Please help....

[annmar414]

Can anyone identify what this is on my koi? I will provide more information in next post in a few minutes....I've typed it a few times and computer keeps clearing it away...

 

[annmar414]

My koi is a 4 year old koi, who lives in a 165 pond in our yard with 2 other koi and 3 goldfish. None of the other fish are showing any signs of whatever this is. We originally took him out of the pond several days ago and placed him in a 10 gallon tank to treat him for what we though was fin rot, as part of his fin was ripped and this white stuff that looked fuzzy was on it. We used Jungle Clear Fungus Clear. (We had also placed some Melafix in the pond a few days before removing him). However, by the next day he started developing this whitish/pinkish stuff on his fins, and then his body and since yesterday morning it has started spreading onto his face and partially onto an eye. I have never seen this before and while I searched online I never really found information that could give me much to go on in terms of what it is and what treatment would be. I know that there is no guarantee of an answer, but hoping somebody might be able to give me some advice. He is still in the tank, as I don't want to put him back in the pond in case this is contagious. He is very healthy otherwise, swimming around, eating and what not. Seems a bit agitated in the tank, but I imagine a lot of that has to do with being in an enclosed tank after being used to the pond, and not having his plants or buddies with him.

Water quality
* Ammonia Level (pond): 0
* Nitrite Level (pond): 0
* Ammonia Level (tap water): not sure, will test later
* Nitrite Level (tap water): not sure, will test later
* Ph Level, pond (If possible, KH, GH and chlorine): 8.2, KH-180, GH-between 150 and 300
* Ph Level, tap water (If possible, KH, GH and chlorine): not sure, will test later
* Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops?: API freshwater test kit drops & Jungle Quick Dip to get the KH and GH

 

[GreatDanesDad]

I have never seen anything quite like this, but the below informaton has helped me when working with a friends pond that had other issues, as well as a few fish sick that were caught at the local golf course.

http://jnfkoifarms.com/symptomsofkoi.html

Hightlights from the article.

Get a heater and slowly start heating the water in the tank to above 82 degrees. (my pond here in phoenix is 90-92 degrees, just make sure you have lots O2 in the water. Air-stones or waterfall or whatever) Second start adding "pond salt" to the water. It is the number one ingrediant to a healthy slim coat. Third, since he is eating, utilize a good antibiotic food.

Like I said, I dont know what exactly this is, nor am I trying to say I am an Koi Vet, but these simple things cure so many different problems and are not harmful to even a healthy fish.

Also, I would recomend adding a dose of salt to your pond and feeding the antibiotic food to the remaining fish as good measure.

Good luck. I am sure many people will have other great advice, I think the above is just a very good starting point.

 

[annmar414]

Thanks for the link. I will take any help I can get. Of all my indoor and outdoor fish I've had this one the longest and don't want to see anything happen to him. As soon as my husband gets home tonight to help me, we will install the heater on the tank and start some salt treatment. Is there a brand of antibiotic food you recommend? We've never had to use it before and from what I can tell we don't have any at the pet stores near us, so I'll have to order online.

 

[Mmathis]

Welcome, but sorry it's under these circumstances!

We have a member here, Dave54 who is well-versed in fish ailments. Hopefully he will chime in!

And THANK YOU so much for posting your water stats!

 

[bettasngoldfish]

I can't advise on treatment but I do want to say I hope your fish recovers quickly.

The only other thing I want to add is that I would do a water change on the pond just for good measure : )

And it's great that you were able to move your fish to a quarantine tank but it might be easier on you and better for your fish if you can use something larger. I have used rubbermaid storage bins for temporary housing for fish. They work great as far as giving you a larger volume of water for the bigger fish, they are cheap, filters, airstones, heaters etc can be used with them and when not in use they can be used to store extra fish supplies. Just something to think about especially if your fish is kinda freaked in the glass tank.

 

[bettasngoldfish]

This is where I buy my medicated food: http://www.goldfishconnection.com/shop/listing.php?parentId=5

 

[GreatDanesDad]

After reading that link again, and looking at the fish, it does not appear to be ulcers, but something growing on him. It is possible that the heat will encourage the growth of what ever it is that is bothering your baby. I do still recommend heating the water, but I would add salt over three days as the page recommends and then give him a day or two to get his slime coat beefed up before heating the water. As for food, I used this simply because it is easy to get and i could order online and have it expidited.

http://www.amazon.com/Medi-Koi-Medi...376679161&sr=8-1&keywords=antibiotic+koi+food

I would be very interested in hearing from Dave54 as well.

 

[annmar414]

Thanks for the links. I think we will get some food ordered. In case it is something that the other fish may have caught, do you think I should feed it to the other fish in the pond, too?

**nevermind....just reread above where the suggestion to feed the other fish was made.

 

[capewind]

I really dont know but makes me think of carp pox ... Ive just never seen a picture as bad as this poor kid ,,,,

 

[annmar414]

When doing all my searching yesterday and more today, I had come across a picture of carp pox that looks similar, but from everything I read, it said that carp pox is really rare, but there is a chance it could be coldwater Ick. However, I could not find any pictures, descpriptions or treatment info about coldwater ick. My indoor goldies has ick a few years ago and that looked nothing like this. I'm going to keep searching, hopefully I'll find something. But until then I'll try the heat and salt.

 

[Dave 54]

Weve never come across anything quite like this before but will give it a shot , we think what we are seeing here is a condition called Epistylis its either that or a severe fungal infection .
It isnt koi pox as the water at this time of year is quite wam still and you only really see the pox bellow 10c downwards.....I also doubt its the ick or ich as the fins would be clamped up for this..
Do you have access to a microscope if so you are looking for a small bell shaped protazoan if it is this condition it is also in the advanced stages of.
Epistylis is not likely to occur bellow 12c but is very active the higher the temperature goes
Treating it with Melafix just won't cut it, you can however use a salt bath to try bring things under control
The salt both should be made u as follows it should be used at a rate of per 4.5 litres or 3.5 ounces pergallon and should be timed at 10 minutes per bath,this is important remember koi are fresh water fish and too much salt can kill them.
You should bathe the koi at this rate and this time , it should be treated on three consecutive days......
An off the shelf parasite treat ment or just Malachite green the dose rate as per strenght of the solution ...
I hate asking this next question as it marks you out as a bit of a bad koi keeper but plese dont take offence in me asking them so when was the last time you cleaned out your filter and did regular water changes please?
With many problems like this inproved koi husbandry and filter maintenance, water changes etc can help prevent this infection.
Please remember i have never come across a koi in this condition before now I can only try to match things up to what I see..
1) Can you tell me the following is the skin of the koi becoming redder as this infection spreads ?.
2) Are any of the scales on this koi starting to lift ?.
3) When did you first notice this ifection ?.
4) Have your koi spawn lately this may be how the infection took hold as koi become battered during their mating process ?.
5) How old is your water testing kits as it may be giving the wrong readings ?.
Best of luck with this infection and if anyone else out there thinks they know the answer they can try giving it a shot at identification and treatment..
I've tried to the best of my abilities at identifying this koi's problem I may however be wrong.and I stress that........ but if what I've described fits what you are seeing please go ahead and treat.


rgrds


Dave

 

[Mmathis]

Be sure to add extra aeration to his tank. It looks like his gill covers have this "stuff" on them and that may make it harder for him to breathe -- he needs all the help he can get.

 

[annmar414]

We have a filter in the tank and an air stone, so hopefully this helps with breathing. This morning his fins are clamped to his body, so now I'm more worried. We did heat the water up to about 78...wondering if we should lower it.

Dave,
Thanks for the information. When I first noticed him in the pond, I thought fungus too, so brought him in and treated him with Jungle Fungus Clear. The spots on his fin didn't go away, it got worse. Will the Malachite Green work differently? I do have some of that in the house, its labeled Wardley Ick, with main ingredient as malachite green. I had that from previous indoor fish that I thought had ick.
I do not have access to a microscope.

No offense taken. I will do whatever I can to help this guy. The pond filter was cleaned about 2 weeks before ago and then again the day that we caught him and brought him in. We clean it every 2 to 3 weeks or so. This year we are seeing a lot more green stringy algae in the pond, though the nitrites, nitrates and ammonia still read non-existant or low.

1. From what I can tell, the only place redness is occurring is on the fins underneath the white stuff. Then there is some redness, mainly showing as streaks or veins.
2. No raised scales from what I can see.
3. We first noticed it on his tail about 3 weeks ago. It stayed on just his tail until we brought him in to treat him.
4. Yes, we had what we believe was spawning. Lot several females to it. Lots of aggressive chasing and trying to flip each other out of the water.
5. Just bought my newest water testing kit about 2 weeks ago. Expiration is 2018.

Thanks so much for your help, even if you can't be 100% sure, I still appreciate it, since I have no idea what it is.
~Ann

 

[annmar414]

Also, I don't know if this helps any, but we've had a colder than normal summer, with temps only in the high 50s to low 70s on a normal basis, so my pond water did not get as warm as it usually does.