New pond, nervous about winter

sissy

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I find my koi like special treats but all my fish eat out of my hand and I raised them that way .They will even eat out of other peoples hands .I used treats that have strawberry and blueberry and orange flavors .I even use fresh fruit from my own plants .Fish love watermelon .I over winter my plants in the basement so I can get a fast start up .
 

cas

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I have a spitter with a small (350gph) dedicated pump on the bottom. Would that suffice as a pond breather?
The difference between your spitter pump and the pond breather is that the pond breather is a low flow pump (145 GPH) and only uses 40 watts. In addition it has a black tube inside a glass tube which is a 25 watt heating strip that helps prevent the water from freezing. The pond breather will be frozen in the ice, but will have a trickle of water coming up through the tube.
winter - Pond breather (0).jpeg


Here is a picture that @MitchM took with the top of the clear tube removed to show how the water is still flowing.
winter - pond breather (3).jpg
 

cas

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2) What is the latest that a new fish can be added to a pond?
Most people will warn you about quarantining your fish for a while before you put them in your pond. I also would not add fish until after the biofilter has matured and the water is warmer. Fish are most susceptible to disease when the pond water temperature is between 40 and 60 degrees (F). This is because the pathogens become active before the fish immune system is fully active. Fish begin to have the ability to fight of disease at 45 degrees, but do not have their full strength immunity until 60 degrees.
 

cas

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4) For some plant baskets, I used dirt with gravel.
I think it depends on what type of plants you have. My blue flag iris and yellow flag iris were planted bare root in the stones around the parameter of the pond, or in mesh planting baskets with just pea gravel. I do not fertilize the flag iris. My water lilies were planted in pea gravel but when I tried to fertilize them, the gravel did not hold the nutrients. From suggestions from this site I began using kitty litter to plant the water lilies in and they are doing much better.

5) Regardng water changes,
Ha. You will get lots of opinions on whether water changes are needed or not. I am not going to comment. :)
 

Meyer Jordan

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Wow, every time I come back to this site, there are more good insights and ideas waiting. You all are terrific! I have a spitter with a small (350gph) dedicated pump on the bottom. Would that suffice as a pond breather? I will also prepare some kind of non-electric backup in case the power goes out while there is also freezing activity. Basically, I'll keep doing a lot of trial and error for winter aeration and see what works, but have options on hand for when the "error" outcome arises, as it usually has done for me with this pond.

I will consider shutting my pond off at feeding time, too. My hope is that by the time the fish emerge from winter and are ready to eat again, they will have forgotten that they are afraid of me. My expectations, however, are otherwise. EricV, my pump is definitely strong, but I have about a 15 foot stream leading to the pond, and given the slope of my yard, probably a 5 foot drop from waterfall to pond surface. I'm also a fan of flow in the waterfall/stream part. My 4800 GPH pump feels right, except for feeding time. I hope to post pictures later today, and definitely by tomorrow. In the meantime, I have some new questions.

1) The fish hide out in the rock pile for most of the day, near as I can tell (except the orfes). I have worried about their waste being trapped down there. Is this fear warrated, and is there anything I can or should do if so?
2) What is the latest that a new fish can be added to a pond? I felt like I was cutting it close to some sort of seasonal deadline when I added fish in late October. Since fish are dormant, woudld it be basically a death sentence to add one during the winter? (I don't have plans, just wondering. But if it's fine, then I might actually get plans...)
3) The stream leading into the pond has a nice bed of pond stones. I have treated the stream as a filter of sorts. Whenever I go into the stream for whatever reason (usually to fix the waterfalls, which are still not really close to being right), all sorts of sediment and general grossness swirls up from under the rocks. This worries me, since it then washes down to the pond. I have thought that maybe I should clean out the stream--and bear in mind it has only been running since early September (it was never "broken"), so it clearly collects gunk quickly--but I'm not sure if this is either advisable or necessary. How should I handle the stream?
4) For some plant baskets, I used dirt with gravel. Somehow, they tipped over; that somehow was usually me. The consequences were not what I would have liked. For other baskets, I used that expensive plant media stuff. I also use that for planting things in the stream and waterfall. It seems to be immune to my efforts at self-sabotage, so I think I will stick with it everywhere, despite the cost. Do I have to change it out each year? Should I treat it like rocks or potting soil, in other words: rocks just are, but potting soil needs to be changed out periodically. Would adding fertilizer tablets allow me to keep the same planting media if it were otherwise to require changing?
5) Regardng water changes, does evaporation and waterfall loss work for "changing out" water? I have spent so much time dealing with replacing water that the idea of taking water out never would have occurred to me. But I have read in many contexts (here, for example) of the benefits of water changes. Can I just wait for the inevitable water drop and then replace that water, or do I also need to directly intervene? I have a set-up that will lead to consistent water drops, especially in warm weather, apart from leaks and things gone wrong, so I know that I will need to add water regularly anyway.

I'll stop there. Thank you all again.for your guidance and encouragement. And Gavin, in the rare moment when I am by my pond but neither working on nor worrying about it, I have experienced what you describe. One of the tremendous and unexpected benefits of the water feature is that working on it is itself very enjoyable. If it ever were to feel like a chore, I will be in trouble because there is so much to do. But whenever I'm out there fixing something or building or tinkering, I'm doing it either in or around a waterfall, which sounds and feels right under any and all circumstances in my view. It's like being paid for having a career that you would otherwise have pursued as a leisure activity. I am definitely looking forward to having everything up to speed. I've never seen some of my plants in bloom--the landscaping plants were in quasi-dormancy by the time I was ready to think about the area around the pond (but they were available at greatly reduced process, which helped)--I've never even had most of the pond plants I want or need, and my fish hide from me. Still, I love being by my pond, even in the dark. It's been a very wonderful and powerful addition to my life. I really can't wait until the Spring to see all of the above actually alive (hopefully) and in bloom.

Pretty healthy 'laundry list! :)

Your pump is the ideal size for your pond.
As to the other items on the list:
1. What small amount of waste that may or may not accumulate is no cause for concern.
2. Wait until Spring when the pond's ecosystem comes back on line. The Number One source of stress in pond fish is transport. When a fish's metabolism is slowing done as temperature drops, stress is considerably more damaging than in warm weather.
3. Leave the stream be. It is doing exactly what a stream is supposed to do.
4. I would replace this special growing mix with simple pea gravel and don't look back. No you do not need to fertilize in a pond stocked with fish.
5. Yes, "regarding water changes'. This is a can of worms that is opened at least 2 or 3 times each year. You will find 2 schools of thought, Pro and Con. I am in the 'Con' group. Water changes are a left-over from the aquarium hobby. They are completely unnecessary in a pond and can actually disrupt the biological and chemical balance. I have seen no valid and compelling reason for doing water changes under normal circumstances.

P.S. Your fish will eventually become social. Right now they are in a still relatively new environment and, as such, perceive everything as a threat or predator.
 
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5) Regardng water changes, does evaporation and waterfall loss work for "changing out" water? I have spent so much time dealing with replacing water that the idea of taking water out never would have occurred to me. But I have read in many contexts (here, for example) of the benefits of water changes. Can I just wait for the inevitable water drop and then replace that water, or do I also need to directly intervene? I have a set-up that will lead to consistent water drops, especially in warm weather, apart from leaks and things gone wrong, so I know that I will need to add water regularly anyway.

If you want to pick a middle ground on water changes, you can check out a trickle change system. http://www.koivet.com/a_waterchanges_for_ammonia_koi.html describes it and if you look around the site you'll find a video with more details. IIRC, @Meyer Jordan is "Con" because large changes change the chemistry of the water. This system does everything so gradually, it won't do that. Personally I use it because I travel a lot and just want something to keep the water topped off. You do need a good way to get rid of extra water, of course, but I'm really happy with this (I add about 40 gallons/day to a pond with similar surface area to yours).

As for wintering, I've got a pond breather and a small pump pumping up towards the surface but not breaking it. Total wattage is about 60 which sure seems like a better idea than the 1200 for some of the de-icers.
 
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The other thing I'd add is now that you have a more or less established pond, find some way to quarantine any new fish you do get. Personally I picked up a couple of 35 gallon preformed ponds which stand on their own (don't need to bury them). Menards was closing them out for $16 each. Pair that with a $15 Harbor Freight pump and a planting container full of filter media and lava rock and I have an ultra-cheap but effective quarantine system for the 4-6" goldfish I bought. You can even seed the filter from your main pond and eliminate any ammonia or nitrite spike.
 
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Hi, everyone. I've attached pictures of my pond/waterfall from various angles. The skimmer is at the low end and should be easy to identify despite being under a fake rock, and the fish are all in the big pile of rocks right in front of it. The water level at the deepest point is about 18 inches and also a few inches above the top of the weir door. I can still add maybe three more inches. Maxing out, therefore, would only give me a maximum depth of 21 inches, a little less than I hoped. Is that deep enough for koi?

I have a lot of very, very helpful posts to reply to above and will do so piecemeal. I have learned as much in the last couple of days as I do in a typical month of trying to boot-camp myself to understanding this hobby. My wife thinks I'm just a wee bit obsessed with this project, but she isn't complaining about the results. Thank you to all of the answers to my queries above. I have much more confidence going into the winter, although I now regret getting both the aerator, which I'll use for the time being after I shut down the pump but will then repurpose to the quarantine tank I'll eventually set up, and the de-icer which is indeed 1250 watts (more than my pump by a mile). I think I'll have the de-icer float in the pond once the weather gets extremely cold but only plug it in when ice starts forming. Specific replies to many helpful posts to follow.
 

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All of the information (and pictures) about pond breathers was very eye-opening. I wish I had recognized the difference between them and aerators, but there will be many more winters ahead. I know that when I do put in my aerator--if I do (we might get lucky again this year and I'll be able to stick with the waterfall/stream)--I won't have the air reach the bottom. Had I not read these posts, I would have made an effort to do exactly the opposite, so that's one huge lesson learned in advance. I am also relieved that the fish are not concentrating toxins in their little rock home. I was certain that they were, or even that they were dying in there and I didn't know because they were contained in something like a fish tomb there.

Incidentally, while I was setting up the netting today--I had the wrong kind of netting on the waterfall and a too-small net on the pond, both thus needing to be fixed--a large white-breasted hawk flew low and slow over the pond. I live in Baltimore City, so this isn't something that I was expecting to see. Maybe my fish aren't shy as much as smart. After setting up my pond, I was only able to get the one lily to provide cover until I got the floating net thing that appears in the pictures, so they quite reasonably seem to have been feeling vulnerable, and now I know why. That net is officially staying on my pond until the lilies are blooming.

For water changes, I will continue to rely on evaporation, splashing and the like, since that has been very "effective" to this point for me. I have mastered the art of losing water. Even under the best of circumstances, I expect to add around 3 inches of water each week when the temperature heats up. I will revisit this strategy if necessary.

I also love the kitty litter idea. There is much creativity on this board! I will employ a mix-and match approach to my plants. I have a planting ledge onto which I place some plants bare root under rocks, but then I was adding that planting media. I won't bother with that anymore, after what I already have runs out. I will also let the fish do the fertilizing for me and use baskets and gravel for non-ledge plantings. Over the winter, I'll get the remaining ingredients for a quarantine system (such as the tank itself) and will hold off getting fish until the weather warms up in April or so. I expected to do so anyway, but my local pond store is practically giving them away right now, so I had to ask.

Thank you again. You all are a wonderful resource! I took the liberty of checking out some of your ponds, too. Wow. You know what you're doing and it shows. I deeply appreciate your help and advice.
 

addy1

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Very nice pond. Watch for herons they found my pond.
 
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I was going to say exactly what you just said - more plant cover in the pond will help to bring your fish out of hiding. Right now they are VERY exposed and those rocks are a safe spot for them.

I see now what you mean about your water level and I'll tell you what I would tell myself - you need to correct that skimmer misplacement. You will never be happy seeing how much deeper your pond could be until you get that fixed. You did all that digging - take advantage of it! Right now you can see a lot of rocks - with the water at the correct level a lot of that rock will be underwater, so the visual effect will be more water, less rock. Plus plants help to soften the edges and blend the pond in to the surrounding landscape. Your pond will be beautiful! Good job!
 
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Very nice pond. Watch for herons they found my pond.
Thank you. Is Frederick a different climate zone because of the elevation? I love it out your way. And I love your water feature, too. Amazing.
 
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Very pretty pond!
Thank you, cas. You seem to have the ideal version of where I'd like my pond to get to--the size looks similar, the waterfall, everything. But yours is perfect. Thank you for the encouragement and advice.
 

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