What is this pond foam from?

[mrtrumpet]

For the second time this summer I have many "pockets" of foam on my pond. The first one was found early in the morning, with no cause that I can figure. The second on was found today, but it did come after I added about 75 gallons of water to this 1,000 gal pond. The only chemical put in was a small amount dechlor, but that was added a few days ago.

Fish and plants don't seem to show any ill effects.

Anybody have any idea what this might be from?

 

[sissy]

not green does not smell could be just extra oxygen in the water

 

[MitchM]

Dissolved organic carbon.
Make sure you have maximum water circulation and aeration.
The bubbles should eventually disappear.

 

[peter hillman]

Dissolved organic carbon.
Make sure you have maximum water circulation and aeration.
The bubbles should eventually disappear.

Learned something again! I had some bubbles earlier in the year that made me think somebody was around the pond with soap.

 

[sissy]

I always get some during spawning and during frog invasion .I really never worry about it unless it smells or is green ,I really don't have anything on the bottom because the ball valve down there pushes every thing up to the filters .But i still net the bottom because my aggie has a habit of killing frogs and sucking there insides out and I get the task of scooping out the leftovers .Another reason I don't want frogs .Let them stay in the lily pond or go down to the creek

 

[fishin4cars]

Foam on the surface is a reaction from increased dissolved organics. This is caused by filtration not being able process this paicular kind of waste that it normally could.

Watch water conditions carefully. If foam is seen on


surface in morning this indicates more organics than your

filter can handle. You need to reduce feeding, or increase

filter maintenance or increase filter size, increase aeration,

or try different koi food with less protein. Turn off pond

skimmer occasionally at night to better determine foam

production in mornings which indicates more organics

than your system can process.

This was taken from an article written by ray Jordan a couple of years ago. Might want to look into building a Foam fr

actionator.

 

[Mmathis]

@fishin4cars is this like the one you made? My problem (now) is getting solids-free water. Is the 5' of PVC and bio balls combo a TT, or something unique to the PP?

 

[MitchM]

Dissolved organic carbon is a food source for bacteria.
Every now and then excess food will become available (like after a fish spawing event) that the existing bacteria population cannot process.
That excess food will cause the bacteria population to increase, and the visible foam will disappear.
Protein skimmers (or foam fractionators) have been shown to remove only a small percentage of DOC's
Skimmers do provide added aeration, which will aid in the increase of the bacterial population.

 

[fishin4cars]

Mitch, have you run one? Have you seen what they remove? I remove 5 gallons of the blackest, nastiest smelling gunk from my pond a week. Plants love this mess but it's horrible to smell and deal with. Since I added mine the water is far clearer, Less foam on the surface, Less nitrates in the water, and the fish appear more active and colors are improving. Yes, Maggie

Mmathis

, this is the one I built and I am very happy with the results. It's basically a small TT, it does do some Bio filtration but very limited. It does add considerable oxygen to the water, and it really does help with clarity and what I call sparkle to the water. I don't know what the technical term is but if you notice some ponds look like regular water, then others have that WOW clear water look. That's what I'm seeing for the first time in the four years since I first started the pond. It took me less than two hours to assemble, and about $30 in parts that I didn't already have laying around. I'm removing about 5 gallons of waste a week. Keep in mind to actually get 5 gallons of fluid waste you really have to be cranking out some serious foam each morning.

 

[fishin4cars]

This is what was caught in the first 12 hours after it was up and running.

 

[Mmathis]

@fishin4cars That is awesome! I must have followed this on the FB group. I like how how you have it painted to blend in.

• Is there a reason they are so tall?
• Is there a reason they are so wide? [gee, I don't think I've ever seen 6" PVC]
• Do you have mechanical filtration before the PP or FF?
• Doesn't a TT need to have air introduced to the water as it trickles down, to oxygenate the bacteria?
• And why/how did it ever become called a "Phoam Phractionator" as I've seen it also referred?
• Do you leave it running all the time, or is there a way to turn off the "foam" part and just let the water run back into the pond? Or would you want/need to ever turn it off?
• If the foam smells so bad, does that detract at all from ones enjoyment of the pond?

 

[MitchM]

Mitch, have you run one? Have you seen what they remove? ...

Yes, I have used protein skimmers for the last 30 years on my saltwater aquariums. I no longer use them.

Penn State University came out with a study about 5 years ago and demonstrated that in a saltwater environment, protein skimmers removed at the most 35% of DOC's. Freshwater is less dense and has a lower PH, so the skimmers are even less efficient for a pond. I would guess 20% or less DOC removal. That means that 80% is staying in the pond, being processed by bacteria and other microorganisms. On the down side, skimmers also remove plankton and trace minerals.

I think that skimmers are better at oxygenating the water and providing an environment so bacteria can more aggressively digest DOC's. I think that the brown foam that is produced is only a small benefit, but seeing brown foam being produced is easier than seeing the work that bacteria are doing.

Protein skimmers are certainly interesting and a great learning device, but I'm trying to simplify my aquatic setups. I think that the same filtration can be obtained by providing a better enviroment for bacteria.

The design of the skimmer made no difference - bubble plates, needle wheels, airstones, etc.

.

 

[fishin4cars]

Yes, there is a reason so tall and so wide, You want the shower effect to really turbulate down the column to get as much exposure to air as possible. I actually wanted another 1.5 feet of height but I can barely reach the top now with a 6' step ladder. There are some running this in 4" size pipe for smaller ponds that seem to be working just as well. I do have filtration before, all the water run through the PP has been filtered through the sieve and the zakki shower before it reaches the pump to flow into the tower. The Name became known through a fellow by the name of Ethan Beckler ( Notice on the drawing) Ethan came up with that name as he was working on prototypes back around 2002-2005. I followed him on a couple of forums and saw some great idea's. When I started having foam issues I was first told to do lots of water changes which I did, then I remembered Ethans posts and went and found the drawing and built my own. So the name originated from Ethan on this and I must give him credit to the design. I have been running it 24/7 since start up, It could be run only when needed though, I have found it only produces foam from about dusk until mid morning, once the sun is up the foam extraction falls way off. I may shut it down this winter if we get a really cold spell but unless that happens it's just an extra oxygenator and bio-filter. Might as well make use of it. The smell part, No it's doesn't, the only time you smell it is when you take the bucket away and go dump it. I feed my blueberry bushes and crab apple bushes with the waste. They seem to love the waste product, I might start giving it to my lemons, oranges, peaches and cherry trees too. One more thing you didn't ask. It does make a little noise so I would place away from a sitting area. The water falls by mine drowned out the noise but in a quite setting it would be noticeable.

 

[fishin4cars]

Mitch, If we remove 20% of the DOC's and I think that's a fair estimate as there is really no way to test that I have found;. But taking that number that's 20% less that the Bio-has to deal with. IMO, to get results that are noticeable the primary filtration must be doing it's job efficiently. If there isn't enough filtration to run the pond on it's own then the PP won't be able to keep up and it won't do a lot of good except for oxygenate. I ran the protein skimmer on my reef tanks when I had them too. and again, some noticeable improvement but ONLY when the tank was running at it's best was it truly the most efficient help to the set-up. The one I have set-up on the pond is very low maintenance, simply dump a 5 gallon bucket once every week. That's it. It does require a pump to run it, I used a pump that was already running a UV light, since I started running the PP I have shut the UV lights down so I'm actually saving money from running UV and pump to just the pump.

 

[MitchM]

Right, I'm not saying that using a protein skimmer is a bad idea, just that I think that the foam removal gets too much credit and that there are other other ways of dealing with DOC's.
I got tired of cleaning the skimmer cup, maintaining the skimmer and paying for the electricity.
I've found that added aeration plus water circulation and reducing the load on the pond filter system as a whole can also have the desired effect for maintaining high water quality.
Adding a trickle tower, a vigorous stream, plants, plus accepting that a pond is not a static environment and it will be fine for the occasional episode of excess DOC are considerations.

Is "Phoam Phraxionator" a trade name? Those are not actual words.
(sorry, pet peeve)