clarity issues in aus

[jayke]

ive recently constructed a pond for native turtles and fish, prior to this ive been into my native fish and planted fish tanks.
my pond is 9000L and 80cm deep. the pond is only lightly stoked with 4 eastern long neck turtles 1 koi/goldfish and 5 aussie bass. for now all i have been able to afford for filtration is a pond one stingray 15000 pump and pond one 15000 uv pressure filter. so far there is only a hand full of plants in the pond soon to be quite alot.
the pond did have sand on the bottom but i was having water clouding issues so i removed about 700kg of the sand and used it for the basking areas around the pond for the turtles.
ive joined this forum because i seem to have water clouding issues my water is never clear i can never see the bottom and would appreciate whatever help i can get on improving this.
ive been considering upgrading my filtration and circulation however before i make the leap i wanted some advice, i was considering upgrading my filter to either a aquael super maxi 25000l filter and matching that with the corresponding pump with a T joint in the pump line so half the flow goes into the filter and half boosts circulation because from what ive read the filter is suited to max 12000 LPH. i have also been considering constructing a skippy or my own larger bio filter and possibly a 36w uvc.

 

[Smaug]

Having sand in the pond it may take quite awhile to clear up. I had that issue with a planted tank using sand.

 

[MitchM]

Cloudy water is not a bad condition.
It provides shelter for your fish and depending on what it is made up of, will keep your water quality healthy.
I suspect though, that with koi and turtles you will always have constant disturbance of any substrate.
If you want completely clear water, you may need to remove all the substrate, but then that is not an ideal environment for your koi and turtles.

 

[Smaug]

Cloudy water is not a bad condition.
It provides shelter for your fish and depending on what it is made up of, will keep your water quality healthy.
I suspect though, that with koi and turtles you will always have constant disturbance of any substrate.
If you want completely clear water, you may need to remove all the substrate, but then that is not an ideal environment for your koi and turtles.

I agree as long as it's particulate ,a cloudiness that appears milky as bacterial and definetly a problem.

 

[MitchM]

If it is a bacterial bloom, then aeration and water circulation will help the bacteria process their nutrients as quickly as possible, but that goes more toward pond design in general.
If the floating matter is DOC then the DOC will adsorb heavy metals, which is good, but bacteria will still be needed to break down the DOC..which gets us back to good aeration in the first place.
If an algae bloom is the result from floating organic matter, an UV sterilizer will help keep the water clear. The nutrients that were available for the algae will still need to be removed though.

 

[jayke]

It's kind of a caramel brown so I think the substrate disturbance with a bit of doc floating around. I'll see what I can do this week. Thank you

 

[Meyer Jordan]

Any substrate finer than gravel is not appropriate in a pond that houses Koi if water clarity is important. Koi (Carp) are, by nature, bottom feeders and will 'root' around in any substrate, stirring up any trapped detritus and placing it in suspension. Hence, turbid water. Gravel would be a much better choice of substrate, if you desire to have such.

 

[jayke]

I'll have to try the some river gravel 40mm-50mm and some larger ones mixed with some calgrit

 

[Smaug]

No substrate at all would be even better. The only thing it really does in an artificial pond is collect detritus.

 

[Dave 54]

Any substrate finer than gravel is not appropriate in a pond that houses Koi if water clarity is important. Koi (Carp) are, by nature, bottom feeders and will 'root' around in any substrate, stirring up any trapped detritus and placing it in suspension. Hence, turbid water. Gravel would be a much better choice of substrate, if you desire to have such.

Whilst I totally agree with you about the substrata Meyer I simply cannot see one koi/Goldfish making all that mess my friend [the description of koi/goldfish is confusing, if he has a koi yes they are bottom feeding , goldfish however are mid water feeders].
Jayke are you in a state where its legal to keep koi its, the description of koi/goldfish being a bit of a confusing description your giving here .
We do not know what habitat the Turtles native to Australia prefare [more than probably sand hense it being there in the first place].
However I am not a fan of anything on the bottom of the pond where koi are involved other than a bottom drain.
I kept koi with gravel for 22 years until ill health forced the move outdoors it was the cleaning of the gravel on a monthly basis that finally forced the move as the pain I suffered leg wise standing up for the 4.5 hours it took me to finish the job .
Whilst not defending the lone koi/goldfish the OP says he has in the pond we also have to look at the Australian Bass to see how much in the way of mess they themselves produce, non of us have ever kept Austalian Bass in a pond enviroment to be able to comment fully on this.
Thus we need this information form the OP themselves before we can comment fully on the matter .

Dave

 

[Dave 54]

No substrate at all would be even better. The only thing it really does in an artificial pond is collect detritus.

I totally agree Smaug no substrata being the better of the two options fitting a bottom drain first would have been even better though

Dave

 

[jayke]

Whilst I totally agree with you about the substrata Meyer I simply cannot see one koi/Goldfish making all that mess my friend [the description of koi/goldfish is confusing, if he has a koi yes they are bottom feeding , goldfish however are mid water feeders].
Jayke are you in a state where its legal to keep koi its, the description of koi/goldfish being a bit of a confusing description your giving here .
We do not know what habitat the Turtles native to Australia prefare [more than probably sand hense it being there in the first place].
However I am not a fan of anything on the bottom of the pond where koi are involved other than a bottom drain.
I kept koi with gravel for 22 years until ill health forced the move outdoors it was the cleaning of the gravel on a monthly basis that finally forced the move as the pain I suffered leg wise standing up for the 4.5 hours it took me to finish the job .
Whilst not defending the lone koi/goldfish the OP says he has in the pond we also have to look at the Australian Bass to see how much in the way of mess they themselves produce, non of us have ever kept Austalian Bass in a pond enviroment to be able to comment fully on this.
Thus we need this information form the OP themselves before we can comment fully on the matter .

Dave

To be honest he was sold to me as a feeder fish for the turtles and they never ate him. So I can only the assume he's a gold fish. It's perfectly okay to keep them as long as they are not released. However there are many illegal ones in some local water ways that are almost 3ft long. I'll get some pics of those for you all too. My turtles are eastern long neck turtles. They tend to be more carnivorous than the short necks and tend to leave plants alone,the also make they're nests in sady river banks etc. natural turtle environment for these guys can range from sand bottoms to rivers and creeks with smoothed stone and plenty of aquatic plants and fallen logs and the environment for the bass is the same. the Aussie bass is very similar to say a Redfin perch. Predatory ambush hunter and excellent sport. They feed on Freshwater shrimp, frogs, small fish and insects etc. may also pick at the bottom but no where near the amount of a gold fish.
So far from what I've seen the 36w would be the cheapest upgrade being about $189. The current one built into the pressure filter is only 15w so maybe I'll start there.

 

[Dave 54]

still cannot see one fish picking at the bottom causing the issues your talking about .
One question your turtles being carniverous and all how much in the way of poo do they pass after a meal I remember my sliders being rather messy .
Believe it or not there are UV-C's out there that are far less at 9 w that will do the same job as the 36w Tetra are one of the companies that do them just to give you an idea of whats on the market US wise :-

http://www.pondparts.com/Ultraviolet-Sterilizers-c-724.html

It might give you other ideas about UV-C's who knows , however we love our 36 watt aquapond UV-C it does the job.

Dave

 

[jayke]

i can find the replacement bulb in aus but not the actual uvc could be costly with the shipping for warranty.so today i replaced my 13w uvc bulb and cleaned the sleeve time will tell

 

[jayke]

Here's the colour of my water