First Year Pond Running All Winter Zone 7a

[callingcolleen1]

I am not a fan of bottom drains cause I think it could just be a disaster during the winter if any water left in tubes, as our winters can be very hard and down to minus 40 below, and the ground has been known to freeze over 6 feet deep in past years. This year is a very mild winter and I am lucky that I never had to use heater until December.
I think you might just be able to get away with a good pond vacuum perhaps. Although your pond does appear very large so not sure if you will be able to reach center with pond vacuum...

 

[slick]

I had a smaller garden pond with no bottom drain for about 10 year's and loved it, it was about 6ftx8ft by 3ft deep, submersible pump and a simple filter box leading to a small water fall and yes every spring I emptied the pond dug the gunk out and off I went again, (ps gold fish) then I got the koi bug, and was advised that the pond needed to be at least a sustain size and depth so I installed a bottom drain while I was building the new pond, I was told that at 5ft deep there is next to no temperature change from August to February due to sun heat and tbe warmth of mother nature! What a load of crap! The water at the bottom of the pond which would have been warmer was sucked down the drain and it re entered the pond at the top so no temperature change at all! If the water is 2*c at the surface then the water temperature at 5ft deep is also at 2*c!! Bear that in mind!! If you size the pipe work correctly to the amount of water flow the the bottom drain pipe will remain clean I have a purge valve I can open to flush the drain, but all said and done I personally would not build another pond without one, there are big pro's and cons with this system but once you get your head around it and totally turn the way you flow your water on its head as in gravity fed not pump fed then you will see more pro's I love mine but this system is expensive to install and a lot of hard work and worry, if you think you may like it before you do why not try a retro fit kit first!!

 

[slick]

In my eyes and they are my eyes and my way of thinking, and only my way of thinking is its like building a fish toilet you only flush once a year! Would you be happy to live the same? As I said this is only my thoughts not the law!!!

 

[slick]

As for a member saying any water left in the pipe it would freeze? A bottom drain is not a drain sorry but many people think the same, it's the pond outlet! And it serves the water flow to the pumps the pump is surface mounted, which the gose to the filters, the pond fills the filters due to gravity and the pump empties the filters and refills the pond so the bottom drain pipe is always full of moving water

 

[pecan]

@slick this was my very first pond. Got a wild hair and a few beers in me and the son in law and I started digging by hand while the hubby was at work. LOL in 2011 it was very simple, a big hole with a liner and a pump to a water fall. No filtration at all. I just had comets the first couple years and slowly started expanding the waterfall and adding filtration after the fact. Then in 2013 IIRC we added a few Koi.

Now looking back I would have done a lot of things differently but isn't that always the way with our fist ponds?

Now I have the waterfall and plumbing around it the way I want, I foresee in the years to come the pond will be re-dug deeper with bottom drains added. I built the waterfall and filtration in a way that we can remove the pond liner, re-dig the pond and install a new liner with minimal impact to the falls and filters. Just move a few rocks in the front and tuck the new pond liner up under the liner of the falls.

But in the meantime I am slowly getting rid of all the comets and not getting anymore koi. When the time comes to dig I don't want a lot of fish to worry about finding a temp water hole for.

I am thinking maybe around 2020 or so we will take on that little project and until then I rest

 

[slick]

Sounds like you started the very same way all the members did me include, the biggest lesson iv learnt is small and simpl can be a lot more enjoyable than the big flashy show ponds, the amount of money and time I have wasted listing to people I thought that they knew more and better than my gut instinct, I started to chase the high tech more toys type of pond and all I did was look at my pond thinking it was crap and not good enough, so I took s step back broke contact with the rich boys and guess what I started to love my pond again and rembered why I dug it, it my not be the biggest may not be the deepest or have thousands of pounds spent on it but its mine and now I take a glass of wine and sit and watch the koi, all im trying to say is that all pknds are the same as not all people are the same

 

[pecan]

Sounds like you started the very same way all the members did me include, the biggest lesson iv learnt is small and simpl can be a lot more enjoyable than the big flashy show ponds, the amount of money and time I have wasted listing to people I thought that they knew more and better than my gut instinct, I started to chase the high tech more toys type of pond and all I did was look at my pond thinking it was crap and not good enough, so I took s step back broke contact with the rich boys and guess what I started to love my pond again and rembered why I dug it, it my not be the biggest may not be the deepest or have thousands of pounds spent on it but its mine and now I take a glass of wine and sit and watch the koi, all im trying to say is that all pknds are the same as not all people are the same

This right here, is a great post and rings so true!

 

[JBailey]

What a great thread!

 

[pecan]

We are now into what looks to be the coldest week of the year, right on schedule and right at average cold temps. The last few days have been high's in the 20's and low's in the single digits. Looking at the forecast we should get a little warmer next week, with lows in the teens and highs in the 30's-40's.

Here are some pictures from today. I have been keeping a close eye on the ponds and it has been interesting to watch.

Large Bog, Small Pond

There is a lot of ice forming on the pots and added some water yesterday. Since the ice forming is taking away the open water underneath. There was a couple inch gap between the ice and the water before I added more water. The ice on the small pond is about 2" thick right now.

Here is the large pond.

Interestingly the water is coming out of the covered filter tanks, into the small bog above the falls. The water initially goes under some ice, then there are two open water streams and then back under the ice that has formed on the falls. Standing next to the falls you can here the waterfall, but you can't see it. Weird!

 

[cas]

biggest lesson iv learnt is small and simpl can be a lot more enjoyable than the big flashy show ponds

So true. If I knew then what I know now, I would have done some things differently. However, If I knew then what I know now, I might not have built my pond! Just like you @pecan , I just dug a hole and put a liner in it. Not much thought to filtration at the time (of course I wasn't going to have fish either - ha!).

 

[cas]

We are now into what looks to be the coldest week of the year, right on schedule

Aren't you lucky. Our coldest temps are usually in February. I still have that to look forward too. Of course our December has been beautiful this year - 50's and 60's, no snow accumulation, no frozen pond.

 

[pecan]

Aren't you lucky. Our coldest temps are usually in February. I still have that to look forward too. Of course our December has been beautiful this year - 50's and 60's, no snow accumulation, no frozen pond.

Our average highs are:
January: 30's
February: 40's
March: 50's
April: 60's
May: 70's
June: 100+
July: 100+
August: 100 +
September: 70's
October: 60's
November: 50's
December: 40's

I may be exaggerating about June, July and August... but the rest is actually accurate

 

[pecan]

A few winters ago during a bored weekend, I pulled daily historic temperatures for my locations ranging over 40 years. I imported them into excel and figure the max high and lows and averages. It was kind of fun, but I am a climate and excel nerd.

Interestingly enough I found that while the USDA zone map said I was in a zone 6, I was actually in a zone 7. Funny thing is a few months later the USDA released a new updated zone map saying that I was in a zone 7 LOL.

I also found that the coldest temperatures in the last 40 years for my location happened in the first and second weeks of January. After the second week of January temps begin to rise very slowly.

I would have done the same for rain fall, but we don't get any so it wouldn't have been very useful

 

[flareyflan]

Pecan, I see you're in a high desert zone 7. I'm in high desert 6. Whereabouts are you? I'm in Salt Lake City. Just curious if we are near each other.

-Arianne

 

[flareyflan]

Sounds like you started the very same way all the members did me include, the biggest lesson iv learnt is small and simpl can be a lot more enjoyable than the big flashy show ponds, the amount of money and time I have wasted listing to people I thought that they knew more and better than my gut instinct, I started to chase the high tech more toys type of pond and all I did was look at my pond thinking it was crap and not good enough, so I took s step back broke contact with the rich boys and guess what I started to love my pond again and rembered why I dug it, it my not be the biggest may not be the deepest or have thousands of pounds spent on it but its mine and now I take a glass of wine and sit and watch the koi, all im trying to say is that all pknds are the same as not all people are the same

That's the smartest thing I've ever seen written on this forum! So much conflicting information--only one gut instinct. Bravo to you.