First Time Ponder Here

Discussion in 'Introductions' started by n8r, Jul 13, 2016.

  1. n8r

    n8r

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    Hi, I'm building my first pond and it's been a great learning experience so far. Here's what I've got done so far. The pond on the right side of the walkway will have a curved wooden bridge to access the outdoor kitchen.

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    I originally was going to only have a small round 400-500 gal pond on the left side of my stone walkway. After digging it and filling with water and staring at it for a few hours while sitting on my porch visualizing the finished product, I decided it would look way better if there was also a pond on the other side of the walkway, to give it the effect of looking like the stone walkway was a suspended bridge over a single pond,so without much more thought, I got up and started digging away.

    After a while of digging, I tired so I took a break and went and sat back in my chair on the porch. While again looking at the pond, I decided it would look super awesome if there were also some big fish swimming around in it so I decided it would be a Koi and Goldfish pond. Now I have to dig it even deeper and make it bigger. I'm also digging under the walkway so I can connect the two ponds with a 12" pvc pipe that the fish can swim through.

    So now according to my calculations, it will be around 1700-1800 gal. I'm thinking down the road, I might turn the 4 raised stone planters above the wood planters into fish-less water gardens/bogs and circulate the pond water through them. That way I could have a huge amount of plant filtering and the fish would not have access to eat the plants.

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    This was my test fill to make sure the used epdm liner didn't leak. I've since drained and removed the liner and am excavating the hole bigger so the depth goes all the way to the walkway edge to give the appearance that the water goes under it. The sides of the pond along the wood planters will have a small shelf for edge plants to hide the liner and the exposed liner on the shore by the rock stairs will have a wood deck over top so the pond looks like it goes under the deck. I'll also be building a concrete bench on the stone wall behind the deck for sitting.

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    I decided that each pond will have it's own pump and filter, to create a dual pond system so that if one pond fails in some way such as pump going out or whatever, the fish can just swim through the connecting pipe to the other pond until I can get the other pond going again. I like redundancy. The bio and UV filters, and pumps will be hidden under the wood deck on the right which has a hug 4' deep hole under it. I forgot to mention that there will be 4" pvc pipe cut in half lengthwise under the stone walkways wood edging which will attach to the pond liner somehow and channel the water underneath and to underneath the deck where the skimmers will be hidden. Another option would be to just extend the pond liner under the wood edging and not use pvc pipe for the channel.

    Anyway, still got a ton of work to do but it's been a lot of fun building this so far.
     
    n8r, Jul 13, 2016
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  2. n8r

    Usman

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    Welcome n8 , its good plan but looks challanging , i was wondering how will u seal pvc pipe that will be submurged? i was thinking u can do one more thing more natural and ornamental , u can create 1 or 2 foot canal below the stone bridge or add plank on top to cover some part, uil need to add linner in between both ponds and in the end circulate water from one to other it may have flow , can add some waterfall or shalow area where inlet and outlet where both joining both sides.or u can use pvc pipe as ur planing to do same below bridge then create shallower area like stream to see flow frm one to another
     
    Usman, Jul 13, 2016
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  3. n8r

    n8r

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    I found an easy and cheap way to seal the pipe to the epdm liner that I think should work great. I used a test piece of epdm to try it out and it seals very well. I traced the pipe diameter onto the epdm, and then cut a hole in the liner that is about 1.5" smaller all the way around so since the pipe is 12" the cut hole was 9" diameter. I then put a bead of fish safe silicone sealant around the pipe and stretched the liner over and slid it on the pipe. As the liner slid on the pipe, it created an even thin layer under the 1.5" flat rim of the liner against the pipe, and creates a solid bead on the backside for an excellent seal.

    I then let the silicone dry, and for a final secure, used an all stainless steel 13" hose clamp to clamp the liner to the pipe. Long term, silicone doesn't stick to epdm very well, so the silicone was used more for a gasket. I don't have a pic of the SS hose clamp but I'll post pics of the final result when installed in the pond.

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    Cutting the liner hole 1.5" smaller than the pipe creates a nice 1.5" flat lip against the pipe for an excellent clamp surface area.

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    Here's another pic with the liner slid down a little further for demonstration purposes. In the pond install, the liner will be flush with the pipe end so no green pipe is showing, and I'll make some sort of natural looking ring to cover the hose clamp.
     
    n8r, Jul 13, 2016
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  4. n8r

    n8r

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    I actually was originally planning to do a canal with a liner, but decided it would be too much work and using the 12" pvc pipe is easier/faster. In a few years, after I become a proficient ponder, I'm planning on redoing the pond, pulling up the walkway and excavating the entirety underneath so it is actually complete water underneath and then I'll just have one single liner with no seams. One big oval pond with the stone bridge over it. I'll redo the walkway identical to how it is now, and mark the stones so they can go back in the same place. I'll build a rebar reinforced concrete bridge that I can mortar the stones to, that will span the pond.
     
    n8r, Jul 13, 2016
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  5. n8r

    n8r

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    The pvc pipe won't be visible under the wood bridge on the right pond that goes to the kitchen, but it will be on the left side, especially while sitting on the future-to-be-made bench, and I don't want to see a green pvc pipe, so I will try and find some fish safe black sheet of plastic that I can roll up and make into an insert to go in the pipe to cover the green. Then I'll just make some sort of cover to hide the hose clamp.
     
    n8r, Jul 13, 2016
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  6. n8r

    n8r

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    To get water flow through the pipe, all I would have to do is have one pump with a higher flow rate than the other, and have the return to pond lines empty in opposite ponds. That would cause the pond with the higher pump flow to lose more water and since the water is returning to the opposite pond, water would be forced to flow through the pipe to equalize the water level. I'm not sure that this will be necessary, though, as I would think the fish swimming through the pipe would be enough to get the water moving through somewhat. And even if the water inside the pipe got a little bad maybe it would help to keep the fish from hanging out and hiding in the pipe too much?
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2016
    n8r, Jul 13, 2016
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  7. n8r

    addy1 water gardener / gold fish and shubunkins Moderator

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    Love your work! That is going to look fantastic
     
    addy1, Jul 13, 2016
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  8. n8r

    Usman

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    Looks reliable ithink clamp will be secure as its epdm rubber it will b easier then pvc linner , looks good , if any one else have installed long tunnel they can tell u how fishes will behave , how they will use tunnel
    oh yes i said about flow for making fish happy lol its not needed much inside tunnel , but fishes will hv good playtime going against current in tunnel and exercise and they may run thru tunnel more from one pond to another if theres flow.
    ur doing great , as u go on uil hv more ideas and more practical ways yes as u said u can always change things as uil observe issues upgrade it. I love ur farm or is it house backyard
     
    Usman, Jul 13, 2016
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  9. n8r

    n8r

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    Thanks, very good points about the giving fish some current through the tunnel, that didn't even cross my mind. I like the idea of them having a little current to play with and swim in.

    It's actually my 200 sq ft tiny house, and it's in my front yard. I wanted to do the opposite of normal houses where gardens are in the backyard, seeing as I have no neighbors or zoning to worry about. I wanted to create a nice area out front that visitors could experience as they came to the front door.
     
    n8r, Jul 13, 2016
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  10. n8r

    n8r

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    Thanks. Your pond description in your signature is intriguing, especially the part about the bog filter. I'm thinking I might try something like that down the road.
     
    n8r, Jul 13, 2016
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  11. n8r

    CometKeith

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    I really like your plan. i have seen similar setups where there is a bridge over two ponds with the larger one for Koi and the smaller for goldfish but
    I think yours will be interesting. My only question if you really want to pull up the liner later or not. Once your pond has cycled and the liner has a nice coating of algae you won't want to pull it out unless you have another pond your fish can go to until the new liner is ready. I would suggest to do whatever digging you need to do now and be done with it. However I do like the pipe idea and wonder if you would even need to dig all the way under the bridge. Also it gives your fish a great hiding place from predators. Maybe an idea would be to use the raised shelves for the bog as you were thinking, Then the next deepest area would be the new pond you are digging, and have the largest existing pond the deepest so there is a nice water flow from top to bottom. Then you would only need to pump from the bottom pond and gravity would do the rest.
     
    CometKeith, Jul 13, 2016
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  12. n8r

    Becky Administrator

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    Welcome to the forum! What a beautiful setting for a pond (y)
     
    Becky, Jul 13, 2016
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  13. n8r

    Magzire

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    Nice project, keep us updated :)
     
    Magzire, Jul 13, 2016
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  14. n8r

    Meyer Jordan Tadpole

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    This is exactly how the intakes for the skimmers manufactured by Russell technologies attach to the liner. It is a secure seal.
     
    Meyer Jordan, Jul 13, 2016
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  15. n8r

    cas

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    I can't wait to see your pond completed - it looks awesome so far!
     
    cas, Jul 14, 2016
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  16. n8r

    bagsmom

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    Very impressive!!!!!!! The rock work is great!
     
    bagsmom, Jul 18, 2016
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