Liner placement, how bad is this going to be.........

[sissy]

to me rectangle was easy only folds in the corner like a sheet and if the liner is hot it is soft and easier to work with

 

[Faebinder]

Faebinder....Did you mean to attach a pic? You ended your post with "Like this or this". If you're anything like me I do that all the time, send someone a question or something, and forget to attach the pic I'm talking about. Or maybe you're answering the other question referring to my fish cave as I see those 2 images in your post.

moby.... as shown in the 2 images in Faebinder's post, those are what I refer to as a fish cave. It measures 20" wide, 22" deep (front to back) and 12" deep under the top which is going to be a 1 1/2" or so piece of blue stone which will rest on the two shelves on either side. Hopefully I explained that right. Do you think that's OK for a cave?

This is all new to me as I mentioned in my first post. My 12-15 year old pond was a preform 300 gal or so which was easy to install. This requires some imagination and design skills of which I have very little. While being very mechanically inclined and able to do just about anything someone would ask me too, I have absolutely no imagination or ability to design stuff like this. I greatly admire those who do, it's a very helpful gift for many things in life.

Again thank you all who have taken the time to respond and offer your much appreciated help. Hope you're all having a great weekend....... Just found out the liner and underlayment will be here Wed, have to check the weather for Thurs and Fri.....at least I hope that's enough time, haha.

Bill...............sorry for such long posts

Those were Youtube links on how to build a koi cave.

 

[billjr]

Those were Youtube links on how to build a koi cave.

They both took me to 2 different pics of my pond I'm doing now showing the what I refer to as a "fish cave" shown on my original post here.

Bill

 

[sissy]

fish waste can be bad in a koi cave because it is trapped and can kill fish

 

[billjr]

fish waste can be bad in a koi cave because it is trapped and can kill fish

Hmmmm never thought of that. I was thinking it would provide cover if necessary, maybe I won't be putting the top on. What would be your opinion of putting the top on as a kind of cover but keeping the back edge of the top about 4"- 6" out from the back wall to allow circulation if that makes any sense?

I had originally gotten the idea of a fish cave after seeing some who use a 12" - 14" piece of corrugated black plastic pipe butted right up against the back wall of the pond and covering it with stones or rock.

 

[sissy]

The waste can collect on the bottom .I have seen some of the pond builders on you tube now saying they are a bad idea .I used to have the top of a kitty litter box on the bottom of my pond and when I went to lift it out I saw all the waste as it came up and it was nasty .I tried it with an airstone in it but it got covered eventually also

 

[billjr]

The waste can collect on the bottom .I have seen some of the pond builders on you tube now saying they are a bad idea .I used to have the top of a kitty litter box on the bottom of my pond and when I went to lift it out I saw all the waste as it came up and it was nasty .I tried it with an airstone in it but it got covered eventually also

Thanks Sissy, this is something I'm definitely have to reconsider. At least the only thing I'll have to change will be not placing that piece of blue stone on top of those 2 shelves it would seem.

 

[Faebinder]

Hmmmm never thought of that. I was thinking it would provide cover if necessary, maybe I won't be putting the top on. What would be your opinion of putting the top on as a kind of cover but keeping the back edge of the top about 4"- 6" out from the back wall to allow circulation if that makes any sense?

I had originally gotten the idea of a fish cave after seeing some who use a 12" - 14" piece of corrugated black plastic pipe butted right up against the back wall of the pond and covering it with stones or rock.

Predators are a bigger problem for me. When you drain the pond to clean it you can clean the cave. That's how I look at it.

 

[billjr]

Predators are a bigger problem for me. When you drain the pond to clean it you can clean the cave. That's how I look at it.

Oh boy, another great point. Plus I do have an OASE vac that actually works great. I could periodically just stick the hose under and inside the cave and quickly vacuum it out. Good I can spend some time thinking of this instead of placing the liner, haha

 

[Lisak1]

When you drain the pond to clean it you can clean the cave

Hmmm... who drains the pond that far down? We have a clay chimney flue in our pond as a cave. Every now and then I just haul the hose in and spray it around inside and stir things up - no need to empty the pond to clean the cave. It's fun because the fish always have gravel piled up inside and I just knock it all down, just to keep them busy!

 

[sissy]

Draining a pond to clean it is not always the best .Every time you do it can put stress on the fish .With 2 foot long koi I would not want to risk it .Bad enough I had to remove them to replace the liner .Never would want to do it every year

 

[addy1]

Hmmm... who drains the pond that far down?

In the 7 years mine has been running I have never drained it down to clean, never will.

 

[mgmine]

Make sure that the brand name isn't on top when you put the liner in. Leave a lot of extra at the top and fold it over then cover it with dirt. Fill the pond then build up any low spots around the pond. If liner is showing on one side cut a shelf in and put rocks on it.

 

[EricV]

Hmmmm never thought of that. I was thinking it would provide cover if necessary, maybe I won't be putting the top on. What would be your opinion of putting the top on as a kind of cover but keeping the back edge of the top about 4"- 6" out from the back wall to allow circulation if that makes any sense?

I had originally gotten the idea of a fish cave after seeing some who use a 12" - 14" piece of corrugated black plastic pipe butted right up against the back wall of the pond and covering it with stones or rock.

I did one kind of like yours, I think, but with a 13 gallon black trash can. I'm not sure it ever gets used. Maybe I should just pull the trash can out. (After the algae grows in, you don't see it.)

 

[billjr]

OK, Well I'm a week late on this but wanted you all to know that we got our liner in last weekend. I just about used every suggestion here to do it, but we're happy with the way it turned out. I think for us, not as young as we used to be, the weight of the liner was the most difficult part. We laid it out in the sun, than centered it with the hole, than folded it to make it a little more controllable when we pulled and slid it into the pond over the underlayment. Filling it while being right there to jump in as it filled gave me a whole lot of control as far as getting small wrinkles out, or into just one larger fold. All in all it wasn't as bad as I thought. As far as the fish cave, I did go ahead and place the top of it for now and will keep an eye out for any build up of debris. We just put the fish in yesterday, and they seem to love the cave. I had to poke in there today to see if the one 14" or so koi was back there, I couldn't find him any where else. So still a lot of rocking (and trimming of the UL and liner) around the outside. By that time it'll be time to get some kind of leaf protection like I had on my existing smaller pond. Anyway, I just wanted to thank everyone here who took the time to offer me your support and suggestions and help. I very much appreciated it, and it sure helped me out.

Bill