Comments?...............looks like overkill to me................

[Dave 54]

I'm going to drag the old leaves out, that's going to be it for this years 'clean out'. My water is good and the fish alive.

I agree Peter why some folks have to employ people to clean their ponds and consult for them is beyond me .
This appears to be very much an American thing every UK fish keeper I know does their own cleaning of both pond and filters and most of us are self taught in health issues , "some more than others" [there is nothing like reading up on a subject before you even start in a hobby]...............
The only consultant that our club uses is a health official and he charges nothing for his services he is also BKKS trained and he is in our case just for back up and for the more novice members of our club
About the only time he comes out to see Val and I is if we need help over a matter weve never come across before like last years lightening strike or problems with the pump as he put the plumbing of our pond together.

Dave

 

[CountryEscape]

Seems to me, if you are going to have a pond in your yard, whether you build it yourself or have someone else build it, YOU should be the one to figure out how to maintain it fully! My sister acted like an expert until I read and learned on this site and I started questioning things she had been doing for 10 years. Now she asks ME for advice! LOL Only thing in my ponds I have not fully figured out yet, although I have a guess, is why my goldfish pond stays crystal clear year round, and my koi pond is a little murky. My guess is 1), goldfish make less waste, and inches of goldfish is much less than inches of koi; and 2) the bog on the goldfish pond compared to the size of that pond is about 1:3 whereas the koi pond is more like 1:7. One day I may get up the gumption to expand the koi pond bog to help with the added waste ... one day ....

 

[Dave 54]

The

Seems to me, if you are going to have a pond in your yard, whether you build it yourself or have someone else build it, YOU should be the one to figure out how to maintain it fully! My sister acted like an expert until I read and learned on this site and I started questioning things she had been doing for 10 years. Now she asks ME for advice! LOL Only thing in my ponds I have not fully figured out yet, although I have a guess, is why my goldfish pond stays crystal clear year round, and my koi pond is a little murky. My guess is 1), goldfish make less waste, and inches of goldfish is much less than inches of koi; and 2) the bog on the goldfish pond compared to the size of that pond is about 1:3 whereas the koi pond is more like 1:7. One day I may get up the gumption to expand the koi pond bog to help with the added waste ... one day ....

Totally in agreement with you there Country Escape the only reason our health offical comes to look at things like the pump is that my disability doesnt allow me to kneel down to do things for myself.
When he does come to visit fish health wise he allows me to diagnose our own problem under the microscope, suggest a treatment and will only correct me if I've made a mistake, which isnt that often, this I like because the onus is on me to get it right first time around and shows in my view good practice .
However I agree that people should learn about their subject either by buying books or asking questions of people because and I think you'll agree with me on this we never acctually stop learning in this hobby do we ?

Dave

 

[peter hillman]

I agree Peter why some folks have to employ people to clean their ponds and consult for them is beyond me .
This appears to be very much an American thing every UK fish keeper I know does their own cleaning of both pond and filters and most of us are self taught in health issues , "some more than others" [there is nothing like reading up on a subject before you even start in a hobby]...............
The only consultant that our club uses is a health official and he charges nothing for his services he is also BKKS trained and he is in our case just for back up and for the more novice members of our club
About the only time he comes out to see Val and I is if we need help over a matter weve never come across before like last years lightening strike or problems with the pump as he put the plumbing of our pond together.

Dave

Some people have more money than time, others don't like to get their hands dirty. And some never even considered that they could or should do it.... "We just always call Jimmy and he takes care of it". And now, you can get your Christmas decorations installed 'professionally' for a small fee. I hate admit it but getting on a ladder is getting MUCH harder than it used to be for me. Last spring was the first time since I've lived here (20+ yrs) that I called a service to do a spring clean up in the yard, it was so worth it. I've been working 50+ hrs a week and I don't want to spend the few hrs I have off doing yard work.
I agree one should know about the things that they use at least a bit. Cars, electronics, plants and ponds. You should have a basic knowledge of the things you touch. I only get help after I understand what's wrong and decide that it's more than I have the time or desire for.

 

[Lisak1]

I don't see a problem with people hiring help with their pond. No different than hiring someone to mow the lawn or trim the bushes - just because I know how doesn't mean I can or want to.

This whole "break the pond down and clean it every spring" concept is troubling to me. I know they have posted a video that speaks to the other side of the issue. But I too wish they would take this one down. It's an outdated practice that needs to go away.

 

[HARO]

Seems to me, if you are going to have a pond in your yard, whether you build it yourself or have someone else build it, YOU should be the one to figure out how to maintain it fully! My sister acted like an expert until I read and learned on this site and I started questioning things she had been doing for 10 years. Now she asks ME for advice! LOL Only thing in my ponds I have not fully figured out yet, although I have a guess, is why my goldfish pond stays crystal clear year round, and my koi pond is a little murky. My guess is 1), goldfish make less waste, and inches of goldfish is much less than inches of koi; and 2) the bog on the goldfish pond compared to the size of that pond is about 1:3 whereas the koi pond is more like 1:7. One day I may get up the gumption to expand the koi pond bog to help with the added waste ... one day ....

Country; If you compare a goldfish and a koi side-by-side, you'll notice that the mouth of the goldfish is at the front of the head, pointing forward, whereas the koi's mouth is further back, on the lower edge of the head, pointed downward at an angle. This tells you that the goldfish takes most of it's food from the water column, whereas koi spend more time searching for food on the BOTTOM of the pond. So you can assume that the koi will disturb the mulm on the bottom much more than the goldfish will, which leads to somewhat cloudier water, even if the fish are the same size
John

 

[Lisak1]

I meant to add - to be fair, other "big name" pond people have posted similar videos on spring clean outs. Doesn't make it right, I know, but I would guess it is an industry that depends on repeat business to survive. And we've been told that lots of pond owners insist on this type of clean start every spring - they don't want to see algae growing in their pond AT ALL. So I don't know... Do you try to educate the customer and watch them (and their money) go elsewhere for their spring cleaning? Tough call.

 

[Dave 54]

I meant to add - to be fair, other "big name" pond people have posted similar videos on spring clean outs. Doesn't make it right, I know, but I would guess it is an industry that depends on repeat business to survive. And we've been told that lots of pond owners insist on this type of clean start every spring - they don't want to see algae growing in their pond AT ALL. So I don't know... Do you try to educate the customer and watch them (and their money) go elsewhere for their spring cleaning? Tough call.

Tough call no Lisa if the fish owner has no input to do with the pond and the fish therin apart from throwing a handful of food in.
So how are they to learn , from any mistakes they make that could cost their fish their lives as John points out koi are fish that cause large amounts of fish waste and that the koi will disturb the mulm on the bottom much more than the goldfish will, which leads to somewhat cloudier water, even if the fish are the same size.
This can lead to problems like fungal infections, bacterial infections and the like if the person doesnt know what they are looking at this can and does lead to fish deaths .
The consultant may be a busy man and not be able to correct these infections in time to save their fish, so its logical its far better to know just what your doing than not at all .
This site is littered with crys to help with people who freely admit they dont know what they are doing , some stick around and learn and some dont even bother to come back even after I and others have spent time explaining to them that speed is of the essence in some of the cases, so it beggars the question what happens to those fish do they die the answer is yes , you bet your bottom dollar on it


Dave

 

[Lisak1]

I agree with you Dave on all points. However, these are not koi people nor are they even fish people - these are pond installers who make their living building ponds. They aren't in the business of diagnosing or treating fish issues. It's safe to say that 95% of them - maybe even more - don't even sell the fish to go into the pond. They build it - you stock it. So the bread and butter of the business becomes pond maintenance.

We've been on lots of pond tours where I can guarantee you the pond was installed as a landscape feature - not as a hobby for the homeowner. There were no chairs or benches or perching places to enjoy many of these ponds. They were just there, like sparkling jewels, in a fantastic (professionally installed and maintained) landscape. Many of these ponds were re-landscaped every spring - all new plants, fully grown... imagine the cost of that! And some of these ponds even contained rented koi - the fish show up in the spring and disappear again in the fall, like magic! To these pond owners, the fish are just ornaments - not pets.

So my question really was - if you are a guy (or gal!) who's trying to make a living building ponds, would you turn away that business every spring and fall? And if the customer wants the pond power washed, do you try to talk them out of it or do you give the customer what they want? It's a tough way to make a living if you are going to try to exist on just the pond building side. What you end up with then is people who are really landscapers who say "sure! I can build you a pond! No problem!"

 

[Meyer Jordan]

In my experience as a Water Feature Contractor, I would venture to say that only 1 out of 25 pond owners are hobbyists and that is being quite liberal. I suspect that in some areas of the U.S. that figure is even lower maybe 1 out of 50 or 100.
As Lisak1 stated, most of these ponds are primarily there as a decorative item in the landscape and maintenance on them is in the same category are mowing the lawn or raking the leaves. Maintenance is the major percentage of total revenue for a dedicated pond contractor (as opposed to a landscaper). I have a close friend who is a pond contractor in the Greater Boston area that makes a very good living and I would venture to say that 75% of his total revenue comes from maintenance. I also know of one contractor in the UK that also thrives on providing maintenance.
This is why, as Dave54 said, we have individuals come on this forum asking questions only to never return or respond to comments left for them. They are looking for an answer that requires little in monetary expense and/or physical exertion. Those types of answers are not always out there.

 

[EricV]

In my experience as a Water Feature Contractor, I would venture to say that only 1 out of 25 pond owners are hobbyists and that is being quite liberal. I suspect that in some areas of the U.S. that figure is even lower maybe 1 out of 50 or 100.

Can I ask how you arrive at that guesstimate? The reason I ask is an all-in-one contractor may never interact with those folks at all and would have no idea how many are out there. Most hobbyist are going to build the pond themselves, perhaps assemble equipment from online or local garden centers, pick up fish and plants at garden centers or other places, and never call anyone for maintenance. So how would a Water Feature Contractor have a handle on the total # of ponds out there?

 

[Dave 54]

I agree with you Dave on all points. However, these are not koi people nor are they even fish people - these are pond installers who make their living building ponds. They aren't in the business of diagnosing or treating fish issues. It's safe to say that 95% of them - maybe even more - don't even sell the fish to go into the pond. They build it - you stock it. So the bread and butter of the business becomes pond maintenance.

We've been on lots of pond tours where I can guarantee you the pond was installed as a landscape feature - not as a hobby for the homeowner. There were no chairs or benches or perching places to enjoy many of these ponds. They were just there, like sparkling jewels, in a fantastic (professionally installed and maintained) landscape. Many of these ponds were re-landscaped every spring - all new plants, fully grown... imagine the cost of that! And some of these ponds even contained rented koi - the fish show up in the spring and disappear again in the fall, like magic! To these pond owners, the fish are just ornaments - not pets.

So my question really was - if you are a guy (or gal!) who's trying to make a living building ponds, would you turn away that business every spring and fall? And if the customer wants the pond power washed, do you try to talk them out of it or do you give the customer what they want? It's a tough way to make a living if you are going to try to exist on just the pond building side. What you end up with then is people who are really landscapers who say "sure! I can build you a pond! No problem!"

Wow rented koi that arrive in spring and leave in fall Lisa why that is absolutely amazing, talk about the height of laziness these folk must have money to burn

 

[Mmathis]

I see no reason for not hiring someone to do routine pond maintenance, but what is the purpose of "power washing?" Doesn't that wash away/destroy a chunk of the pond's bio-culture?

 

[morewater]

I meant to add - to be fair, other "big name" pond people have posted similar videos on spring clean outs. Doesn't make it right, I know, but I would guess it is an industry that depends on repeat business to survive. And we've been told that lots of pond owners insist on this type of clean start every spring - they don't want to see algae growing in their pond AT ALL. So I don't know... Do you try to educate the customer and watch them (and their money) go elsewhere for their spring cleaning? Tough call.

I won't do it. Period. Get someone else.

 

[Meyer Jordan]

Can I ask how you arrive at that guesstimate?

From 20 years in the business. Even a DIYer is eventually going to call looking for a pump, UV light or other item and many times they slip in a question or two about pond maintenance. Just in the short conversations with these individuals, one can tell if they are serious hobbyists or just people that have a pond as part of their landscape.
Then there are those that call that need pond maintenance but do not want it to cost anything.
A Hobbyist is determined by the amount of time one devotes to something. Most pond owners devote very little, if any, time to their ponds. Of all of my customers over the years, I can count one hand the number that would be classified as hobbyist.

I see no reason for not hiring someone to do routine pond maintenance, but what is the purpose of "power washing?" Doesn't that wash away/destroy a chunk of the pond's bio-culture?

Absolutely. It can set your pond conditions back to where 'new pond syndrome' sets in.