I'm so upset! Two dead Koi! l

Discussion in 'Garden Pond Talk' started by AngelaM, Feb 27, 2018.

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  1. AngelaM

    sissy sissy

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    I have moved my fish several times .4 times in total and last 2 times they were over 2 feet long and as long as you filter water and test it they can be fine .Was really 5 times if you consider the first pond was just preformed until the front porch was finished but then they were tiny .2 dogs and moles destroyed my other liners .I thought about taking stock out in pond liners .So it depends on precautions made before you move fish and using as much of the original pond water as possible .At least I had well water so it made it a little easier
     
    sissy, Mar 2, 2018
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  2. AngelaM

    Lisak1

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    I'd put my money on that being the tipping point. Too many fish is too little water for a protracted period of time. And then a too new pond. And then winter.

    My scientist son likes to remind me that "correlation does not imply causation". In other words, the fact that the previous pond owner ONLY used an aerator and the fish did NOT die, does not mean the aerator would have changed this outcome. Likewise the fact that you chose to use a pond breather and the fish DID die does not mean the pond breather is to blame. I don't use either one during our cold winters (nor do I use a cover or a cattle trough heater or a de-icer or, well... you get the point!) and my fish thrive. But it would be false reasoning to assume that my fish DON'T die because I don't employ any of those strategies.

    Every pond is different, every season is different, every circumstance is different. Sometimes things can work for many many years and then suddenly one variation can tip the balance and the outcome is different. Even nature isn't perfect - fish kills happen in natural ponds and lakes due to NATURAL variations in circumstances. Trying to compare one pond to another is pointless. Each pond owner needs to consider their own set of circumstances and learn through observation (and sometimes, sadly, the hard way) what works for THEIR pond.

    I remain curious to know how the remaining fish are faring. Any signs of them struggling now that you can observe them in the pond? I think that's an interesting factor - why SOME of the fish but not ALL of the fish.
     
    Lisak1, Mar 3, 2018
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  3. AngelaM

    AngelaM

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    I'm assuming they're still alive. I haven't seen any of them yet. They're still hanging in the deep end and it's too dark to tell. I can't see to the bottom yet.
     
    AngelaM, Mar 3, 2018
  4. AngelaM

    Lisak1

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    Why?
     
    Lisak1, Mar 3, 2018
  5. AngelaM

    AngelaM

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    I don't know if it's that I can't see bottom or the fish just blend in too well. My two bright orange ones are the ones that died. I have the pure black molly, and black and white Koi so they blend with the liner pretty well. After I found the dead fish I cleaned about 6 nets of leaves off of the bottom so I stirred the water up a bit. It's a little murky right now. Should it be crystal clear right after the ice thaws? If so mine was not. :(
     
    AngelaM, Mar 4, 2018
  6. AngelaM

    Lisak1

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    My water is always super clear when the ice melts. Here's a picture I took today from a second story window. The arrow is pointing to fish that are 31/2 feet down inside the tunnel. They are easy to see because of their bright colors, but you can make out every rock and stone on the bottom. I have some leaves that need to come out, but if I stir things up, the water is clear again within minutes. It shouldn't take days to clear up the murkiness. Pond bottom.JPG
     
    Lisak1, Mar 4, 2018
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  7. AngelaM

    AngelaM

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    Yours is much clearer than mine! I don't have rocks in mine, just the black liner at the bottom. Plus my water lillies are in black pots on the deep end too.
     
    AngelaM, Mar 4, 2018
  8. AngelaM

    MitchM

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    AngelaM your pond doesn’t seem to have much of a berm.
    Is it possible you could have surface water running into it?
     
    MitchM, Mar 4, 2018
  9. AngelaM

    Jhn

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    Fish are probably hugging up against the plant pots and other hiding spots in the deep end this time of year.They are pretty good at hiding in places you wouldn't think a fish could hide even larger ones.

    Agree, with Mitch, if there isn't much of a berm you could get surface run off into the pond, which could lead to the water being murky. Also, I would watch doing to much cleaning of leaves etc. in the pond this time of year. Let the fish come out of their torpor, for a bit before doing a spring cleaning. Don't want to stress them when they are still in hibernation mode.
     
    Jhn, Mar 4, 2018
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  10. AngelaM

    AngelaM

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    I don't think I'm getting any surface runoff. Since the previous photo I built the edge up under the liner so it does have a decent sized edge that slopes away from the pond.
     
    AngelaM, Mar 4, 2018
  11. AngelaM

    MitchM

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    A recent picture of the pond might help us with further suggestions.
     
    MitchM, Mar 4, 2018
  12. AngelaM

    Lisak1

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    A picture would be great help - especially in it's current condition. Are you running your filtration or is the pond still shut down?
     
    Lisak1, Mar 4, 2018
  13. AngelaM

    AngelaM

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    It's still shut down.
     
    AngelaM, Mar 4, 2018
  14. AngelaM

    AngelaM

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    We have ice again this morning. :(
     
    AngelaM, Mar 4, 2018
  15. AngelaM

    AngelaM

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    Here's a current photo. I can see about 2 feet down. I only have rocks on the 18" steps but not the rest of the pond. It looks like the dirt has settled a bit which I was expecting. That's why I held off on putting the slate around the pond. I'm definitely going to be adding more dirt around the edge. IMG_5927.JPG IMG_5928.JPG
     
    AngelaM, Mar 4, 2018
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  16. AngelaM

    MitchM

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    That water doesn't look too bad to me, I think the tea colour is from the leaves that fell in and the tannins/humic substances that are released.
    Humic substances are a good thing.
    It would be a good idea to build up the berm some more, I'm not sure how much precipitation you usually get.
     
    MitchM, Mar 4, 2018
  17. AngelaM

    Lisak1

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    Yup - the water appears to be clear, just stained. That's not a problem. But I bet you did get a significant amount of dirt in the pond from your unfinished edges. Are you planning for an overhang with your slate edge?

    You'll get there - spring is coming!
     
    Lisak1, Mar 4, 2018
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  18. AngelaM

    MitchM

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    Also, those humic substances will eventually get broken down by bacteria, which will consume some alkalinity (KH)
    Make sure to get that KH/GH kit and test!
     
    MitchM, Mar 4, 2018
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  19. AngelaM

    Gemma

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    @AngelaM I know it's depressing right now with the loss of your fish and all the questions unanswered, but don't get discouraged, a pond is not just problems and hard work, it gives many rewards as well and if you don't give up you'll get there soon and forget all about this dark time
    hang in there :)
     
    Gemma, Mar 5, 2018
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  20. AngelaM

    GBBUDD

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    Being new to ponds make me have to question the use of a solar POOL cover . As adding O2 to the water is crucial in the winter so is providing a means of gas exchange. isn't a solar cover plastic and not designed to allow for air exchange?
     
    GBBUDD, Mar 6, 2018
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