Newbie needs tips! :)

[warren]

I think that's already been done. If I understand the situation correctly, the circulation has been turned off and the pond rapidly drops to the level its at now and then stops. This should be verified, of course.

Could it be seal to skimmer and liner?how much lower is the seal from the entrance to skimmer box?just a thought might be an easy fix.

 

[EricV]

OP says the water level comes to the bottom of the intake weir. Anything in the range from the top to the bottom of the area around the intake weir could be a leak in that seal. I had one. Everything looked normal on the surface, but a small test hole dug in the soil showed a lot water pooling down there.

 

[warren]

OP says the water level comes to the bottom of the intake weir. Anything in the range from the top to the bottom of the area around the intake weir could be a leak in that seal. I had one. Everything looked normal on the surface, but a small test hole dug in the soil showed a lot water pooling down there.

I don't have a skimmer but I remember how the skimmer in my pool was that would be my first thought.

 

[Hummingbird2]

Ssoooooooooo . . . I decided to put the pipe piece back in and turn on the pump again just to circulate some water and I was kneeling behind the skimmer. When I got up, my left knee was really wet with mud even though it hasn't rained in at least 3 days. So I started feeling around and pulled up some rocks around the front of the skimmer and it was all muddy and the liner was all scrunched up down near the water level! I kept pulling rocks away and the whole freaking north side of the pond liner is like that! I went around to the north side and it's like that too! The whole rim of the $&#&* pond liner is scrunched down like 3 inches! BUT even when I pull all the rocks out and tug the liner up, the very edge of the liner is where the water line *should* be! There's almost NO overlap!! Like the freaking liner is too small!!! Shouldn't it come up to the water line and then over the edge/rim of the pond a few inches to hold it in place!?! Aauugghg!!!! The previous owner paid almost $5000 for this pond around 2000 or 2005 or something! And they didn't even give her a big enough liner!? How expensive would a new liner be and how much time/work would it be to put a new bigger liner in!? If I go all around the pond and pull the current liner up and stack rocks around to keep it up, how long is that going to last like that before it slumps down again!? So disenchanted with this whole thing . . .

 

[Angel]

Ssoooooooooo . . . I decided to put the pipe piece back in and turn on the pump again just to circulate some water and I was kneeling behind the skimmer. When I got up, my left knee was really wet with mud even though it hasn't rained in at least 3 days. So I started feeling around and pulled up some rocks around the front of the skimmer and it was all muddy and the liner was all scrunched up down near the water level! I kept pulling rocks away and the whole freaking north side of the pond liner is like that! I went around to the north side and it's like that too! The whole rim of the $&#&* pond liner is scrunched down like 3 inches! BUT even when I pull all the rocks out and tug the liner up, the very edge of the liner is where the water line *should* be! There's almost NO overlap!! Like the freaking liner is too small!!! Shouldn't it come up to the water line and then over the edge/rim of the pond a few inches to hold it in place!?! Aauugghg!!!! The previous owner paid almost $5000 for this pond around 2000 or 2005 or something! And they didn't even give her a big enough liner!? How expensive would a new liner be and how much time/work would it be to put a new bigger liner in!? If I go all around the pond and pull the current liner up and stack rocks around to keep it up, how long is that going to last like that before it slumps down again!? So disenchanted with this whole thing . . .

I am sorry but glad for your findings you have isolated the issue or one of them , that's the glad part. pictures of what you found would help us long distance viewers help you.

depending on area of effect your cost and time will vary. you could be looking at seam and overlap raise or something simple as rearrange. WE all agree pics and what you found pics will help us a lot to help you

 

[EricV]

There are some photos in post 39. It looks like this pond is completely rocked, Aquascape style. I'd guess you are looking at several days of hard work to pull out all the rocks, drop in a new liner (easy) and put the rocks back.

What probably happened is that they put in the liner and then trimmed it too close to the pond. I'm kind of fighting some of those same issues myself right now. Sometimes dirt can get behind the liner and bulge into the pond, pulling the top down as you're seeing. Should you try to fix this, you might be able to put bricks behind the liner and pull the liner up and over the bricks. This will be a continual process for a while. You'll fix one low area and and then another spot will be the low spot.

Neither option is going to cost a lot of money (liner for your size is a couple hundred buck IIRC) but both are going to take some effort.

 

[Lisak1]

Oh boy. Nothing worse than a "professional" pond that isn't all that professional. But honestly, for $5000 here you'd get a small bubbling boulder - ponds built professionally start at 3 to 4 times that much depending on the size.

Do post some pictures of the trouble areas and let's see what we can all brainstorm for you!

 

[warren]

If you wanted to save your liner you could do like Eric said place blocks behind the liner. To go one step further you could drain enough water that you could basically build a new pond wall inside of the hole you havever making your pond smaller. The smaller poND would make you liner come up further.

 

[EricV]

If you wanted to save your liner you could do like Eric said place blocks behind the liner. To go one step further you could drain enough water that you could basically build a new pond wall inside of the hole you havever making your pond smaller. The smaller poND would make you liner come up further.

Right backfill it enough to move it in. But that will do two things: First, cut into the size of the first shelve (which I assume you have) and second, make you move some large fraction of the rocks in the pond. So also a fair bit of work.

If you do decide to put in a completely new liner, you might want to consider whether you want to put all those rocks back in. There are definitely two camps on that.

 

[Hummingbird2]

*sigh* . . . Ok . . . well I guess I'll try to go ahead and pull the liner up and maybe push it in a little - I don't care if the pond is a little smaller in width or volume or whatever- I'd rather have some liner overlap! But what do I put behind it? Dirt? Sand? Pea gravel? Bigger gravel? Softball-sized rocks? Bigger rocks? A mixture of all of the above?

If I have a couple inches of overlap is there some sort of epoxy or something I can use to glue the overlap to the rim rocks to keep it in place a little better? That probably sounds really stupid . . . What are pond liners even made of? Could I buy a small pond liner and cut it in like 6" strips and somehow attach it to the current liner to add overlap to it?

If I pull up the liner and un-bunch it how long will it be til I have to do it all over again? Is it just gonna shrug down in another year or two?

As for the rocks inside - are you saying you don't have to have rocks inside the pond? I guess the water itself would keep the liner down, but the rocks make it look a little more realistic and give the plants places to anchor and the fish places to hide from my neighborhood egret.

So many questions . . . thanks for putting up with me, guys!

 

[EricV]

I can give you my anecdotal evidence, but would bow to someone with more experience. Put rocks or bricks behind it and then fill in the remaining gaps with soil, not sand rocks. From what I can tell, pea gravel shifts too easily and might bow out the bottom again. Put some rocks on top of the liner too so that it's well sandwiched in between rocks in the pond, rocks in the landscape, and rocks on top of both of those.

Correct, you do not NEED rocks in the pond. I have a couple of medium sized ones in the bottom to keep the liner down just in case (a low water table can push the bottom up). If you like it, great. Plenty of successful ponds seem to be built either way.

As for trying to patch on an extension liner, forget it. You'll have a 40' seam you have to get perfect and keep perfect.

 

[warren]

*sigh* . . . Ok . . . well I guess I'll try to go ahead and pull the liner up and maybe push it in a little - I don't care if the pond is a little smaller in width or volume or whatever- I'd rather have some liner overlap! But what do I put behind it? Dirt? Sand? Pea gravel? Bigger gravel? Softball-sized rocks? Bigger rocks? A mixture of all of the above?

If I have a couple inches of overlap is there some sort of epoxy or something I can use to glue the overlap to the rim rocks to keep it in place a little better? That probably sounds really stupid . . . What are pond liners even made of? Could I buy a small pond liner and cut it in like 6" strips and somehow attach it to the current liner to add overlap to it?

If I pull up the liner and un-bunch it how long will it be til I have to do it all over again? Is it just gonna shrug down in another year or two?

As for the rocks inside - are you saying you don't have to have rocks inside the pond? I guess the water itself would keep the liner down, but the rocks make it look a little more realistic and give the plants places to anchor and the fish places to hide from my neighborhood egret.

So many questions . . . thanks for putting up with me, guys!

I think bricks or cinder blocks with underlayment between the blocks and liner. If you use cinder block you can fill them with dirt and drive rebar in them to anchor them. If you do it correctly you should be able to get years out of it. (As long as the liner is in good shape otherwise ) as far as rocks in the pond that is a personal opinion.

 

[Hummingbird2]

Oooookay . . . here goes nothing . . . Lol!

 

[EricV]

Oooookay . . . here goes nothing . . . Lol!

You're going to try to raise the edges?

 

[Hummingbird2]

Yep . . . I started pulling all the rock and dirt away from the perimeter and pulling the liner up. Got like 2/3 of the way around. Hopefully I can find the time after work this week to get the rest of the way around and then start filling back in. The amount of water loss has already gone down significantly and I haven't even pulled up the south rim yet!