First time ponder- feedback and suggestions welcome!

[lauraleellbp]

Hello everyone!

I'm an avid aquarist and have kept aquariums since I was a child, but this is my very first time building a pond, or dealing with volumes of water larger than my 90gal tank! lol

I've been doing quite a bit of homework before my shovel ever even hits the dirt, though, and here's my plan so far- feedback and suggestions are definitely welcome!

The plan is a 400gal pond, about 5' x 7' oval, 3' deep in the middle, with a plant ledge running all around the edge. I want to heavily plant it out (I live in SW Florida so plan to over-winter fish and plants in the pond) and am considering sticking with native plants and fish. That stocking plan may change down the road, but I definitely will not be stocking koi and probably no goldfish either. Here's the site for the pond- tucked underneath this bay window (that's my home office)

Here's the things I know for sure:

I'll be digging this pond out by hand, lining it with a 45mil EPDM liner with an underlayment, and a building in a bottom drain (probably a 3" Koi Toilet with a strainer/grate on top). I want a small waterfall in the back right corner, and will probably use one of those biofilter waterfalls (looking at the Laguna and Atlantic ones). The fall won't be tall, though- 12-24" high at most. I plan on using 1.5" to 2" flex tubing for plumbing since I'm working in such a tight space and will have lots of corners to get around. I want to use an external pump, and am thinking around 2000gph would be good turnover for this size pond??

It's the filtration and plumbing design that I keep debating over. Though I won't have a high bioload, I know from keeping planted aquariums that plants are very messy, plus our yard is full of pine trees so pine needles will be a problem, so I know that mechanical filtration will be quite important. Because of this, I'm leaning towards using a skimmer/mechanical filter, plumbing a bottom drain into that skimmer/filter, run the skimmer to the external pump, and then the pump to the waterfall.

I came across and really like this all-in-one Laguna skimmer/filter http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350391625803&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT, but I DON'T like the price tag so am trying to work out a comparable DIY.

The super cheap pool skimmers I can find on Ebay keep catching my attention, but I need to find a way to incorporate more mechanical filtration behind one before sending water to my pump. The big hangup is that I have so little space to work with, and also not much height to work with either if I try and gravity-feed a skimmer to a separate tub-style filter.

Has anyone ever DIYed one of these skimmers actually into a tub-style filter?

Also, any recommendations on an external filter that won't break the bank? Lowes has a 2000gph external filter for $100 right now, but I'm guessing that one won't be the greatest as far as quality. I'd like to stay under the $150 range for the pump if possible.

 

[hewhoisatpeace]

Hey, there.

$150 for a new external pump might be tough. 2000 gph on an 800g pond is a bit much, though. With an external pump, though, you'd need a leaf basket/priming pot (good mechanical filtration). I'd suggest looking at the DIY section of the site, and building your own filterfalls. Liner idea is great. Go with 2" flex, easier on your pump. Buy a pump with at least 3 yr warranty. Warranty = useful life of pump often. Invest more in your pump now for less on repairs and power consumption. Laguna is pretty good stuff, but pricey. Most good stuff is. Good luck with the project, you can check out mine at my signature link (800g is what I started out to build)

 

[addy1]

Sounds like you have put a lot of thought into your pond. doodad sells some equipment, he maybe able to help you with some good prices.

That will be a great spot for a pond. Like hewhoisatpeace says, there are some great ideas in the diy section. It may help you with your build.

keep us posted on your progress

 

[koiguy1969]

tho not neccessary,2000 gph is just fine on an 800 gallon pond if you use a larger capacity filter or divert some of the pumps flow to bypass the filters ,right to the falls (the circulation of water is also important). 2000 gph makes a nice waterfall. and with a smaller fishload, you should have no worries. you just want to allow the water enough hang time in the bio filter for the bacteria to do its thing, theres plans for several DIY filters in the DIY section....stocktanks make a beautiful low profile waterfall filter. and if needed i make and sell waterfall weirs for the outlets (pond returns). a 70 gallon stocktank would serve you well. you just cant have too much filtration.
this link is to a pic of my 70 stock tank filter...https://www.gardenpondforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2216&d=1270229466..
i see your next to the garage also.. you could plumb a filter inside the garage. easy maintainence and less loss of pond area..

 

[hewhoisatpeace]

Koiguy makes some nice looking weirs, and his 70g stock tank idea would fit your pond well.

 

[lauraleellbp]

I'll take a look at those threads you guys mentioned, thanks.

My pond will only be 400 gal, not 800 gal, though.

You think that 2000gph would be too much flow for my pond? That blows my mind- I maintain 10x/hour or more on all my tanks! LOL I find more flow = better filtration = less algae... but I'll keep that in mind since ya'll are definitely the ones with pond expertise, not me. [I started off thinking I was going to run 3000-5000 gph on this pond, so I've already backed down some, but is 2000gph really still too much??] Maybe I'll back down to 1500ish.

Would I still need another leaf basket for an external pump even if I ran the pump behind a skimmer and filter?

Or here's a pool pump I just found on Ebay I was wondering if would work- it has a built-in leaf basket: http://cgi.ebay.com/HAYWARD-POWER-F...472?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e5e2a35d0

This is one I've found that I'm leaning towards right now- the Evolution ES1500 http://cgi.ebay.com/EVOLUTION-ES150...534?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e5d9f3036, though since it's not self-priming it sounds like I'd have to make sure it was either situated below the water line or add on a separate priming device? If so, that makes the PowerFlo above look more attractive, since that's already built in.

 

[lauraleellbp]

In regards to filtration, I really am not worried in the least about biofiltration. Firstly, I'm going to have a light bioload (probably nothing bigger than some Florida Flagfish and mollies) and this pond is going to be HEAVILY planted. I know everyone always say "heavily" planted and then ends up with just a few potted plants- but I have in mind stuffing every plant I can into this pond to the point it resembles one of my tanks, just with plants growing out of the water too (here's my 46gal)

-the only difference being that the plants will all be in planters.

So that really leaves mechanical filtration my biggest concern. I know planted tanks produce TONS of debris. I run oversized canisters on all my tanks and still have to clean them monthly to keep the flow rates up.

Ideally I'd like to run a skimmer and then gravity-feed the skimmer into a big tub-style filter with lots of matala mats and disposable pads, then run the filter to the pump to the waterfall, but I'm concerned that I may not have enough space for both a skimmer and a separate tub filter, plus I don't have much height/depth to work with to make gravity work for me.

I'll look at that stock tank filter idea, but I'm concerned I won't have room for one- I've looked at 55gal barrel-style filters and don't have room for one of those, plus I wouldn't be able to adquately clean one out come time for maintenance.

Unfortunately setting up equipment inside the garage isn't an option- our house is concrete block/stucco and blowing through that for a pond isn't anything I could possibly sell to my husband LOL

 

[koiguy1969]

SORRY.. i dont know why i went tinking 800 gals. i read your post and still went with his (hewhoisatpeace) 800 gals in reply. but if your filter is efficient enough and your bioload is small enough, flow is at your discretion. and if you heavily plant the pond it will use the nutrients that would otherwise feed alge. bio filters create nitrates as a final product. nitrates feed alge as well as the other plants. so enough plants to use the nutrients and block sunlight to the ponds water will effectively control alge as you said!!

 

[koisRus]

I like the location, a pond would be enjoyable there. As far as the pump goes, remember it is easier to reduce flow on a pump that is to big, but real hard to add flow on a pump that is to small. With that said a 2000gph pump is a little big for what you want to do.

 

[lauraleellbp]

I think this is the biggest question I'm trying to wrap my brain around right now- if I were to DIY a gravity-fed filter, what volume of water would need to hold in order to safely sustain a 1500-2000gph pump?

Any feedback on those 2 pumps I linked above?

 

[rdk]

I have a 310 gal pond and my 500 gph pump works my filter just fine. RDK

 

[lauraleellbp]

1.5x/hr turnover? Ack I can barely wrap my brain around it! LOL

But I'm listening to what ya'll are saying.

I've also been reading through a lot of threads in the DIY forum, and struggling to figure out work-arounds given my space constraints. I'm familiar with the 55gal drum-type filters, but I don't have a lot of space to work in, period, given all I have is in that picture and is bordered all around with hard stuff (walls, porch, sidewalk, etc). That stock tank filter would be awesome- but also definitely isn't an option given my pond site. Since this is the front of my house I don't want to have any filter equipment visible, so my only option is to dig down- which means my filter is going to have to be somewhat limited in size due to space constraints (I'm going to have 24" at most between the house wall and the pond). I also won't be able to just open a drain and flush the filter- there won't be any good place for the water to go! Siphoning or pumping water out is an option, but obviously more work... for all those reasons, I'd really rather be able to pull out mats and rinse them in the driveway, which is why I keep leaning towards tub-style filters with matala mats.

But let me let go of all my own ideas and preconceptions and just come out and ask ya'll- if you had these space/size constraints (see the site picture above) and were on a budget- what filter and pump combo would YOU put on this pond?

 

[koisRus]

Here's the things I know for sure:

I'll be digging this pond out by hand, lining it with a 45mil EPDM liner with an underlayment, and a building in a bottom drain (probably a 3" Koi Toilet with a strainer/grate on top). I want a small waterfall in the back right corner, and will probably use one of those biofilter waterfalls (looking at the Laguna and Atlantic ones). The fall won't be tall, though- 12-24" high at most. I plan on using 1.5" to 2" flex tubing for plumbing since I'm working in such a tight space and will have lots of corners to get around. I want to use an external pump, and am thinking around 2000gph would be good turnover for this size pond??

If you are planning on using a waterfall filter, just get one that is large enough to handle the size of the pond you want to build, then you do not need to worry about building one.

Also after you choose the waterfall filter then pick your pump. Roughly 100gph to 150gph, per inch of width of the waterfall filter weir.

 

[lauraleellbp]

OK, that's a great guideline for choosing a pump, thanks! I'm looking at waterfall filters in the 12-15" wide range. So that would put me needing around a 1500-2000 gph pump.

The filtration issue that's been concerning me is handling mechanical filtration prior to the pump. I think the waterfall filter should be enough to handle biofiltration, but since it will be after the pump, I still need something before the pump, don't I? And I really don't see a skimmer basket alone doing the trick since I know I'll be generating lots of plant debris.

 

[koisRus]

I use my skimmer as the before pump filter, it does have a filter pad after the basket.

Maybe others with more experience will chime in and provide more info for you.