Let's talk Edging a Liner pond.

[ADHDiy_Guy]

Call me weird i love the moss on the retaining wall , While Greg Wittstock loves his turtles i lovum my moss.

I won’t show pictures of my moss “platters” from the moss I have harvested over the last couple months... I have 3-4 tote lids full of moss at any given time, and I’m not an expert but I believe I have 6 different types of moss growing right now?

The retaining walls are north facing, and I irrigate the hill above the wall so the runoff keeps it fairly moist throughout summer and the moss thrives there.

 

[GBBUDD]

I won’t show pictures of my moss “platters” from the moss I have harvested over the last couple months... I have 3-4 tote lids full of moss at any given time, and I’m not an expert but I believe I have 6 different types of moss growing right now?

The retaining walls are north facing, and I irrigate the hill above the wall so the runoff keeps it fairly moist throughout summer and the moss thrives there.

i could never even begin to contemplate counting the different types of moss i have around the pond . I wouldn't even be close to getting an accurate number. heres why if you haven't seen it yet

 

[ADHDiy_Guy]

i could never even begin to contemplate counting the different types of moss i have around the pond . I wouldn't even be close to getting an accurate number. heres why if you haven't seen it yet

Oh, I have watched your videos several times before I joined this forum haha. It’s a great inspiration, and fantastic that you were able to do it at the scale you did.

 

[GBBUDD]

Oh, I have watched your videos several times before I joined this forum haha. It’s a great inspiration, and fantastic that you were able to do it at the scale you did.

I have always enjoyed building things i am a builder and have been involved in many different projects.
my second but only in a list is nature Love exploring and seeing what nature has and can create. so when i got to combine the two it was a home run for me.
Thanks for the praise i set the stage and let nature take it from there

 

[Lisak1]

@ADHDiy_Guy - just watched your whole edging video. Very relaxing to watch, which means I think you're doing it right. haha! Nothing worse than watching someone explain how to do it WRONG.

If I were going to suggest ANYTHING - and this is simply personal preference - I would suggest two things:

1. An EPDM liner is INFINITELY easier to deal with than a preform. You did a great job of explaining how you dug for your installation, but imagine if you didn't have to worry about a pre-determined size, shape, depth, solid flat base, etc. Also - and this again is from years of reading here and the experience of others... your mileage may vary - these preforms are destined to crack eventually. They will heave and settle and depend upon the base never shifting. I don't know where you're located, but here in zone 5 we'd be lucky to get two seasons out of a preform. I say this not so much for you - since obviously you're past this decision - but for any future pond builder who will watch this. For a tiny pond like this you may even find someone who built a big pond and has scrap liner they'd like you to take off their hands. (Please scroll up to see my "lots of liner" photo. I tried for several years to get rid of the large amount of scrap we had left over. Eventually we just used it in another water feature in our front yard, but it haunted me in the meantime!)

2. Again - simply personal preference, but I would continue the flagstone steppers instead of the blocks - they look more natural and I think would blend better with your AMAZING water gardens.

Feel free to ignore me - just some woman on the internet. What does she know?!?

 

[GBBUDD]

Feel free to ignore me - just some woman on the internet. What does she know?!?

I'M SURROUNDED..... @ADHDiy_Guy i have tried to ignore her for years ! coming up on a decade actually so good luck with that!!!! she has an occasional point TOO OFTEN...... and you well looks like your going to be even harder to ignore with that outfit and shades. I wrote simiar to @Lisak1 post on you tube butt i deleted it. ONE flaw that i have seen over and over with such is they crack as mentioned or they collapse as the water is pulled out if too much so is pulled out the pressure can and will fold up the bucket easily. as @Lisak1 also knows as a professionally made pump vault deigned for the same ideas your skimmer was crushed over time.
I'm all for diy as we would all still be living under a rock if we hadn't. But i am a bigger fan of listening to history of failures that others have had.

i get it with keeping the entire skimmer in the pond. i have talked about digging trenches and pits under the liner so main drains, pipes and even lilly pot depressions can be placed in depressions that can be hidden in the pond with rock no penetrations and more so nothing is visible and everything is contained.

 

[Lisak1]

Haha! You know you love it @GBBUDD. And as you also know when the flaws are practically non-existent in a build it all comes down to personal preference. @ADHDiy_Guy needs no help from me - he’s got the pond touch!

My MIL bought us a preform 35 years ago - never even attempted to use it as the downsides were too obvious to me. My neighbor has one in a raised bed garden - I think he’s on his 4th or 5th. He keeps asking my opinion BUT HE WONT TAKE MY ADVICE!

The smart ones listen…

 

[ADHDiy_Guy]

@Lisak1

I 100% agree that an EPDM liner pond is superior for longevity, flexibility, and many other reasons. It might sound a bit ridiculous, but I built my ponds with the intention that they would be replaced and expanded with a larger EPDM liner pond in the next 2 years.

This year I just needed to get water in the yard, and I wanted to like what I saw in the meantime! It also helped that I got both preformed pond liners for my features for a combined cost of $40… when I add pumps, lights, mulch, pea gravel, and all other costs, I am all in under $300 so far.

 

[ADHDiy_Guy]

@GBBUDD aside from the fact that this might not be the place to discuss the skimmer since this thread is about edging techniques that’s an interesting point about the skimmers collapsing under the water pressure when getting drained out with the pond still full of water, but in those cases I have to imagine there is a big difference in water pressure between 8” deep and 18”-24” deep of water for some of the other DIY styles I have seen. There is also a significant different in the strength of a circlular trash can vs. a rectangle shape like some of the totes people will use.

The last thing I will say about it that makes me think my design should be okay is that I have it covered with a faux rock thing, so it won’t break down over time under UV exposure. I will keep an eye out for signs of weakening, nonetheless.

 

[Lisak1]

but I built my ponds with the intention that they would be replaced and expanded with a larger EPDM liner pond in the next 2 years.

Oh I love hearing this news! You’ll build a killer pond for sure!

 

[GBBUDD]

Skimmers are definately part of dressing up and hiding your liner be it in or out of the liner.
I wish I never heard most people have 3 pond a pond a bigger pond and yet a bigger pond still. If I had started much smaller I would have been able to put what I learned in my first build to work for me. And God only knows what I would have come up with.
But I'll have to give that knowledge to another as I have been collecting rock stumps and moss for a pond build down the street from me. Time will tell.
Trust me this site is not so organized you can't go topic. I'm probably more guilty of that than anyone. They never taught me social media edicate.

 

[GBBUDD]

Not sure where to put this figured why not here it's open andbits in decorating hiding the liner.
I have been asked over and over about how in the world did I get such big tree stumps into my pond area. Did I use equipment? Did I buy them and have them installed. Nope, nope, and nope.

I look for stumps which most do ,have the center of the tree is dead and has been attacked by termites and even other bug known to man.
In the picture below is a stump in the condition I search for. Could I take a chain saw and cut the stump

into pieces yes I supose I could but it's hard to hide cuts from a chain saw even if they are vertical cuts.
So my weapon of choice is a Sawzall with a bunch of long wood cutting blades. I check the stump and see where I can cut that will hide the best. What will not cut off any roots and yes will be the easiest if possible.
Cut the stump into pieces/ sections the further they need to be carried out of the woods the smaller the pieces get. This stump was cut in half to fit in the hatch back.

 

[GBBUDD]

I found it! My "lots of liner" picture! I would challenge anyone to try and hide THIS:
View attachment 160150


OK, now for my "favorite edge" picture... I'm gonna show you my naked pond. This was early on when my plants were still babies. Like I mentioned, our goal was a low edge, which means all the shelves had to be properly dug so the rocks would be low enough in the water but not TOO low. Every rock was a bit of up/down/up again to get the depth right and leave enough height to fold the liner up behind the rock on the land side and conceal it. No liner showing anywhere was the extremely important to me.

Favorite spot? That big rock that is right to the left of that clump of dead reeds near the bottom of the picture. That rock looks like it overhangs the pond, but it's actually perfectly fitted to the shelf below it so it is 100% stable and a great spot to stand and feed the fish or sit your bottom down and drop your feet in the water.


View attachment 160151

My self i ,love how the pond/ waterfall cut right through the retaining wall. the stair to the right leading up to the upper area. even if it does not lead to a walk way or a sitting area it leaves the mind with a question what is up that way it invites imagination and when you do this to the viewer you have succeeded in making the mind interact with your pond.

 

[ADHDiy_Guy]

Good eye, yeah there is another small pond and stream that I put in last Oct/Nov, but it’s currently under edge-struction because some recent heavy rainfall has identified some areas that flood muddy water into the stream. The yard has been in a constant state of change since last October and that pond is waiting for a lot of perennials to wake up still.

Here are some winter photo’sView attachment 167409View attachment 167410

Now that summer is here I wanted to post updated pictures to show how my “first season” pond has been growing in. It’s pretty amazing how the plants have softened up the edges and given so much more depth to the space overall.

I had used a lot of principles for planting the edges of a flexible liner pond and adapted them with my rigid liners - I.e. (1) planting “like” plants inside and outside the liner to make it appear as seamless as possible, (2) having pea gravel “planting pockets” inside the liner and in the water, but behind larger rocks or wood that draw your eyes inside the pond and away from the liner, and (3) using ground cover like creeping Jenny planted in the soil outside the liner and spilling over into the water, those stems are now throwing roots down in the water.

You can see I use a lot of incorporated driftwood and hardscape to draw the appearance of an “edge” away from the water. You see this with the dry creek bed, as well as with the “fallen driftwood” that leads back behind the ‘urban decay’ pot on its side as if those branches fell from the tree above and came to rest there.

Last point, with the wood branches I had placed inside the water, I used the gaps between where the branches would fork as if they were slots to hold plants in place. I tucked the bare roots down inside those gaps, but in a way that the body of the plant would be resting on the branches to keep the “crown” or base of the stems just above water level. This adds a very cool element of wood branches poking out of your plants, and I see my fish nibbling on the roots as a snack all the time.

 

[ADHDiy_Guy]

Also, I really like driftwood and foraging. Here are some of the driftwood pieces I have brought home from our adventures. Where I live, it’s legal to collect driftwood from public parks and nature areas as long as you don’t use motorized tools like chainsaws, or dolly’s/carts, and there is a limit of 3 cubic feet per person, per day. I don’t have any pictures of these pieces strapped to my Stand Up Paddleboard, but it’s a funny sight to see.