Has anyone found a plant that fish actually like to eat?
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For sure the noise from those submersible pumps alone would eventually drive fish insane if it wasn't for the fact that it causes them to go deaf fairly quickly first.adavisus said:
Troutredds
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My rainbow trout are very active all night, while my koi are more active during the day. I have LED lighing on a timer for our 5000 gallon pond and stream and really enjoy viewing the fish at night. The four underwater fixtures are thoughtfully positioned and aimed, so the fish can still find darker corners to hide or rest. Also, for the record, I'm a big fan of both Waterbug and Charles. I would be honored to have either one be "gruff" with me.
Troutredds
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That last sentence didn't sound right... Suffice it to say, I respect their logic-based criticism.
I am convinved that unless one is expert at this balancing act, it is essential to have a UV component to achieve clear water. After several years of trying natural methods and benebacteria I finally caved and inserted a UV light in line between the pond and the bog. For the first time in years I can see the fish I spent so much on!!!
I have concluded that my real root problem is the difficulty of cleaning fish poop from the bottom of the bog that lacks -- my design!!! -- a bottom drain.
I think I have two options:
1. Do it right the second time and install a bottom drain so the bog can be cleared of fish stuff, or
2. Buy or make a makeshift drum filter that sits above the bog and allows me to add a bottom drain to the drum. Then when the small pump moves water from the pond to the bog it will do so via the makeshift drum and then overflow into the bog. I suppose any design that allows for sediment settlement will work.
Any suggestions as to what would be a simple sediment collection tank is welcome. If it serves added functions such as bacteria accumulation, etc., that is icing on the cake.
I realize that the proliferation of water Irises in the bog is itself an absorber of nutrients and dubdividing these and adding more may do the same job of nutrient absorption. Too bad fish do not eat their tough leaves..
I appreciated and have learned much from the dialog between waterbug and Great Danes Dad (??!!!)
Harry
I have concluded that my real root problem is the difficulty of cleaning fish poop from the bottom of the bog that lacks -- my design!!! -- a bottom drain.
I think I have two options:
1. Do it right the second time and install a bottom drain so the bog can be cleared of fish stuff, or
2. Buy or make a makeshift drum filter that sits above the bog and allows me to add a bottom drain to the drum. Then when the small pump moves water from the pond to the bog it will do so via the makeshift drum and then overflow into the bog. I suppose any design that allows for sediment settlement will work.
Any suggestions as to what would be a simple sediment collection tank is welcome. If it serves added functions such as bacteria accumulation, etc., that is icing on the cake.
I realize that the proliferation of water Irises in the bog is itself an absorber of nutrients and dubdividing these and adding more may do the same job of nutrient absorption. Too bad fish do not eat their tough leaves..
I appreciated and have learned much from the dialog between waterbug and Great Danes Dad (??!!!)
Harry
my little ones like to eat duck weed, can't keep the stuff in the pond, they like it so much! They also eat water celery. Many ponders feed this plant to their fish, by rotating several plants out of the bog or skippy into the pond. As the fish finish off one down to nubby stems, They have more recuperating in the bog. Many do the same with fairy moss and duck weed. They grow them in a separate tub or pond with no fish and feed the fish as needed.note: I've never used UV or chemicals on any of my ponds, and have crystal clear water
One more note: Colleen a member on here suggested to me, back when I started on this forum, to use flag Iris and rushes. I use them in my bog .... And now I swear by them too. :cheerful:
I was in the process of writing you a gruff reply when you posted this...darn. But thanks.Troutredds said:
Troutredds
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Harry,
In the line between your pond and bog, perhaps you could install a ground-level skimmer box for an added level of mechanical filtration. It's not a "holding tank" for sediment, but if installed upstream of your pump and uv clarifier, it will filter out many types of debris, depending on the filter media you load it with. Sediment trapped in the skimmer is easily removed by cleaning or replacing the media at regular intervals. This suggestion may require more gallons per hour than your "small pump" moves, however. Actually, without a good understanding of your system, all I should really say is good luck!
In the line between your pond and bog, perhaps you could install a ground-level skimmer box for an added level of mechanical filtration. It's not a "holding tank" for sediment, but if installed upstream of your pump and uv clarifier, it will filter out many types of debris, depending on the filter media you load it with. Sediment trapped in the skimmer is easily removed by cleaning or replacing the media at regular intervals. This suggestion may require more gallons per hour than your "small pump" moves, however. Actually, without a good understanding of your system, all I should really say is good luck!
Troutredds: I like the suggestion. Have you any schematics or can you identify something like that is commercially available?
Also, why do you suspect that I may need a larger gph pump? I have a tiny pump that moves a relatively small amount of water through the UV filter.
If the objective is sedimentation and traping debri via gravity would not a slower rate of flow be suitable.
I can always get a larger pump at any point.
I am concluding that if I researched and found such a sedimentation tank it could sit on the ground beside the bog, be fed from below and flow via gravity into the bog...A bottom drain on such a tank can allow for easier cleaning and filter material clearing.
Question: Why your stipulation to "installed upstream of your pump and uv clarifier,?" I think I see why. IF I insert the sedimentation tank after the pump and UV lamp and between this and the bog it will require a simple redirection of the outflow of the UV treated water to then pass through sedimentation and thence on to the bog under gravity.
I shall now look for something that is big enough and simple enough to maintain.
Why do you think I even need a filter media? After all, what happens now is that the sediments do settle to the bottom of the entire bog before the clearer water flows over the waterway back to the pond? The water turbulence in the sedimentation device may negate this effect and allow most of the sediment to go on and settle in the calmer waters of the bog itself, where I will be back to square One!!! Can the filter media just be small crushed stones, etc., with a pump powerful enough to push water upwards through this and on to the top of the device from which it can fall down to the bog??
Thanks, Harry
Also, why do you suspect that I may need a larger gph pump? I have a tiny pump that moves a relatively small amount of water through the UV filter.
If the objective is sedimentation and traping debri via gravity would not a slower rate of flow be suitable.
I can always get a larger pump at any point.
I am concluding that if I researched and found such a sedimentation tank it could sit on the ground beside the bog, be fed from below and flow via gravity into the bog...A bottom drain on such a tank can allow for easier cleaning and filter material clearing.
Question: Why your stipulation to "installed upstream of your pump and uv clarifier,?" I think I see why. IF I insert the sedimentation tank after the pump and UV lamp and between this and the bog it will require a simple redirection of the outflow of the UV treated water to then pass through sedimentation and thence on to the bog under gravity.
I shall now look for something that is big enough and simple enough to maintain.
Why do you think I even need a filter media? After all, what happens now is that the sediments do settle to the bottom of the entire bog before the clearer water flows over the waterway back to the pond? The water turbulence in the sedimentation device may negate this effect and allow most of the sediment to go on and settle in the calmer waters of the bog itself, where I will be back to square One!!! Can the filter media just be small crushed stones, etc., with a pump powerful enough to push water upwards through this and on to the top of the device from which it can fall down to the bog??
Thanks, Harry
Troutredds
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Harry:
I am refering to a horzontally fed skimmer box, not a gravity fed box or tank. The higher flow rate is required to draw sediment (particularly fish waste) into the box. Please refer to the Russell Watergardens and Koi website with the link below. They have products called Hydroclean skimmers or hydroclean sieves that may give you a better idea of the concept. All your other assumptions regarding my suggestion are correct. For what it's worth, I also like the sound of your trickle tower, gravity-fed sediment collecting tank. You could even incorporate both ideas: a skimmer box to filter larger, heavier debris AND a sedimentation tank beside the bog to collect fine sediment (packed with gravel and a layer of poly fiber or mesh).
http://www.russellwatergardens.com/Filters/Pond-Skimmer.php
I am refering to a horzontally fed skimmer box, not a gravity fed box or tank. The higher flow rate is required to draw sediment (particularly fish waste) into the box. Please refer to the Russell Watergardens and Koi website with the link below. They have products called Hydroclean skimmers or hydroclean sieves that may give you a better idea of the concept. All your other assumptions regarding my suggestion are correct. For what it's worth, I also like the sound of your trickle tower, gravity-fed sediment collecting tank. You could even incorporate both ideas: a skimmer box to filter larger, heavier debris AND a sedimentation tank beside the bog to collect fine sediment (packed with gravel and a layer of poly fiber or mesh).
http://www.russellwatergardens.com/Filters/Pond-Skimmer.php
My goldfish like the roots of water lettuce.
Lucky you!!! Do you know whether water lettuce is hardy in zone 5??
I have inserted several American Water weed (anacharis) and am trying to persuading my koi and gold fish to eat any part of it.
I do this by withholding their regular fish pellets every second or third day.
So far I have not seen then eat the stuff but they do hover under it and perhaps eat some of the roots.
I will look into water lettuce if it is hardy.
Per Troutredds I am also considering some form or horizontal filter to catch the fish poop and make it easier to drain it from the pond and bog.
Have not had much luck with pond vacuums -- bought OASE pond vacuums but they are temperamental and do not work just when I need them...
Harry
I have inserted several American Water weed (anacharis) and am trying to persuading my koi and gold fish to eat any part of it.
I do this by withholding their regular fish pellets every second or third day.
So far I have not seen then eat the stuff but they do hover under it and perhaps eat some of the roots.
I will look into water lettuce if it is hardy.
Per Troutredds I am also considering some form or horizontal filter to catch the fish poop and make it easier to drain it from the pond and bog.
Have not had much luck with pond vacuums -- bought OASE pond vacuums but they are temperamental and do not work just when I need them...
Harry