4-12" if possible.

Keeping after the weeds is best too. Easier to remove a 3 day old weed compared to giving them a month long head start.

Unfortunately, we have several tons of rock down now, and removing it isn’t an option at this point. I fear we are stuck with trying to chemically treat and attempt to prevent more weeds, but I want to be sure we don’t hurt the few bushes we have in the beds.

 

[sissy]

weeds are made to pull and if you think spending money on weed killer and harming the earth you need a reality check .I see it here all the time to lazy to do anything but sit on a cell phone .I rocked my hill just to keep it stable but I used a special fabric that is made to breathe and allow water to go threw it .The cost of your health may be at risk .I use only stuff that is safe but I only use it on poison ivy since I am allergic to it .The cost of these weed killers may be more but my health is more important

 

[RachelR]

weeds are made to pull and if you think spending money on weed killer and harming the earth you need a reality check .I see it here all the time to lazy to do anything but sit on a cell phone .I rocked my hill just to keep it stable but I used a special fabric that is made to breathe and allow water to go threw it .The cost of your health may be at risk .I use only stuff that is safe but I only use it on poison ivy since I am allergic to it .The cost of these weed killers may be more but my health is more important

Lady, you don’t know me from Adam, and you are making some outrageous assumptions and some equally stupid statements. Take your craziness elsewhere. You are extremely rude, and I am not here for that.