Adding bacteria

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My very new pond is 700 or so gallons, has a small bog, and a stream. I just got the pump going today. The water is cloudy despite me having washed the gravel I am using several times, but I trust that will clear. My four goldfish are still waiting in their old pond and I have only three plants, but will be adding quite a few more on Tuesday. I bought a box of "Microbe-Lift" for getting the bacteria going. The recommended application rate for a pond of 81-250 gallons, is:
First application 8 oz. (= 24 oz. for 700 gallons)
weekly for the next 4 weeks, 2 oz. ( = 8 oz. for 700 gallons)
and then monthly 2 oz.

At $25 + tax for 16 oz., this is pretty pricey. I know I need some bacteria to get things started, but I am wondering how much and how long for?
 
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Adding the bacteria won't hurt, but won't necessarily help either.
The bacteria need a source of ammonia as food in order to populate enough so they can keep up with the ammonia production from the eventual living creatures in the pond.
I use straight ammonia from a grocery store in order to grow the bacteria population when first starting up a pond or aquarium.
Bacteria are everywhere already, they don't need to be added.

My suggestion is to add ammonia, enough to bring the tested level up to 4 ppm. Test every few days and add ammonia to keep that level, until you notice that the ammonia level drops more and more each test.
Once you have a steady reading of 0 ammonia, you can start adding fish slowly.

.
 
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Meyer Jordan

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Great advice from MitchM. Also be aware that if you purchased the dry bacteria instead of the liquid you have entirely the wrong bacteria. Nitrifying bacteria do not survive in a spore (dry) state. It can only be purchased in the liquid form.
 
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That is very good to know, Meyer and Mitch. Thanks. Could you give me a ball park on how much ammonia to add for starters to a system that is about 700 gallons? I have no idea at all.
 
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Actually nitrifying bacteria can't survive in and oxygen void environment, so if you buy anything in a sealed bottle you can be pretty sure there isn't much viable nitrifying bacteria in there.
On the bright side, there is plenty of live nitrifying bacteria floating around in your pond water to seed your filters, all they need is (1) food (ammonia), (2) plenty of oxygen, and (3) a little warmth to really get going.
Try peeing in your pond, that will help with (1) and (3).
 
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Huckleberry, it depends on what concentration ammonia solution you buy.
If you were buying 10% ammonia solution for your 700 gallon pond, you would start out with 112 ml of the ammonia solution, all at once, with the stream and everything running.

You could try Mucky's method, but I don't know the ammonia concentration of urine.:rolleyes:

Do not exceed 4ppm either, it could stall your nitrogen cycle.


.
 

Meyer Jordan

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Huckleberry, it depends on what concentration ammonia solution you buy.
If you were buying 10% ammonia solution for your 700 gallon pond, you would start out with 112 ml of the ammonia solution, all at once, with the stream and everything running.

You could try Mucky's method, but I don't know the ammonia concentration of urine.:rolleyes:

Do not exceed 4ppm either, it could stall your nitrogen cycle.


.

Curious. How did you arrive a 122 ml of 10% solution for 700 gallons?
 

Meyer Jordan

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I used this online calculator:

http://www.fishkeeping.co.uk/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=51&keywords=fishless+cycle

Did I get the math wrong?
Correct me if I did.

I was going to post the link, but it mentioned a copyright, so I didn't want to...I guess I just did though...


.
If the calculator is accurate, your math was OK if you were looking for an Ammonia level of 4.0 mg/L. Considering the fact that 2.0 mg/L is generally considered the lethal Ammonia level for Common Carp, I was just wondering why you chose a level of 4 mg/L. It really doesn't matter as long as fish are not present. The bacteria (Nitrosomonas) will grow based on the prevailing Ammonia level and oxidize accordingly. It just may take longer to reduce.
 

Meyer Jordan

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Here is a better calculator that allows a choice between imperial gallons, US gallons, litres and what ammonia solution concentration a person has.
http://www.fishforums.net/aquarium-calculator.htm

I use the number 4ppm because that is the mid range of what levels I see recommended for fishless cycling. I do not have any specific information on what is the optimum range for the quickest cycling ammonia level. It's a number I have always used and have had no problems with.
Exact gallonage of a persons pond, the accuracy of our hobby test kits and the temperature of the water being cycled play a part, so a mid range number is what I use.
 

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Actually nitrifying bacteria can't survive in and oxygen void environment, so if you buy anything in a sealed bottle you can be pretty sure there isn't much viable nitrifying bacteria in there.
On the bright side, there is plenty of live nitrifying bacteria floating around in your pond water to seed your filters, all they need is (1) food (ammonia), (2) plenty of oxygen, and (3) a little warmth to really get going.
Try peeing in your pond, that will help with (1) and (3).

Actually they can.
"Nitrifiers.....may survive periods of inactivity when they are periodically or persistantly exposed to anoxia, and they recover their activity instantly following O2 exposure "(Henriksen et.al., 1981).
 
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Actually they can.
"Nitrifiers.....may survive periods of inactivity when they are periodically or persistantly exposed to anoxia, and they recover their activity instantly following O2 exposure "(Henriksen et.al., 1981).

It's true that unless you do something very drastic like boil the water, or use strong concentrations of certain chemicals, some bacteria of all types will survive very adverse conditions. But without going to any extremes, please tell me what you think generally will happen to the nitrifying bacteria colony in your bio-filter when your turn off the pump and stop the flow of oxygen rich water for several days?
You can't have it both ways, they either need oxygen to stay alive, or they don't.
And actually it's not so much that they will just die from lack of oxygen, something else goes on there in that anaerobic environment.
Here is an experiment anyone can do at home. When you're sure you have a strong thriving nirifying bacteria colony growing on your bio-media in you filter, take a portion of that media and put it in a sealed air tight container (a zip-lock bag will do), but before sealing it take a sniff of it and see what it smells like. It should have light fresh fishy smell. Now seal it up and leave it for 2 or so days at room temps, then open it and take a sniff. What you will smell is the distinct septic rotten egg smell of H2S (hydrogen sulfide) a common byproduct of anaerobic bacteria.
So what has happened?
In the absence of oxygen the anaerobic bacteria, which are always present along side the aerobic bacteria, will begin to grow and multiply. But what food is available for them to eat so that they can grow and multiply? You guessed it, they eat the aerobic bacteria themselves which had previously established themselves on the media but begin to weaken and die in the anaerobic conditions.
So this would be the same conditions in a bottle of Microbe-lift. If the bottle contained high concentrations of aerobic bacteria, they would die and become food for the anaerobic bacteria (that will always be present) once you sealed the bottle. Sure some aerobic bacteria will always survive, but not any significant quantities, in fact there would be higher concentrations already colonizing in open oxygen rich pond water then could survive in a the anoxic conditions of a sealed bottle.
Of course there could be other bacteria in that bottle, some that could survive in significant quantities in anaerobic conditions and aerobic conditions, in fact the makers of Microb-lift say this about their product "Contains photosynthetic bacteria which reduces cloudy water by promoting flocculation and settling of organic and inorganic particles". Perhaps this is what is responsible for those who claim to see something favorable happening with their pond water after adding the stuff in the bottles? Keep in mind though, that these are very different bacteria then the ones we want to grow on our bio-media.

" Aerobic nitrifiying bacteria are quickly replaced (consumed) by anaerobic bacteria after prolong periods of anoxic or anaerobic conditions" (Mucky-Waters GPF.com., 2015)
 

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