Selling question


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Meyer Jordan

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Having been involved in the commercial world the greater portion of my life and owned my own business for 20 years, It is my experience that anyone who markets or sells any item(s) on a regularly recurring basis to support anything is considered a commercial venture. It was stated that in this case items are sold to support a hobby. My business was designing and installing aquatic habitats to support my hobby of terrestrial and aquatic gardening. Should I have been considered non-commercial just because I used the word 'hobby'? I do not think so. There is a wide difference to the occasional selling of that odd item and offering a selection (menu) of items on a recurring basis.
I must totally agree with @Becky. The line has to be drawn somewhere. The fact that this individual has previously expressed that part of the reason that they joined this Forum was to sell their items plainly puts them over this line.
Rules are made and many times they can be arbitrary, but they are made and thus should be followed.

The definition of 'cpmmercial'- "prepared, done, or acting with sole or chief emphasis on salability, profit, or success"

And from the IRS- ":Generally, an activity qualifies as a business if it is carried on with the reasonable expectation of earning a profit."
 
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DutchMuch

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Are you saying (on the bottom) that I would have to be a sponsor? IMO that's a bad idea...
As for the rest: I guess all I can really say at this point unless im going around in a circle with you chasing eachothers tails,
Is that im a aquascaping hobbyist, and a studier of emersed and submersed aquatic plant flowers (such as crypts). I guess when I said multiple times "I trim these plants and sell the trimmings at at least 1/2 the price to spread them around the hobby more" didn't give a reason for me to continue on selling my trimmings. I don't trim just once my entire life its a recurring thing about every week.
At this point I really don't know what to say other than I guess im sticking to purely selling items on APC, Barrreport, and elsewhere for now which im fine with, I don't disagree with your rules so to speak because its your forum and your the boss! ( :) ) but im just saying it can be improved, and imo this is one way it can be improved, by letting people such as myself and all alike, post these types (type: regular..) of for sale threads on your sale area as long as they can be grown in ponds, or are pond related obviously. But what ive mostly gotten and believe from this conversation is that if I had changed the title of my post then I wouldn't have been "commercial" the word I believe you guys way overuse and overthink the scale of it.
This is what the for sale thread looks like on APC http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/sale-trade/
And I guess when I said I was NON PROFIT that wasn't taken into consideration, or idk maybe it was... Then you guys are in a heck of a birds nest there.
But could you though give me a pure example of my post, not being commercial? like I said previously but it was not answered (more questions ik ik)
The fact that this individual has previously expressed that part of the reason that they joined this Forum was to sell their items plainly puts them over this line.
I don't own a business, like you said I do (I think), and if you consider me a small business at 16 that's pretty good!
I joined this forum (as ive said multiple times) to give the advice I have and pass it along to others. At the time I also had about 12 bags of trimmings to sell (per species practically) so I figured why not sell them.

All in all I don't see how this is such a bad thing and I certainly had no bad intentions.
 
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DutchMuch

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If other members are interested in seeing more items for sale then maybe there are things we could do to allow this - for example, small businesses could pay to list their sales. Would this be what you are looking for @MitchM & @MoonShadows?
*had to say this in separate post*
This (and I know coming from me, is kind of weird for some of you I guess, idk) is a bad idea, if you considered me a small business, then a lot of people looking to sell on here wouldn't want to pay just to get rid of stuff or sell trimmings... That's unreasonable. If your looking for a BUSINESS sponser that's different, most forums have those.
 
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I would like to see accommodations made for hobbyists that are financing their hobby through propagation (plants, fish or other) because it promotes a self sustaining hobby.
I would much rather purchase from a local vendor that does not use the medications commonly used in tropical fish "farms" or plant suppliers that are in a different country
I come from the reef side of things where natural reefs are being over harvested for the benefit of the reef hobby.

Locally grown and sold products help in a number of ways:
-the vendor has strong specimens that are raised in local environmental conditions
-the vendor has a vested interest in helping the local hobby community be succesful in raising the specimens
-forum members receive a benefit by purchasing locally, receiving good support and acquiring their specimens at a lower cost

Some of my suggestions are:
-the buy and sell area is only open to active forum members
-hobbyists can only advertise their items for sale if they are contributing members of the community
-posts in the buy and sell section need to be pre approved before being posted in the buy/sell forum.

This isn't a make or break topic for me, but I would generally like to see more quality items available for sale from forum members and more participation from knowledgeable hobbyists.
I would like very much to be able to grow and sell items to other hobbyists that in turn helps finance my hobby. I don't see a problem with doing that. My location prevents me from participating, unfortunately.
 
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DutchMuch

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I would much rather purchase from a local vendor that does not use the medications commonly used in tropical fish "farms" or plant suppliers that are in a different country
very true; I guess im certified organic then lol
 

MoonShadows

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I am not looking for small businesses to list their sales, but it also looks like DutchMuch is not a small business....just selling what he has grown since he has it in surplus...at least it looks that way to me.
 
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MoonShadows

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The fact that this individual has previously expressed that part of the reason that they joined this Forum was to sell their items plainly puts them over this line.
."

I don't remember seeing this. I don't doubt you Meyer, but could you please point out this post. because if this is the case, than I would not allow DutchMuch to sell his plants here, and I may have been mistaken in my post just above this one.
 

MoonShadows

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I would like to see accommodations made for hobbyists that are financing their hobby through propagation (plants, fish or other) because it promotes a self sustaining hobby.
I would much rather purchase from a local vendor that does not use the medications commonly used in tropical fish "farms" or plant suppliers that are in a different country
I come from the reef side of things where natural reefs are being over harvested for the benefit of the reef hobby.

Locally grown and sold products help in a number of ways:
-the vendor has strong specimens that are raised in local environmental conditions
-the vendor has a vested interest in helping the local hobby community be succesful in raising the specimens
-forum members receive a benefit by purchasing locally, receiving good support and acquiring their specimens at a lower cost

Some of my suggestions are:
-the buy and sell area is only open to active forum members
-hobbyists can only advertise their items for sale if they are contributing members of the community
-posts in the buy and sell section need to be pre approved before being posted in the buy/sell forum.

This isn't a make or break topic for me, but I would generally like to see more quality items available for sale from forum members and more participation from knowledgeable hobbyists.
I would like very much to be able to grow and sell items to other hobbyists that in turn helps finance my hobby. I don't see a problem with doing that. My location prevents me from participating, unfortunately.


Good post, Mitch.
 

DutchMuch

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I don't remember seeing this. I don't doubt you Meyer, but could you please point out this post. because if this is the case, than I would not allow DutchMuch to sell his plants here, and I may have been mistaken in my post just above this one.
it was in my third post down I think, I said something along the lines of "I didn't just come to sell stuff but also came to become a part of the community as im building a pond myself"
"I didn't just come to sell stuff" reason I said it that way, is because he said that's all I came for. And I did come to sell at the time my trimmings, which have now sadly been thrown away again.
 
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DutchMuch

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For others who don't know my process before I sell the Trimmings of my flowering emersed aquatic plant setups here is the actions I take;

I go into the greenhouse and check all my bins (daily) and usually every week they need in order to stay healthy, a good trim to encourage a certain area of plant growth within one individual plant.

Once I inspect the plants to make sure they are no deficiency's going on or around, or funguses, etc
I make sure (weekly) they don't need a trimming, they do normally about every week so that's my maintenance schedule for them.

Once I trim all my plants (usually end up having about 2lbs of plant trimmings per species) I either decide to sell them for a cheap price, because its better than throwing them into the garbage. To get a plant to go around so others can enjoy and grow themselves, to witness the beauty of something of that size and nature.
once that is done and they are either thrown away, or sold.

The cycle starts over again (weekly)
 

MoonShadows

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Speaking of advertising, why do I keep getting ads asking me if I want to date hot Russian women?
I would rather buy fish and plants.

Send those ones to me, Mitch!
lau.gif
 

DutchMuch

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Speaking of advertising, why do I keep getting ads asking me if I want to date hot Russian women?
I would rather buy fish and plants.
That made my day lol
 
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I guessed he/she was a teen in one of the first posts - the "hundreds a week, rounded up" was a giveaway. And I expected the "plants for sale" post, too, based on the earlier post.

@DutchMuch - you're getting hung up on what the post looked like that got pulled. It's the intent that matters, not the actual post. You said you chose the wording of the title as marketing - that's commercial activity.

If your interest is to spread the propagation and knowledge of your hobby, how about offering free cuttings? Or for the cost of postage?
 
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DutchMuch

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If your interest is to spread the propagation and knowledge of your hobby, how about offering free cuttings? Or for the cost of postage?
like ive said numerous times, I profit this hobby, with the hobby. I make no money, it goes to the plants which I sell to you all for example.
 
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