Want to keep my pond above 60F - Zone 6b

[bmitchell486]

Here is a picture of me fishing out my best ranchu in January to check on him. He had a white spot on his wen that turned out to be breeding equipment.

My pond was only 1.5 feet deep that time but I used a small tank heater to deice it.

Wow, he looks great. May be a bit bigger than mine. My concerns were the age of my fish, as well as mine being above ground. I've heard from others that the sides can have trouble freezing, not just the top of the water.

My preference would be to keep them in 60-70 degree water all winter so I can continue feeding/growing them out.

 

[bmitchell486]

Also, @Faebinder you're the first account I'm seeing who has wintered over ranchu outside in a similar zone to mine with a de-icer. I'm glad to know it can be done. When they are nisai, I would like to winter them outside with a de-icer, and I'll just have to monitor the sides to make sure they don't freeze up too. I may put it in the ground by then... you never know.

 

[Nepen]

oh ok, not over stock at all. You know your pond best That's up to you but I think it'll stress them out with that large water change so often. But if you've done it without effect then it's probably nothing to worry about.

 

[Faebinder]

Just curious, why? I have my indoor tank at 70 degree, I do water change once every few months. BUT mine is not overcrowded. What about doing less water change but more often? Actually, how many fish in how many gallon are we talking about anyway.

I dont know what you got in your indoor tank, but if its goldfish and its maxed out then water changes should be 90% weekly at least if the filter established and more if not. Doing less will sooner or later get the goldfish sick as the nitrates and dissolved organics pile up.

 

[bmitchell486]

oh ok, not over stock at all. You know your pond best That's up to you but I think it'll stress them out with that large water change so often. But if you've done it without effect then it's probably nothing to worry about.

Yeah, I hear people who have success and failure with both -- large frequent water changes, and small infrequent/frequent changes. There's lots of right ways to make a pizza, right? But yes, this is working for my guys. I spent time with the breeder as well, and it's close to what he does. I have ways of mitigating significant water temperature differences, and they seem to be doing okay. I have yet to get a reading of nitrates over 5/ppm, and my ammonia/nitrite are always at 0. It gets full sun, so even with the frequent water changes, these guys get to enjoy some green water.

Your chu is SUPER cute too. How many do you keep?

 

[Faebinder]

Also, @Faebinder you're the first account I'm seeing who has wintered over ranchu outside in a similar zone to mine with a de-icer. I'm glad to know it can be done. When they are nisai, I would like to winter them outside with a de-icer, and I'll just have to monitor the sides to make sure they don't freeze up too. I may put it in the ground by then... you never know.

So that ranchu came to me 4.5 inches from Dandy Orandas and I tell you his fish are SOLID... never once gave me problems.... just like my other dandy oranda ranchus. The ranchu I got from an ebay user (whom I dont even know) came in ar 2.5 inches, lived under ice no problems and is now going into its second winter, it's now 4.5 inches... caught up in size in the summer... It was an ugly fish when i got it and now it's actually amazing... red head with a blue body with black-sanke spots. The lionhead I got from another ebay user is huge now (5.5 inches) and i got it at 3.5 inches did extremely well over winter and I even saw it slightly bigger in early spring.

If your fish go in healthy into the winter, you wont have a problem... if they do not, they will have problems. Thing is, there is no guarantee in the winter, you could lose any fish. Hence why people say take them inside for guarantee 100% nothing happens...

What I do is go check on them... if I think a fish is sick I will bring it in for the winter.

 

[bmitchell486]

I dont know what you got in your indoor tank, but if its goldfish and its maxed out then water changes should be 90% weekly at least if the filter established and more if not. Doing less will sooner or later get the goldfish sick as the nitrates and dissolved organics pile up.

I agree. Not to go on the attack -- like I said, there are many good methods. But unless your stocking level is significantly underwhelmed, a small change every few months is likely to lead to high nitrate levels and disease. When you feed, and they poop., it stays in the aquarium until it's removed. Even if you can't see it (it's in the filter) it's still there.

I would advise also experimenting with increasing the frequency of changes. You would want to do smaller percentages, maybe 10-20% each time, so as not to shock the fish. I recommend, regardless of stocking levels, that fancies in aquariums receive a minimum of 50% water changes weekly.

But again, not trying to go on the attack, just wanted to mention it.

 

[bmitchell486]

So that ranchu came to me 4.5 inches from Dandy Orandas and I tell you his fish are SOLID... never once gave me problems.... just like my other dandy oranda ranchus. The ranchu I got from an ebay user (whom I dont even know) came in ar 2.5 inches, lived under ice no problems and is now going into its second winter, it's now 4.5 inches... caught up in size in the summer... It was an ugly fish when i got it and now it's actually amazing... red head with a blue body with black-sanke spots. The lionhead I got from another ebay user is huge now (5.5 inches) and i got it at 3.5 inches did extremely well over winter and I even saw it slightly bigger in early spring.

If your fish go in healthy into the winter, you wont have a problem... if they do not, they will have problems. Thing is, there is no guarantee in the winter, you could lose any fish. Hence why people say take them inside for guarantee 100% nothing happens...

What I do is go check on them... if I think a fish is sick I will bring it in for the winter.

Wow, I'd LOVE to see pictures of your guys. I love the DO fish, and watch the auctions weekly. I have not purchased from them before. These ranchu are from a local breeder.

If you haven't seen them before, check out the ranchus that King Koi Goldfish and Coast Gem USA are importing. They don't have the strict quarantining methods that DO has, so you'll want to QT for a long time. But their prices are also lower and seem to have quality fish.

 

[Faebinder]

Wow, I'd LOVE to see pictures of your guys. I love the DO fish, and watch the auctions weekly. I have not purchased from them before. These ranchu are from a local breeder.
If you haven't seen them before, check out the ranchus that King Koi Goldfish and Coast Gem USA are importing. They don't have the strict quarantining methods that DO has, so you'll want to QT for a long time. But their prices are also lower and seem to have quality fish.

Yeah I have one calico bubble eye and one apache oranda from Coast Gem USA. They have pretty fish. All my pictures are on my phone but I will try to upload them.

In the first picture you will see: the red tancho ranchu from DandyOrandas, the Apache Oranda from CoastGEMUSA, my only koi, two tricolored comets from DandyOrandas, 1 yellow telescope comet from DandyOrandas, red/white common from petsmart, red-white pom pom celestial from goldfishnet, and the rest are hard to tell in the picture. They are all chasing food.

 

[Nepen]

I agree. Not to go on the attack -- like I said, there are many good methods. But unless your stocking level is significantly underwhelmed, a small change every few months is likely to lead to high nitrate levels and disease. When you feed, and they poop., it stays in the aquarium until it's removed. Even if you can't see it (it's in the filter) it's still there.

I would advise also experimenting with increasing the frequency of changes. You would want to do smaller percentages, maybe 10-20% each time, so as not to shock the fish. I recommend, regardless of stocking levels, that fancies in aquariums receive a minimum of 50% water changes weekly.

But again, not trying to go on the attack, just wanted to mention it.

haha that's ok. My tank is not overcrowded. I have a few goldfish here and there, I used to have a few more but I moved them outside. I have my tank for about 5 years now I guess. At first I did weekly water change, but with the water testing I dont see any reason in doing so that frequently. I also stock my tank with lots of plant and they are doing great. No algae. It just works for me like this.

 

[bmitchell486]

haha that's ok. My tank is not overcrowded. I have a few goldfish here and there, I used to have a few more but I moved them outside. I have my tank for about 5 years now I guess. At first I did weekly water change, but with the water testing I dont see any reason in doing so that frequently. I also stock my tank with lots of plant and they are doing great. No algae. It just works for me like this.

Cool! Well, if it isn't broken, don't fix it! Plants, low stocking, good filtration, those all are super important factors. I just personally see dozens of posts a month to other forums/facebook groups I'm a part of, and so many issues arise from high stocking, infrequent water changes, overfeeding, and insufficient filtration. I typically don't say much, because it is perceived as an attack, and people usually aren't interested in changing their methods. They just want to buy a bottle of something to pour in that will magically fix all of their problems

I've got my indoor tank overstocked at the moment... 6, ranging from 2-5 inches, in a 72 gallon. I am a consistent water tester, and have also had great success. It's a stocking level that I wouldn't recommend, however it works for me because of my strict water change schedule.

 

[bmitchell486]

Yeah I have one calico bubble eye and one apache oranda from Coast Gem USA. They have pretty fish. All my pictures are on my phone but I will try to upload them.

Gorgeous!

 

[bmitchell486]

Anyways, as much as I am enjoying this conversation with you guys, I'll try to get this thread on track with my main question now:

Can a sump pump in zone 6b handle consuming my water changes from a 110 pond in my basement all winter? Plan is to siphon water from my pond into the sump hole 2x a week. Looking for first hand accounts of people doing this without issues (like freezing pipes, or sump pump not functioning well in winter for some reason).

 

[Tula]

I would ask your plumber about this for confirmation, but I think it would work fine.....afterall, a sump is designed to remove water. Very pretty fish

 

[Ruben Miranda]

Hello
Can a sump pump in zone 6b handle consuming my water changes from a 110 pond in my basement all winter?

Yes it can or should be able to with no problem.
But you need to find out this info
How many gph is the pump
What size pipe is going out from the sump
Does the sump pump out to a sewer or street or out to a gravel reservoir and then percolate back in to the ground.
Will it freeze. Hummm
Well
If you your basement stays 60 de I doubt it specificly if the pipe is at least 3 feet below ground and below ground freeze.
Another thing since the pipe it self is not full of water and is,bigger then 3" it should not freeze solid at most only the water at the bottom of the pipe will freeze. And that will melt when you pour warmer water down.

Of course the above all depends if everything was installed right to begin with.

But again unless the water is not draining at all it should not freeze solid.

Ruben