Submersible vs. External pumps....

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i have 2 submersibles in my pond one runing my skippy thats 1000 gph terta pump.
i have a pre-filter on it , i did what u guys and gals told me to do i took the sponge
filter off the cage part and iam useing a mesh bag over the cage, so far 3 weeks
its been good it dont get cloged but the other day i was doing a water change
and i was bored so i took out the cage and i rised it. i have a 1 inch hose runing
from the pre filter to the pump and a 1 inch hose from the pump to the skippy.
and the other pump i have is a small 400 gph runing my uv light i also have a home made cage with mesh bag which i have not cleaned yet but its pumping good..
 
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koikeepr said:
I would not do a 32 foot run to a 5' high waterwafall with a sumbersible. And then a 100g stock tank to boot. What you're describing is external pump territory.

Also, check the stats on the externals. Some that push the same gallons per hour produce much more force and therefore have much more head capacity.
 
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I have an external or as we call them in line pumps they are fine and tough as old boots I've twice had it jammed with k1 filter media and red hot but once cleared it was good to go, it supplys a 1,000 galon pond and is an Oase 3500 if you remember to put two ball valves either end of the pipe work it can be isolated and taken out without a problem for maintenance.
I have a submersable on our purpose built QT pond supplying its built in filter, 15 watt kockney koi U/V-C and venturi pumping 500 gallons or there abouts per hour .
Personally I'd plumb for the iline external .

rgrds

Dave
 
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lol Dave he posted in 2010
Well never mind if he's rigged his pump the wrong way at least I've pointed out a way to remove and maintain his pump thats if he didnt go submersible you live and learn addy I just though hey this is an interesting post didnt look at the date :D :D :D

rgrds

Dave
 

Mmathis

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lol Dave he posted in 2010
LOL! I just Googled "submerged vs external" based on a current thread, and this oldie popped up. I did get a chuckle at both of your replies, @addy1 and @Dave 54. In fact, there was one post that I was going to reference in a new thread and ask a question about, but I'll come back to that later.
 

sissy

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I like submerged because i don't have to pull it but the external have the advantage of a clean out basket .I look more at energy cost and head height than anything
 
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You will get many opinions on this subject. I have had both submersibles and now externals, so I can speak about my experience with both.

You don't mention how long your pipe runs are, how big your pipes will be, your filtration, etc to give you a good figure on what kinda pump you'd ned. But just based on the info you've provided, I would not get something smaller than 4000-4500 gph.

Submersible:

Positives:
1. Submersibles are great because you just toss 'em in the water and plug it in. Very simple and easy.
2. Great for smaller ponds
3. Can be cheaper, but once they push large gph, they tend to mirror prices of externals.
4. Quiet

Negatives:

1. Have to get your hands wet to maintain them, and potentially receive an electric shock. Uncommon, but it happens. It's often not easy fishing a submersible full of water outta the pond, particularly from an underground pond. It was a back-breaker for me, as the cage was all full of water.
2. Clogs with debris inside pond and need to be frequently cleaned. Putting them up on bricks so they don't sit directly on the pond floor can help here.
3. usually not as efficient from a energy consumption perspective as external
4. If it gets clogged, the pump can float up and begin dumping water outta the pond. It happened to me several times, and left me with inches of water and nearly lost the fish had I not caught it in time. One time I was on vacation, which was not pleasant. A few leaves had fallen into the pond and gotten sucked around the cage, causing it to float up. Had I not had the pump on a brick, it would have certainly left the pond dry. (so, if going with a submersible, DO NOT put it on the pond floor). However, one time it tipped over and the fish were flopping on the pond floor. So make sure you secure your pump.

External:

Positive:

1. Sits outside the pond, so it's dry hands maintenance. No need to get in there and fetch it outta the water. You can clearly see what is happening with the pump visually at all times.
2. Very energy efficient and can deal with head more effectively. Good for larger ponds of 2,000+ gallons
3. Quiet
4. Has a leaf trap in front of it so debris is stopped before getting to the pump and grinding it to smithereens and sending it to the filter/pump. This fact also protects the pump from damage.
5. Can deal with head more effectively. Long pipe runs, very high waterfalls, etc. Externals are made to push water, which submersibles are good at sucking water.

Negatives:

1. Can be more expensive upfront, but you usually make up for that with lower wattage use pretty quickly. A larger submersible such as you would need, will likely be very close in cost however.
2. This is not typically plug and play like a submersible. You need to think about piping and how it will lay out. The pump will also need to be below water line so that it can receive flooded suction and be gravity fed. [I don't really consider this a negative, but I guess someone who was intimidated by this fact would).
3. If the pump isn't below waterline, you have to deal with priming it. And it's just not the most effective use of the pump. [Again, I don't consider this a negative, because a priming pot/leaf trap in front solves this with a check valve in the water.]
4. Typically has to be protected from direct weather. Needs to be covered with something, but still receive air circulation. Also, put it on a cinderblock to prevent it from getting flooded in a rain storm.

Also, in regard to an external and the fear folks have about either popping a hole in the side of their liner or using a bottom drain (weather retro or standard), if you can gravity feed a barrel or stock tank--the external can feed directly from that. The pump does not know where water line is. That is, if waterline is the pond or a barrel.

I'm sure others will give you different opinions from people that have had experiences with both externals and submersibles as well. For me, having used both of these types of pumps, the external wins hands down. It's just been way easier for me to maintain, has been gentler on my electric bill, and they have more power to push through pipe runs, waterfalls, filters, UV's, etc and the whole mangle of filtration. I certainly could not have a sumbersible doing what my external does. And I haven't had to deal with a tipped over, clogged pump again.

That's just one opinion. I'm sure you'll get others.
 
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This is a very smart post. I've been selling pumps for 17 or 18 years now, and almost all customers buy submersible ones, as they are just cheaper. But I agree that inline pumps are much more convenient once they are installed. After all, they are not in the pond! I also noted questions about reliability of different pumps on here. I must tell you, most of us sell pumps coming from one factory in China. It's a good factory, and huge, and we "brand" the pumps. Also, I do get a kick out of customers paying too much attention to "exact" gallons per hour readings from pumps, as unless they are tested in U.S., I find the gph estimates coming out of China tend to be exaggerated. I'm attaching an article on pumps in case anyone cares.
 

sissy

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I go on energy efficiency .If your electric bill goes through the roof ,that is not good .I have my sub. pumps tied to pipes that lay across my pond ,easy to pull the pipe to me and clean the pump .The only bad thing about external is that you have to take them in or build a special room to house everything .Plus I prefer to have everything inside the liner ,it leaks no big deal it runs right back into the pond .Less worry for me .
 
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The best prices on sequence is usually webbs online. Plan out your pipe run and elevations and call MDM who makes sequence. When you ask for tech support you will get Brian Moldenado who is a great, competent and helpful guy who will size your pump requirement for you. You need pipe diameter and length, the number of 90 and 45 degree turns, and the height above the pump you plan to pump water. He will compute the head pressure. Then it's just a matter of picking the pump size. We bought a sequence 750/4200 for our first pond and it's still running after 15 years. The only hassle with it is the propeller size. It tends to trap thin pin oak leaves and clog up. Not hard to clean. The larger pumps don't have that problem. These pumps are not self priming and must be mounted below the water line. If the basket top Is level with the water line, you are fine. If it's two feet below, you will have a fountain when you take the basket lid off. Make sure you valve the input and output and mount with unions to be able to remove the pump for maintenance.
 
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@Murf THIS POST IS YEARS OLD 5 YEARS SINCE ANYONE POSTED HERE
 

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