First Koi Pond - Filter Decisions

[jwmachon]

Good evening everybody.

This is my first ever pond build.

my Pond is 14ft long - 10ft wide - 4ft deep

I work it out to hold around 3500 gallons

The issue:

I dont know what to do regarding the filter situation, I dont want to take anymore room up in the garden/grass on filter so I have the following options

A nexus 210 or 310 - Not sure which size would be best and use a pump to feed the filter ideally i would want the nexus to be about 15 feet away from the pond is this going to be a problem.

Option 2 - A multibay - oasis 30000 or smaller which would you reccommed?? which could be close to the pond as there not as wide / obtrusive and i could make it into a bench.

so these are my first options

At last resort if i could get away with a smaller multibay I could have the filter gravity fed thus having the multibay underground but the 30000 is 200cm long which would take up quite a bit off room.

Im open to more filtering ideas. Is there any good pressurised filters that would manage the waste I will be looking at stocking the pond nicely with koi.

Many Thank,

Jonny

 

[crsublette]

Welcome!! :goldfish:


That's really an open ended question and the answers will be endless. It all depends on your time and money and space to work with. All filters have their pros and cons so ask more questions. A fella can go on forever volunteering info he has in his head. Koiphen.com Filtration Basics is a good stickied thread that provides some explanations, but it talks about filtration at a more precision level.

Typical rule of thumb is that the total volume of filtration should be equal to 10% of your pond volume. Supposedly, this keeps ya on the safe side at all times with minimal time wasted for maintenance. Of course, the efficiency and quality of filtration will change this "rule of thumb". ALL filtration has its pros and cons.

The filters you mention above are known as combination filters and are often criticized, but I think they can still be helpful. Combination filters attempt to be space savers by doing everything in one package and the quality of "all in one", with nothing else, can be good enough. Everything I have heard about their performance has been mixed. You can improve their performance by adding an extra mechanical filter prior to the combination filter.

Nexus Eazy 310 looks to be the better one. The moving media, kaldness, inside the bio-filter chamber portion is known as a fluidized bio-filter. Fluidized bio-filters is the 2nd best type of bio-filter out there. The "fluidized" portion attempts to clean the media so the bacteria can survive since the bacteria can suffocate to death if too much gunk settles on top of the bacteria. Common rule of thumb is to keep your water as clean as possible before the water enters the bio-filter media. My concern is with the mechanical filtration portion of the device. Even though the K1 is mostly static small media, it is not going to prevent all, pontentially gunky debris, from entering the fluidized kaldness. So, you need to make sure to never forget and frequently open the purge valve, that cleans the mechanical filtration. The 210 says it is for up to 4000 gallons, but, if you go a step bigger, then the fewer times you need to purge it.

Biggest problem with "all in one" filters is that you will need to flush them out very often, a couple times a week or more. If you do not flush them enough, then their effectiveness is reduce signicantly. With the 200 litre K1 capacity and then plus the mechanical filtration portion, I am guessing the Nexus Eazy 310 holds around 60~70 gallons of filtration, maybe? I don't have a pond anywhere near that size, but from reading what others share and what I personal think, typically there will be around a total of 150 gallons, more or less, of filtration that is comprised of multiple containers.

If I were to get the Nexus Eazy 310, then I would add an extra mechanical filtration stage before it, preferably a pre-filter type mechanical filter. This will clean the water further so you do not have to worry about purging the Nexus so much. If you have the money, look into Rotary Drum Filters (most expensive), a sieve filter, or you can look into building a vortex settlement chamber. The sieve or rotary drum filters have the smallest space footprint.

I understand you are limited on space, but check out a professional retro-pond rebuild on koiphen. This thread might help give you some ideas. This project deals with some space constraints as well.

Im open to more filtering ideas. Is there any good pressurised filters that would manage the waste I will be looking at stocking the pond nicely with koi.

Pressurized filters are often synonomous with "all in one" filters. "Pressurized" mainly means the filter is enclosed, water tight, so it is pump fed and the exiting water is further pushed by the pump.

All bio-filters have limitations. Bio-filtration efficiency and capacity will determine how many koi your pond will sustain. You will know you might have too many fish when you start registering any ammonia on your water tests; this means the bacteria needs to further replicate or it means your bio-filtration might be starting to fail due to many reasons. The bacteria is naturally floating around everywhere outside and does not suddenly appear in the bio-filters. You will need to make sure you allow your bio-filter time to mature by giving the bacteria time to settle in it and replicate. Always keep your pump running water through the filter since it provides the oxygen the bacteria need to thrive. Add fish slowly and just a couple at a time. Wait 2~4 weeks before adding more fish.

This hobby gets very technical. I did my best to not get too technical.


Good luck!

 

[Anthony]

Please forgive my intrusion on the OP's thread but I am in middle of the exact same quandary as the OP and thought it better to post here rather than post a mirror thread.
I understand that the overwhelmingly complex filtration system installed by the person in the "retro-pond rebuild" link above may very well be the ideal system, but for myself and I would imagine many others it is not in the realm of reality for me to even consider installing such a system.
So I ask, is there an out of the box bio filter or combo bio/mechanical filter that will do a "good" job, maybe not the best job but an acceptable one.
I am an experienced aquarist who keeps many aquariums so the nitrogen cycle and how it applies to aquatic environments is something I am very familiar with so the benefit of systems such as the one in the referenced thread is not lost on me but none the less is an impracticality.
If there is additional information needed, I would be happy to supply it.

 

[crsublette]

I understand that the overwhelmingly complex filtration system installed by the person in the "retro-pond rebuild" link above may very well be the ideal system, but for myself and I would imagine many others it is not in the realm of reality for me to even consider installing such a system.

He simply has a settlement chamber for mechanical filtration and a couple S&G (sand and gravel) filters for additional mechanical and biofiltration. This is not the "best" configuration for the "crazed" koi enthusiasts, but it is pretty basic for a residential pond. A good YouTube video I found, Koi Pond Design Fundamentals, is another example of a good filtration system. Sure, it takes longer to flush the chambers and blow out a S&G filter when compared to simply opening one purge valve on an "out of box" filtration, but they will actually probably only have to blow out the S&G filters once a month and the settlement chamber maybe once a week or every two weeks and it might not be detrimental to the pond if ya forget on occasion.

All of the "out of the box" filtrations are not going to be good as the filtration systems above.

A bog is a "good enough" mechanical and biofiltration system that will never need maintenance except for the plant managing, but the one-time building cost is much higher and be sure you build them correct. I have read many testimonials of skippy style systems used for both mechanical and bio-filtration, sometimes zero or weekly maintenance, and the owners seem to be happy enough with the results in their pond.

I guess you could go with the Nexus 310 as well, but prepare your self to open that purge valve maybe a few times a week depending on the size of the filter versus the size of your pond.

So I ask, is there an out of the box bio filter or combo bio/mechanical filter that will do a "good" job, maybe not the best job but an acceptable one.

It all depends on what you want to pay and the space. The "best" costs thousands upon thousands of dollars and "good" might be just under this price range. There are also many koi websites that build their own "out of the box" custom combination solution. If you have the time and desire, the DIY options are not difficult. You can easily build a very good filtration system at a fraction of the cost, but this requires some effort and aggravation to get it done.

All you can do is read testimonials and pick the one that persuades you the most and fits your price range the best. Stick to the testimonials you find on koi club website forums and other places like this forum and koiphen.com.


I hear ya. At first glance, all this stuff was very complex and time consuming to me as well that made my eyes just glaze over. Over time, after more research and questions, I became more comfortable with it all. Then, I realized that, if I built my own filtration configuration, then I could be away from my pond for an entire month without doing any type of maintenance and the pond remains healthy when I return to it.

 

[Waterbug]

my Pond is 14ft long - 10ft wide - 4ft deep I work it out to hold around 3500 gallons

I was scratching my head, 3500 gals? Then checking the location...oh, imperial gallons. Two people separated by a common language and also a common unit of measure.

On the distance from pump to filter and back...just watch the pipe size and friction loss. It does cost more to pump further, no senses making it any worst. But 15' isn't really very far.

Please forgive my intrusion on the OP's thread but I am in middle of the exact same quandary as the OP and thought it better to post here rather than post a mirror thread.

I think it's fine to start a new thread. Many subjects repeat over and over, people don't seem to mind. For the obsessed like me it sure isn't a problem. Filters are a subject specific to each person also.

So I ask, is there an out of the box bio filter or combo bio/mechanical filter that will do a "good" job, maybe not the best job but an acceptable one.

I do not know of one filter that all people would consider as doing a "good job". One issue is that I'm unaware of any filter that provides any data on how it performs and virtually no one tests their filters beyond assuming if the fish are alive and/or the pond seems clean to them then they give the filter credit whether deserved or not. So it seems to be a subjective call.

I think breaking the decision into two steps makes it a bit easier. Step 1 consider the different fundamental designs, like Bakki Shower vs static submerged, and what you're trying to achieve. There's a lot known about performance of the different designs, and you can narrow the field. Step 2 is looking at different manufacturers for the type of filter you'd like. People's experience with life span, cost, customer service, etc., can help you. If cost or something else becomes too much of a problem you can return to step 1 and pick your second choice.

 

[Craig58]

Since you specifically stated your objective is a Koi pond, and space is a limitation, I would suggest you make sure you over design/ over size the filter system. For a new pond make sure your filtration system can turn over the pond at least once an hour. As your fish grow and have babies, the load will only increase unless you are ruthless about population control. I've been using an Ultima filter for over ten years now and I can't really say anything bad about it. (http://www.ultimafilter.com/). I've never had to service it. The Artesian pump I bought with it has been an absolue workhorse with no issues and no service since I bought it. It runs 24x7 for about 8 months a year.

An Ultima II 4000 or 6000 should probably be about the right size. Depending on your layout and geography these can be plumbed and buried or half buried.

You can even place them under a deck and build an access panel in the decking to get to it for backflushing and cleaning. Most of the pressurized maufactured systems are going to usually be more compact than anything you can build on your own. It's definitely more expensive to go this route but when your requirements are limited space, and you want it to be a Koi pond, then that kind of drives things. And since I haven't done ANYTHING to my pump or filter in over ten years except backwash it once a week, I'd say the cost per year is very low. This year when I switch it to my new pond I'll replace the media, clean and lube the valve and replace the gasket.

I'd also add a good size UV to go with it.

Craig

 

[crsublette]

Yep, for the "out of the box" stuff, you are paying for the space saving craftmanship. This is why you will typically find these systems cost at least a thousand dollars or much more.

For the same product DIY'd, it takes more space and tremendously cheaper. For a bio-filter, most expensive parts are the container, bio-media, and aerator. Depending on how they are built, since DIY'd filtrations are much bigger and if they are built properly, they can process quite a bit of waste. If you're good enough at DIY'n filtration, then you could sell your DIY'd filtration such as the excellent pre-filter Zakki sieve, which are hand made and not really small. If a bead filter was not purged often enough and collected that much gunk as shown in the Zakki hyperlink, then you would have a bead filter that is in serious trouble.

Bakki Shower vs Moving Bed. An interesting thread with quite a few references, which some references also talk about bead filters.

Problem with bead filters is that the beads, same ones housing bacteria in the filter, are designed to collect gunk so to try not to interfere with bacteria's waste processing, the bacteria is disturbed upon purging, and oxygen penetration is limited. This is why it is best to add an additional 250~300 micron mechanical filter, like a rotary drum or sieve fitler, prior to the bead filter. The Advantage Bead filter is the bead filter I have read referenced several times on koiphen.com

A big problem with "out of box" items is there is an assumption that a 3500 gallon pond will have "X" amount of biological waste to process. Bio-filtration should be matched according waste produced in the pond, not by the volume of the pond. This is another reason why going a size bigger is always best. For a properly DIY'd shower tower or fluidized bio-filter, all you would have to do is add more bio-media material.

Trying my best to inform so to limit too many suprises that may occur. If I valued my time by how much I could spend and I had the money, then I would definitely put the money into the fancy mechanical filtration since the bio-filtration is too easy to build my self.

 

[Craig58]

A big problem with "out of box" items is there is an assumption that a 3500 gallon pond will have "X" amount of biological waste to process. Bio-filtration should be matched according waste produced in the pond, not by the volume of the pond. This is another reason why going a size bigger is always best.

Yes. This is especialy true if the intention is to keep Koi as the OP indicated. You almost never have enough filtration for a Koi pond!

Craig

 

[jwmachon]

Thanks guys for all your help'

I think I have decided on the following but open to more suggestions regarding pump etc

Nexus 210
TMC Pro Clear 55w
Evoulution 130lpm For nexus filter and bottom drain will this be enough
Bottom Drain with aeration
Superfish 15000 to supply nexus and waterfall

The distance from filter to drain is about 25ft

Nexus will be below pond level well where it should be

Does this set up sound ok

Pond will be 14x10x5ft

Thanks,

Jonny

 

[j.w]

jw from another jw