bio filter ingrediants

[excaliber]

Googled and youtubed and found a vast selection of options but want to ask whats the nuts and bolts on what to use in Bio Filters? looks like a wide selection, I am currently useing floor buffing pads, plastic fencing 1/4 inch holes folded up, gravel and lava rocks, and cut up plastic pipe.[and a UV light]

am i correct in thinking that a Bio Filter creates Bacteria that attacks algae and creates a cycle that keeps the water clear?

thought about useing plastic pellets! also whats the best set up! filter, plastic, or plastic, filter,

 

[excaliber]

opps forgot to spell chk

 

[Ruben Miranda]

Hello
A bio filer creates
Beneficial Bactria
There is 1 colony of BB that eats the Ammonia (That fish create) and turn it to Nitrite less harmful then ammo
the 2 colony of BB turns the Nitrite into Nitrate much less harmful them Ammo and or Nitrites.
Nitrates are then consumed by plants or removed by water replacement and water changes.

The BB do's not eat or attack Algae that is what your UV light is doing.
And that is only killing the floating Algae IE If it flows threw the UV light it is being killed.
But Algae Like String Algae a UV light has no effect on it.
There are ways to get rid of it but that would be a long list.

As for growing the BB in your bio filter
the more surface you have in there Lava rocks gravel or what ever and a continuous water flow with oxgen the better chance you will have at getting a good bb colony.
Remember that the bb colony will only grow and stay stable to the amount of food it is getting.

And for me (And my way of thinking) don't over pack your bio filter with one thing or another.
Not only do's it slow down water flow but water do's not flow all around the lava rock and there you will lose bb growth.

I hope this helps and makes sense
I am real tired and brain is slow. :banghead3:

Ruben .

 

[HTH]

It is not just about the media but where it is and how you use it. How the filter is setup. So a list of the media without knowing the filter etc does not give much useful info. Hard to help. Pictures ?

 

[Waterbug]

Bio filters provide a place for bacteria to grow. They like darkness and lots of ammonia/nitrite, O2 and carbon. Doesn't actually "create" the bacteria. The bacteria is everywhere and will grow throughout a pond.

Fish waste provides the ammonia and then nitrite.

Carbon is provided by several sources. One is calcium carbonate which you can measure with a KH test and increase with baking soda.

O2 is provided by bringing the water close to air. Like in a stream, waterfall, fountain and/or just mixing the water so water from the bottom of the pond gets a shot at being near the surface where CO2 can be released and O2 picked up.

Since darkness is easy, and carbon is easy to measure and add, and the ammonia/nitrite we want to be zero, the one limiting factor in a bio filter we should care about is O2. More O2 the more ammonia/nitrite that can be converted. Because of that the best bio filters are Bakki Shower, Trickle Tower and Moving Bed Filter.

In all three cases the media is kept clean 24/7 and never has to be cleaned. That means the bacteria doesn't can covered up by muck and cut off from ammonia/O2/carbon. In the case of Showers and TT filters the water splashes mixing with air and has maximum O2 for the bacteria. Moving bed can be have an air pump if needed to increase O2.

Because of the increased O2 these bio filters are about 30 times more efficient than any static submerged media. And because the media stays clean it keeps a steady conversion rate while static submerged media builds up muck and conversion drops off.

So all types of static submerged media is pretty poor.

 

[Mmathis]

I wouldn't use gravel. As stated in other posts, water needs to be able to circulate around [and through] the media. Gravel would not facilitate this process, but instead could create areas where "bad" bacteria would grow.

 

[HTH]

I wouldn't use gravel. As stated in other posts, water needs to be able to circulate around [and through] the media. Gravel would not facilitate this process, but instead could create areas where "bad" bacteria would grow.

And when you have to move the gravel it is too heavy. It gets old fast.

 

[Mucky_Waters]

am i correct in thinking that a Bio Filter creates Bacteria that attacks algae and creates a cycle that keeps the water clear?

No, that is not correct. Bio filters have relatively nothing to do with killing algae.

It seems most backyard pond owners tend to focus on building better bio-filters, but from what I have seen, and read in the questions they ask, they would be better off focusing on building more effective mechanical filters, and doing regular water changes, or better yet, setting up a trickle water changes system.

 

[Waterbug]

Based on what I've read of people checking the species of bacteria in bio filters, even the best bio filters contain mostly "bad bacteria". Like 90% if memory severs. It's just that in the natural world there's more food for "bad bacteria" so they're everywhere. Didn't want people to get the wrong idea that a bio filter is exclusively, or even primarily, a home to "good bacteria". The 90% bad thing was from the best bio filters, clean and high O2. In static submerged media the percentage of bad bacteria would be in the 95-99.9% range based on the ammonia conversion rates of these filters compared to the high O2 filters. I don't know of anyone who has actually surveyed a static submerged media filter, but conversion rate is a very good measurement of bacteria species imo.

How and why different species of algae are killed naturally is not completely understood, mainly because it doesn't matter enough to study imo. More is known about saltwater algae.

Norm Meck wrote a paper which showed water from a clear pond can be toxic to green water algae, at least one species any ways. His theory is the toxin is produced by a bacteria. So if you believe his theory a bio filter could kill green water algae. My own theory based on his experiments is the toxin is more likely produced by other plants, like string algae. I think it fits better and I've done some experiments which seems to support the theory.

The type of "bio filter" may also play a role. For example a bog or gravel filter may have something to do with killing green water algae. Regardless of Mr Meck's theory on bacteria enzymes, many bacteria would certainly attack algae as they attack any organic. As single cell algae is flowed thru gravel there would be a higher likelihood of the algae cell coming into very close contact with a lot of different bacteria. There's a chance of cells becoming trapped. A chance cells can become damaged. Cells get less sunlight so that reduces reproduction. No one knows. It could well be that this process only reduces single algae reproduction allowing macroalgae a chance to get the upper hand.

In practice I would say a bio filter, a real bio filter not just something called a bio filter, would not be responsible for killing algae of any kind. Even safer to say is killing algae is not the primary function of a bio filter. Meaning even if it may kill some algae it wouldn't be enough to make any difference. Maybe in the future someone will come up with a bio filter that does kill algae, but none today.

 

[HTH]

The 90% bad thing was from the best bio filters, clean and high O2. In static submerged media the percentage of bad bacteria would be in the 95-99.9%

You lost me there. When people say bad bacteria I think anaerobic bacteria. Are you saying even with high O2 that 90% of the bacteria growth will be anarobic.

 

[excaliber]

very good reading and as stated in my 1st post on this forum i am a pond novice, and now i have determined i need a masters in bio engineering .. JK. did not realize untill to late ponds are like having a kid to raise.

my filter layers:
inlet from the bottom
filter medium
layer of plastic mesh
thick layer of plastic "floor buffer pads"
layer of plastic mesh
layer of plastic pipes cut up
layer of wire fencing
layer of lava rock

water exits as a waterfall at the top, onto the mountains, volume is estimated at 1k an hour, filter box is 24x20x20 deep.

will get some updated pics ... HOW do i post pics rather than urls? img tags dont work?

http://s125.photobucket.com/user/excaliber2006/media/015.jpg.html?sort=3&o=25

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p49/excaliber2006/038-2_zps4978b473.jpg?t=1366768205

http://s125.photobucket.com/user/excaliber2006/media/694_zpsf2bc758f.jpg.html?sort=3&o=14

 

[addy1]

I copy the bottom one, img code from photo bucket (from get links) and just paste it in the thread.

btw looking good there

 

[HTH]

It is bad deal that the forum only uses image uploads to the gallery. Sooner or later external images go away and it will make the old threads into parts missing turkeys.

I have mentioned this earlier in the feedback forum but it fell on deaf ears.

 

[Catfishnut]

Excalibur,

I am also just a novice regarding ponds and filters and bio-converters. However, after all the reading and researching I have done thus far, coupled with my personal experiences and what I have observed in nature, I totally agree with Waterbug's information related to this subject.

I sincerely believe that bakki shower and trickle tower type bio-conversion or bio-filters are the best all around systems for backyard ponds.

I also investigated moving bed systems, expressly something incorporating Kaldness K1 or K3 media, but I have become less enthused with these systems for small operations and ponds because I believe that they demand much more energy to "fluidize" the media bed.... Which means in simpler terms that it requires more energy to keep the media in motion and bumping into itself continuously within a bath of water. That is just common sense regarding the energy expended. Pumping the water up about the same head height and just allowing it to trickle down through stationary media seems more energy efficient than trying to pump enough water and pump enough O2 into the water and agitate the water sufficiently to make a bunch of friction prone media discs keep rolling around like a washing machine. And then, I am not so certain that it is AS effective in the first place. I am thinking not.

In applications, such as bakki showers, I envision small diameter ladies hair curlers, the very open and porous type... (breathable) as being about the best media. That is my opinion based upon what principles are involved. You need something with a lot of "open" surface area. Plastic bottle brushes come to mind, also. Matala mats and rolls are probably very good, but they are more expensive. I have bought several rolls, but haven't yet put them to use. I will use them, but I will apply them in an open air "trickle shower" scheme. I think this will work. I would not apply them in a submerged soaking fashion, like a skippy filter system, though. I think they would be better applied in a downflow shower.

My pond is a big ass fishbait tank. It is mainly for my fishing bait. I have dirty, rough fish and sometimes 30 pound snapping turtles and 6 to 60 pound catfish in my "pond". Sometimes, when I catch my baitfish, I dump the whole 5 gallon bucket in the tank with leaves, sticks, mud and algae and who knows what, it all goes right in. It is pretty crude quite often. So, you can understand that I need to do some "special" filtering compared to someone's quaint little patio pond. I've got a "REDNECK" pond! LOL

I have to manage this system differently than most of your projects. So I have been devising and developing my own DIY filtration and water conditioning system for quite a while now. I am close to having a decent system engineered. I have had a few fair examples working before, but... now with the information that I have gained from this forum, I have refined and improved upon those old designs, and I currently have an entirely new system under construction and working on it almost daily.

Catfishnut

 

[HTH]

Another bio filter I want to mention it algae. Algae directly consumes ammonia. A surface exposed to sunlight with a small amount of water trickling over it a profusion of algae will grow on it. I have 15 square feet of exposed liner that should be suited for this.

I have been looking for internet references on doing this but must not be using the right name for it. "pond algae wall filter" has now worked.

Anyone ?