Cal Pump T4000 issues

[TonyM]

My pump came in and when I pulled it apart to check, the O-ring, or flat gasket in this case, was dry as it gets. I used a bunch of Apiezon and put it back together using the original screws; something I plan on changing.

The screws are of a metal screw type threading, tapered to draw the two halves closer. They suck. They will work their way loose and then, regardless of goop on the seal, you're submerged pump become saturated inside. I have my final hosing array to go in in a few days and when I do I plan on drilling the screw holes through the entire coupling flange and using some threaded stainless-steel bolts with plastic collared lock nuts on them to draw the halves together. Tapered sheet-metal type threads work fine....but not in a polymer. Once wet inside, all pumps suck. (semantics?)

This is a GOOD pump. I use the gravel and bog for filtering so there isn't much to clog up in the way of filters. I use a canister of marbles for a pre-fllter so I am counting on this situation to last for awhile, or at least until we get back from South Dakota.

This pump is not that difficult to take apart should one need to get to the sealed end of the motor. If anyone has one of these that has been pulled due to water damage and wants it rebuilt, contact me. I'd love to pull one part and do a photo layout but won't pull a perfectly good one apart. I'll return to you a working pump.

Tony

 

[Joey1948]

Tony,
I'd like to learn about repairing these Calpump torpedo pumps. Did you take any photos?

 

[TonyM]

I know this is probably unheard of in forum etiquette but I was FLAT OUT WRONG!

I'm pretty darn good at what I do and I did this pump up in the best fashion possible. I figured I'd do everything mentioned plus a few others, voiding the warranty, but what the heck. From what I've read it was senseless to NOT pull it apart and take the steps to assure success.

I won't go into details because it has been thoroughly discussed here. The pump is crap. Bad design. There are several places where water gets in and mucks everything up and all it takes is time an dnot much of that.

Avoid this pump. I have mine back together and will use it as an outside pump when needed for short term use. IT can be a backup if needed. I can always use it externally to clean, etc. It's a strong pump with lots of flow...but my goal. like everyone elses, was to get something in the pond that will last a bit more than three months...tops.

I hope I didn't send anyone down a bad road. I could give the CalPump folks a few tips on how to get it to hold up but right now have Zenith on my mind...(radio work) If they use that type of "blown" polyurethane" used to make the case it can't/won't work. Maybe if it was a little thicker but...

TonyM

 

[Joey1948]

I think you are correct about the case being a poor design. Plastic moves with the heat/cold cycle. The strain relief or cord entrance is suspect in my mind. Being that it is Chinese made opens up some serious questions about how well, from unit to unit the motor it'self is closed up. I payed way too much for my Cal Pump T7500 for the short life received. I need another pump so, any suggestions as to what to purchase?

 

[Joey1948]

Cal Pump has done all of us a disservice. They have these pumps made in China without strict quality control and take the attitude that the pumps are so cheap they can afford to give customers a new pump without even looking at the failed pump and still make their profit. This is a very poor long term business model. The guys that don't fall into the 12 month fail zone are screwed. I paid over $400 with shipping and tax for a T7500 and used it for one season. I won't purchase another, that's for sure unless the price gets down to $50 bucks because that's about what these Torpedo pumps are worth. Does anyone have an idea who makes a good quality pump?

 

[TonyM]

Couldn't agree more about the strain relief. Combined with the use of wood-type screws to bring the shells together it's useless.

Yes, they have done a disservice to the consumers by , in my opinion, using the name of the product to indicate it is American-made should be illegal. The way it usually works to our disadvantage.lies in the specs. The engineers determine the "fudge factors" during build-up of the product but when it goes overseas they add their own into it and a variation of two percent becomes five. I'd be willing to wager the use of o-ring grease dwindled until stopping.

As far as recommendations I'll just relate my recently revised plan on pumps. One can definitely find an industrial type-pump that will fill last a lot longer but they COST $$$$$. A Grainger catalog is a good place to go to see what is offered. I'll glance through the one in my shop today and see what I can find and try to post later on. But, the main thing here, to me, is to use something that is available. I think Home Despots carries Beckett pumps (getting old so I hope I remember correctly) and they work. My torpedo went out while I was a few states away. It took me a few days to get back and I had to scramble to recover. The chap watching the thing for me is very adept at these things also but unless I stock my own parts they can't be obtained quickly. The next time I have pump problems the fix can be easily handled by most and quickly

The Becketts have a difficult time with rocks. Mine does/did due to the nature of my system and the undergravel sump draw. I don't use any other filters so an occasional pebble will get through and break the impeller blades. To stop this I use a weird sort of "filter" to keep them away and it has yet to fail. I use two pumps. (Torpedo was an attempt to go to just one) and the one has been going continuously since last year about this time. Hasn't been touched. I used a piece of 1 1/2 inch ABS pipe inline with the input of the pump. Mine is about twelve inches long. Not sure if it matters as long as it is has significant space. ( up to you) I placed a coarse plastic screen on one end, filled it with marbles and added another very coarse screen on the other end. NOTHING will get to your pump. I didn't take any pix so if you are interested and this description is confusing drop me a note and I'll sketch something. Why it works is still open to conjecture but I'm pretty happy with what originally sounded like a hare-brained idea (to wife).

Good luck
Tony

 

[Joey1948]

I'm thinking these Torpedo pumps might be OK in an out of the pond installation. That would take care of the cord entry and possibly the halves seal failure. I'd have to buy the priming pot which raises another problem. The outlet on the T7500 is 3" while the inlet & outlet on the priming pot is 2" maximum. The specs say the maximum GPH flow using 2" tubing is 4800. Makes no sense to limit an 8000 gph pump to 4800 because of a bottle neck. I don't know if the priming pot bottle neck is equal to running 2" tubing over 25'. Might not because of the greater friction with the long run of 2" tube? I'll make some phone calls to find where the truth is. Your right about quality pumps costing big money. That why I'm revisiting the Torpedo pumps. Might be worth hoping they fail before the warranty expires. Just might cost $370 per year if they don't. Cost of doing business?

 

[TonyM]

Sound thinking. It's also important to remember that the pressure that is not relieved through the outlet of the pump has to be burnt up somewhere. Pressure doesn't just "disappear". I feel the Torpedoes problems are exacerbated by the pressure from within as the pump eventually pushes excess through the cord entry hole and the seals.

For top-only use this might be usable. I saw an odd priming mechanism for an outboard pump about forty years ago where a chap had a tiny cistern (5-gal bucket in this case) mounted above the pump to use upon dry-start. Wish I'd asked more questions. The guy was pretty sharp. I remember a weird Euro-type check valve that looked very simple but I don't think I've seen one since..

I'm a big fan of staying away from gadgets. Too many gadgets eventually cause problems. Simple is fine. In this case, the Torpedoes follow the path...they simply leak.
TOnyM

 

[Joey1948]

I realized I won't need the priming pot because my pond's bottom is at ground level. It's only about 10"deep but, I think that is plenty to keep the pump primed without me worrying about the water level going down 3-4 inches. Now that I've said that, I probably should add a float valve considering I'm going to need to rent a jack hammer anyhow to redo the plumbing.
One other thing, when I took mine apart, I noticed a single threaded SS bolt threaded into the end of the discharge end. It has an O ring seal so, that is suspect also. I'm thinking it might be worth while to install a check valve on the discharge side and a ball valve on the inlet side and provide a drain valve so water does not sit in the pump when not operating. I like that idea but, let me know if there is something I need to know about that!
Good to have somebody to bounce these things around with.

 

[Craig58]

Does anyone have an idea who makes a good quality pump?

I'll go out on a limb and recommned the ProPerformance Artesian pumps. They aren't cheap. But over ten years and no problems. Only for out of water applications however. Also all motors are US made. :usa: Not sure about assembly, Only going by the their web site on that.

Craig

 

[TonyM]

I don't think the threaded screw is a problem but I sealed ti anyway.

As far as recommendations I'll defer to Craig or other who can add. I chose the wrong pump and I was CERTAIN. My advice would be shallow. I really like the one you spoke of, Craig. It may be the way I choose to go but right now I have another project that is needing my attention.

Nice pond, Craig. Completion date should read "never". They evolve. Here's mine after one year...still crystal clear, healthy, and so relaxing.

Back to the Zenith

Tony

 

[Joey1948]

Hi Craig,
Thanks for the recommendation. I checked the ProPerformance Artesian pumps. 3 yr warranty, made in the U.S.A., only a 2" intake/discharge which is not a plus as maximum flow is only 4800 GPH and, the cost is more than double the Torpedo pumps but, who cares considering the Torpedo's are failure prone!
I might just keep my eyes open for a good quality used pump.
Thanks

 

[Craig58]

Hi Craig,
Thanks for the recommendation. I checked the ProPerformance Artesian pumps. 3 yr warranty, made in the U.S.A., only a 2" intake/discharge which is not a plus as maximum flow is only 4800 GPH and, the cost is more than double the Torpedo pumps but, who cares considering the Torpedo's are failure prone!
I might just keep my eyes open for a good quality used pump.
Thanks

Why do you say maximum flow is 4800 GPH?

For gravity fed lines only 4800 is probably actually high, (i.e. if you gravity fed a box or bio-filter). But with a pump style like the one I mentioned you should be able to go way higher. While building my current 7500 gallon pond I had to empty it and it took me about 1hr and 20 min to do so which is about what I would have expected the 6000 GPH pump, (A 1/3-56 model), to do given the pipe distance, head and turns.

Here is a chart of max waterflows in PVC pipe. http://flexpvc.com/WaterFlowBasedOnPipeSize.shtml

I imagine the 2" flex pipe that many people use in pond applications probably has a slightly lower flow rate as I think there might be more friction loss. But unless you have pipe runs over 10-15' its probably not significant. I would expect with a reasonably low pressure pump you should be able to get up to 7500 GPH in most normal pond applications through a 2" line. A high pressure pump can get up 12,000 GPH on a 2" line but that would come with issues.

Once I shutdown my old pond, I'll move another A1/3-56 over to the new pond and will run both pumps on that pond from a 4" drain line that splits down to two 2" lines.

Craig

 

[Craig58]

INice pond, Craig. Completion date should read "never". They evolve. Here's mine after one year...still crystal clear, healthy, and so relaxing.

Back to the Zenith

TonyView attachment 48008

Thanks for the compliment Tony and yes. ponds never seem to be done! Your's looks pretty complete though! Is that an Australian Cattle Dog? I really like them. I have a search dog and when I need a new partner someday, the Aussie Cattle Dog is high on my list of potential canidates. Catahoula's are up there too.

 

[TonyM]

Craig-
Close. She's what they call an Aussie-doodle, a mix between a poodle and an Australian Shepherd. This one, Molly, took after the dad but her sister from two litters later took after the poodle(mini). I've had a lot of dogs but never anything like these. Molly is by my side 24/7 and is the smartest dog I've encountered. Dixie is a bit of fluff that has an adorable personality and is basically a..."blond". If you call up the name aussie-doodle you will see what I consider a most unique coloring pattern. No two are the same and the markings are dramatic. Good dogs. Tnx-here's a pic of the two together(next to gravel walkway). They are 100% sisters. The other two pics are of relatives in our area. The one with the mother and pups is priceless. The breed hasn't been around long.

Tony